Do any of you guys do any house blends of bourbons?

Someone gave me a bottle of Knob Smoked Maple last Christmas that I didn't like at all (cloyingly sweet) that I decided to mix with a cheap and obviously unspectacular bottle of Old Granddad.

I like the blend much better than I liked either of the two in their native form.

Made me wonder if anybody else plays with flavor profiles by creating home blends.

Yes. Frequently. Done a few where a played with different expressions from the same brand. Did a wheater blend with Maker's and Larceny. I've got a blend of five or six ryes marinating currently. I also have a gallon container that I use as an infinity bottle over the course of a year and then bottle the results for friends to try. I don't have any hard and fast rules for it like some guys do, just when I have a bottle that gets down to the last finger or two I pour it in. It's a fun experiment.

I had a small glass of Col. E.H. Taylor last night -- the first Bourbon I've probably had (neat) in several months.
Very nice.

Now -- having said that -- I've taken celebratory shots with the extended family several times during that timespan, and that has been either Knob Creek or Woodford.

But sipping/enjoying the Col. Taylor was nice and relaxing.

Colonel Taylor is a really good bourbon. It used to be my go to gift bottle. It comes in the cool tube, and back in the day it wasn't as well known as some other expressions so I could always find it. Pretty much anyone who knows me in real life who drinks bourbon has gotten a bottle of Col Taylor from me at some point. Unfortunately I don't ever see it any more, though I don't look like I used to. I've got a few bottles of small batch and one single barrel left that I enjoy from time to time.

wilmwolf80 said:

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Yes. Frequently. Done a few where a played with different expressions from the same brand. Did a wheater blend with Maker's and Larceny. I've got a blend of five or six ryes marinating currently. I also have a gallon container that I use as an infinity bottle over the course of a year and then bottle the results for friends to try. I don't have any hard and fast rules for it like some guys do, just when I have a bottle that gets down to the last finger or two I pour it in. It's a fun experiment.

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Nice!

I figured it had to be a thing. It's too easy and fun to mix and experiment for it not to be.

It's a little weird, for most other types of whiskey, blending is a common practice, but when you start adding the word blended to bourbon, a lot of people think of cheap bottom shelf stuff. The reality is, any bourbon that isn't a single barrel is a blend of sorts. Small batch is the phrase that gets used the most, but really that's just a blend of different barrels to get to the flavor profile they want. Even everyday Jim Beam or Jack Daniels is technically a blend, because each barrel has its own unique characteristics, but every bottle of Jim or Jack you buy pretty much tastes the same. That's the result of very skilled tasters that know which barrels and how much to get to what they want. It is really fun to see for yourself the difference it makes. Last year I blended two single barrel Russell's reserves from different warehouses and got a really great result. I'm all about whiskey experiments.

wilmwolf80 said:

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It's a little weird, for most other types of whiskey, blending is a common practice, but when you start adding the word blended to bourbon, a lot of people think of cheap bottom shelf stuff. The reality is, any bourbon that isn't a single barrel is a blend of sorts. Small batch is the phrase that gets used the most, but really that's just a blend of different barrels to get to the flavor profile they want. Even everyday Jim Beam or Jack Daniels is technically a blend, because each barrel has its own unique characteristics, but every bottle of Jim or Jack you buy pretty much tastes the same. That's the result of very skilled tasters that know which barrels and how much to get to what they want. It is really fun to see for yourself the difference it makes. Last year I blended two single barrel Russell's reserves from different warehouses and got a really great result. I'm all about whiskey experiments.

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I see why you love it so much, this is a huge rabbit hole you could go down.

How did you know the two Russell's barrels were from different warehouses?

They were both barrel picks and they come with a hang tag that tells you the warehouse and floor.

1792 Full Proof tonight. Good bourbon, though I'll regret it when I'm picking up the leaves tomorrow .

wilmwolf80 said:

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1792 Full Proof tonight. Good bourbon, though I'll regret it when I'm picking up the leaves tomorrow .

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Dumb question. When I moved permanently to the coast in 2012, I could walk in an ABC Store and buy Blanton's or Booker's every single visit if I wanted to - and it stayed like that for several years... what exactly changed that made them so much harder to find now (and you can add Buffalo Trace to that list as well)?... It's like you have to accidentally walk in the door right after they get a delivery now to find any of those brands...

TheStorm said:

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wilmwolf80 said:

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1792 Full Proof tonight. Good bourbon, though I'll regret it when I'm picking up the leaves tomorrow .

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Dumb question. When I moved permanently to the coast in 2012, I could walk in an ABC Store and buy Blanton's or Booker's every single visit if I wanted to - and it stayed like that for several years... what exactly changed that made them so much harder to find now (and you can add Buffalo Trace to that list as well)?... It's like you have to accidentally walk in the door right after they get a delivery now to find any of those brands...

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The short answer is that the popularity of bourbon has increased exponentially over the last decade. With social media and dedicated websites to bourbon, information is easier to find than ever, and newer bourbon drinkers are drawn to the boutique expensive stuff because they figure it must be good. Whiskey awards, articles in big publications, product placement in TV and movies all drives the hype up.

Now in control states like NC you have dedicated bourbon hunters who flip bottles for a living, because you can buy it at retail here and immediately sell it for 3,5,10 times what you paid for it. It's no accident the they are there right after it gets delivered, they know when the trucks run. The article I posted on the previous page details how the secondary market is affecting bourbon availability at retail.

There is also an issue with supply. Lots of bourbon makers got burned in the 70s and 80s when vodka became the most popular spirit. Many of them scaled back production, and were skeptical of increasing production when bourbon started to regain popularity in the late 90s early 00s. Now that the resurgence has been sustained they are making more, but when you are dealing with a product that takes years to be ready, it's hard to ramp that up quickly to meet demand. Making whiskey is a speculative investment like the stock market, you have to gamble that there will be a demand in 4-6 years for the product that you are making today. All the big producers have been increasing production for the last decade, but the popularity of bourbon has increased at a rate greater than their production, so they are still behind. The only way it likely changes is a decline in popularity like five decades ago as people's tastes change. I don't know if we'll live to see that though.

EH Taylor is probably one of my favorite bourbons. I have a friend which is currently holding a couple bottles of EH Taylor Rye which he was able to pick up in Montana for a reasonable price.

Lots of good bourbon is currently showing up in the western states and sounds to be a little easier to find. Unfortunately not doing a ski trip this year as I can't justify the travel cost for no guaranteed lift ticket.

One of my favorite things is just checking out the selections in other states. It's not even so much that you find rare stuff, just different from what we get in NC. Unfortunately, other than one trip to SC, I haven't had any of those trips this year either.

A small glass of Basil Hayden's this evening.

Ever had the OF Birthday Wilmwolf? Myself and a friend are intrigued by it but we refuse to pay $500+ for it. I was in SC and Ga this past week and was able to get some good finds at a decent price. Interesting how how different stores charge for the same bottle. One store had a bottle of Henry McKenna 10 year for $43 in SC and in Ga it was $119.

I've never had the birthday. I have a couple of friends who have bottles, but they have not opened them yet. I've read mixed things on it, but that's true for most every bourbon. I definitely would not pay $500 for it, but that goes for pretty much anything. With a lot of leg work, it is attainable in NC, but I'm just not personally willing to put in that work any more.

Pricing is always interesting to see. With McKenna BIB specifically, it won that whiskey of the year award and then there were rumors of a shortage, which created a run on it. Lots of store owners use that hype to justify pricing it near secondary prices, and now that the hype has died down and there isn't a production shortage, they still have it at the higher price.

It's funny, when I went to Heaven Hill in 2017, the tasting guide asked who had tried McKenna BIB before, and I was the only person in the room that raised my hand. He said he thought it was the hidden gem of their lineup, and I agreed because at that time it was around $40 for a 10 year old, bottled in bond product. Then it wins the award in 2019 and it was no longer a hidden gem and all of a sudden idiots are paying three times retail for it on the secondary markets. That's why I think those awards are so dumb. Fred Minnick or Jim Murray says something is good so thousands of people go buy it. Everyone's tastes are different, and just because some guy with a platform says something is the best, doesn't mean it is.

Yeah, but it's expensive so it has to taste great

I had the 2019 old forester birthday bourbon. I was impressed but not much more than retail. I do find it to be a unique bourbon bottle.

Honestly some of the high dollar bourbons have been my least favorite. I had George T Stagg that was like 145 or similar number that was unbearable.

It's interesting. I'm finding that same thing. Some of my favorite sippers are in the $45 category, if not less. Really enjoying my Buffalo Trace, turkey 101, and elijah Craig bottles that were like $25. Other than the hunt, the sport, gifting, and the interest in trying new things, I'm not finding great reasons to spend more than that for really enjoyable sipping and great OF mixers.

Me too Mormad. I have gone the opposite direction as most and trying to find quality lower shelf bourbons. JTS Brown, Old Tub, Very Old Barton, and Early Times BIB are just a few that make a nice OF. Don't get me wrong, I will spring for the more expensive bottles when available. I love taking cheapo to a party and watch my crusty lil friends turn their nose up at such a cheap bottle. Jokes on them!

Yup. There are still a lot of good cheap bourbons out there. There aren't as many as there used to be, and they aren't as cheap as they used to be, but they are out there. Like I said on one of the other pages, I always encourage new bourbon drinkers to start on the bottom shelf and work their way up. What if a $12 or $20 bottle is your favorite bourbon and you never know it because you spend all the time chasing high priced stuff. I've consumed enough bourbon to float a battleship, there's not a whole lot of difference between Ancient Age and Blanton's. There really isn't, but that's a hard thing for people to accept. Tasting stuff blind will change your mind about a lot of bourbon. When you can't see the label or the price tag or the age or the proof, you aren't being subconsciously manipulated to like something before you even sip it.

wilmwolf80 said:

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Yup. There are still a lot of good cheap bourbons out there. There aren't as many as there used to be, and they aren't as cheap as they used to be, but they are out there. Like I said on one of the other pages, I always encourage new bourbon drinkers to start on the bottom shelf and work their way up. What if a $12 or $20 bottle is your favorite bourbon and you never know it because you spend all the time chasing high priced stuff. I've consumed enough bourbon to float a battleship, there's not a whole lot of difference between Ancient Age and Blanton's. There really isn't, but that's a hard thing for people to accept. Tasting stuff blind will change your mind about a lot of bourbon. When you can't see the label or the price tag or the age or the proof, you aren't being subconsciously manipulated to like something before you even sip it.

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Yep, same with wine. There are very, very few people on the planet that can reliably distinguish between qualities/price points of wine.

If anything, some of the cheaper bottles of wine are blends made for a very broad target audience and they do a good job with them. Lots of jammy $12 blends out there that are quite tasty and broadly appealing for sipping.

It's not what you'd pair with a great delmonico but they have their place.

Having some New Riff tonight. It's one of the few newer, young bourbons that are actually pretty good. Them and Woodinville are pretty much the only "craft" type bourbons I've liked enough to buy again as far as companies making their own bourbon and not sourcing from somewhere.

wilmwolf80 said:

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Having some New Riff tonight. It's one of the few newer, young bourbons that are actually pretty good. Them and Woodinville are pretty much the only "craft" type bourbons I've liked enough to buy again as far as companies making their own bourbon and not sourcing from somewhere.

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How young is 'young'?

Both of those are 4-5 currently.

Interesting. Bourbon making is a patient businessman's game for sure.

What's the most aged bourbon you've ever tried?

Elijah Craig 23

wilmwolf80 said:

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Elijah Craig 23

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After being in a barrel for 23 years was it woody with some woody notes and also a hint of woody?

I've often wondered if there's an inflection point past which flavor doesn't improve or maybe even gets less complex.

There absolutely is a point when it just becomes oak whiskey and not bourbon. Normally that is around 15 years. In order to have a drinkable bourbon past that, they really have to be careful with how they store it. Generally things intended to be aged that long need to be low in the rick house in a cold area. Otherwise you'd lose it all to evaporation. They have charts for the Buffalo Trace antique collection that show bottle yields, and some of the older products you're looking at 30-50 bottles from a barrel that normally yields 150-200. The Elijah Craig 23 was definitely heavy on the oak, but not in an unpleasant way. The oak tannins always make my lips tingle. I had a bottle of Forged Oak, which is from Orphan Barrel and was 15 years old, and it was almost undrinkable. Just oak juice and burn. There's definitely a balance there.

I have a bottle of EC 23. It is an Oak bomb! I tend to enjoy it better with a good cigar. I prefer EC 18 though. Generally, I like all EC products. The Toasted EC was really good but still not better than any of the Michter's Toasted series.

Going to try to put a dent in some bottles during the Holidays so I can try some of my unopened ones.

I prefer the 18. It's one of my favorites, probably the bottle I look for most this time of year. My problem is that I have too many open bottles. When I get something I have to try it, and then I move on to the next thing, so every now and then I have to make a concerted effort to drink some stuff down and thin the herd.

wilmwolf80 said:

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I prefer the 18. It's one of my favorites, probably the bottle I look for most this time of year. My problem is that I have too many open bottles. When I get something I have to try it, and then I move on to the next thing, so every now and then I have to make a concerted effort to drink some stuff down and thin the herd.

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I'm the exact same way

I have the same problem. I just bought a beach house and moved half of my bottles there. Problem solved!

SexualChocolate said:

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I have the same problem. I just bought a beach house and moved half of my bottles there. Problem solved!

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Nothing like a good early morning humble-brag.

Did you move them down to your beach house in your Ferrari?

I kid, I kid. I fantasize about having a place at the coast, hope I can make it happen at some point! Which beach you at?

Yes, that did come across wrong. Haha. I'm down there with the Trump supporters in Emerald Isle. Lord help me.