I would bet that much of his work history is brought into it if they need to show evidence of misconduct or disregard for life for it to be 3rd degree. I thought I read that he has had a significant number of incidents in the past. Sort of surprising that he would be an officer they entrust to train new recruits.

statefan91 said:

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I would bet that much of his work history is brought into it if they need to show evidence of misconduct or disregard for life for it to be 3rd degree. I thought I read that he has had a significant number of incidents in the past. Sort of surprising that he would be an officer they entrust to train new recruits.

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Good point. Completely different than not allowing past sexual history of a sex assault victim as evidence of a pattern of risky behavior.

I would think all of the past complaints against him would be fully admissible.

I think I heard 12 incidents. Absolutely will and should be used. I also have no idea how he was a training officer.

Tootie4Pack said:

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Yes, I expect the union to step up and try to do everything they can for their clients. They may have been terminated without due process. In the rush to try to calm the crowds of people, they may have violated their labor agreement. As screwed up as that department and the DA look based on past decisions, this may have happened.

Whatever, the technicalities are that may have violated their labor agreement, these (4) officers are in some serious trouble. I think we all agree with that. And they are allowed due process under the law, despite the fact that George Floyd was not given the same due process.

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Don't most of these contracts have arbitration clauses and don't the cities usually settle based on a cost to defend plus cost to lose basis?

Minneapolis is not going to take this officer back, no matter how much it costs the City. I don't know how you politically tell the public something like "we have to take him back otherwise it will cost us a couple of million dollars".

It also just struck me that if the Feds levy a civil rights charge against the officers, that the City is off the hook with the Union unless the contract with the Union includes the defense of all officers from Federal crimes. I don't know how a contract drawn that way is enforceable.

Lumber, in most cases , the insurance company that covers the PD will take over the case and they negotiate any settlement. I know this from my elected official experience. However , Minneapolis is a whole lot bigger town that where I live, and having a unionized PD may very well have language that shifts or designates the liability responsibility. These insurance companies settle with these liability cases every day. This case, being so visual to the entire world, will certainly be interesting to follow. I expect there will be multiple law suits against all 4 officers, the City of Minneapolis, the Police Chief, the Manager, the City Council..,any person or body that can be sued will be sued.

Animals. This won't flood the news though.

Edit. This is what happened to start it.

Agree - officer should be relieved of his duties and the person that pushed him should be arrested. Dumbasses on both side.

Cant believe there are grown people who align their politics with these little *******s.... Man Bun Barbie and his merry men. Harassing and verbally abusing an officer, then assaulting an officer is not a protest children.

packgrad said:

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Animals. This won't flood the news though.

Edit. This is what happened to start it.

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Tootie4Pack said:

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Lumber, in most cases , the insurance company that covers the PD will take over the case and they negotiate any settlement. I know this from my elected official experience. However , Minneapolis is a whole lot bigger town that where I live, and having a unionized PD may very well have language that shifts or designates the liability responsibility. These insurance companies settle with these liability cases every day. This case, being so visual to the entire world, will certainly be interesting to follow. I expect there will be multiple law suits against all 4 officers, the City of Minneapolis, the Police Chief, the Manager, the City Council..,any person or body that can be sued will be sued.

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Experience in NC or in a Dillon's Rule State makes it tough to figure out union states and home rule cities. Perhaps "defunding" the police department and then reconstitution something else is a necessary predicate to breaking the collective bargaining agreement. Most of the media people are so ill informed you know less after they speak.

statefan91 said:

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Agree - officer should be relieved of his duties and the person that pushed him should be arrested. Dumbasses on both side.

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Surely you're just trolling? Or are you one of the liberals that think it's OK to attack the police?

lumberpack5 said:

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packgrad said:

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statefan91 said:

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Agree - officer should be relieved of his duties and the person that pushed him should be arrested. Dumbasses on both side.

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Surely you're just trolling? Or are you one of the liberals that think it's OK to attack the police?

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That officer just hurt the PD's public image. That public image is key to their safety as much as their guns.

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No he didn't. This is exactly why there are police unions.

lumberpack5 said:

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packgrad said:

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lumberpack5 said:

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packgrad said:

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statefan91 said:

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Agree - officer should be relieved of his duties and the person that pushed him should be arrested. Dumbasses on both side.

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Surely you're just trolling? Or are you one of the liberals that think it's OK to attack the police?

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That officer just hurt the PD's public image. That public image is key to their safety as much as their guns.

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No he didn't. This is exactly why there are police unions.

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This dumbass has no union, he works for the City Manager and the City Manager alone.

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Reading is fundamental smart guy.

lumberpack5 said:

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packgrad said:

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lumberpack5 said:

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packgrad said:

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lumberpack5 said:

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packgrad said:

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statefan91 said:

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Agree - officer should be relieved of his duties and the person that pushed him should be arrested. Dumbasses on both side.

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Surely you're just trolling? Or are you one of the liberals that think it's OK to attack the police?

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That officer just hurt the PD's public image. That public image is key to their safety as much as their guns.

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No he didn't. This is exactly why there are police unions.

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This dumbass has no union, he works for the City Manager and the City Manager alone.

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Reading is fundamental smart guy.

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There are no police unions in NC with contracts with a city. No collective bargaining. Read NC law smart guy

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You're clearly not smart enough to understand a point. Keep supporting domestic terrorists. Looks good on you.

lumberpack5 said:

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You are clearly not smart enough to be able to differentiate between a terrorist and a dumbass. This is why people like you don't need a gun and a badge.

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Too bad for you the government disagrees about the gun. No way I could wear a badge though because I definitely couldn't tolerate this.

Heh! Things are different when you're protesting at a Whole Foods with only like minded bros.

I wonder what the masked dude said to the captain to set him off? It looked like man bun was the one asking why he was touching people and calling him bro.

Who was the guy in the green shirt? Police officer too? He wasn't playing around. He was throwing them around like they were 110 pound weaklings. Oh wait, they were.

Anyway, white people. SMDH

One of the "protesters" literally pushed him. That's the one he went after.

lumberpack5 said:

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packgrad said:

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lumberpack5 said:

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You are clearly not smart enough to be able to differentiate between a terrorist and a dumbass. This is why people like you don't need a gun and a badge.

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Too bad for you the government disagrees about the gun. No way I could wear a badge though because I definitely couldn't tolerate this.

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Too bad for me? Why are you going to shoot me over the internet? Hotheads who can't de-escalate a situation are a liability on a police force. I guess you are just a threat to your next door neighbors?

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My god, you're not the sharpest tack. Going to ignore. Buh bye.

packgrad said:

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statefan91 said:

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Agree - officer should be relieved of his duties and the person that pushed him should be arrested. Dumbasses on both side.

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Surely you're just trolling? Or are you one of the liberals that think it's OK to attack the police?

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No, not trolling (seriously). I think the Officer was acting completely out of line, obviously egging protesters on to try to get a rise / create an incident. He is clearly there to create a scene and that's fine if that's his choice and his leadership approves of his actions, but it's also clearly not working to make any kind of inroads whatsoever with protesters.

To that point, the idiots that were harassing him in the video you posted previously, and the one that pushed him, are also acting in bad faith. The one that pushed him should be arrested. I don't see it as black and white, I think it's easy to see that both parties were acting without any interest in communicating with each other in peaceful manner.

statefan91 said:

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packgrad said:

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statefan91 said:

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Agree - officer should be relieved of his duties and the person that pushed him should be arrested. Dumbasses on both side.

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Surely you're just trolling? Or are you one of the liberals that think it's OK to attack the police?

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No, not trolling (seriously). I think the Officer was acting completely out of line, obviously egging protesters on to try to get a rise / create an incident. He is clearly there to create a scene and that's fine if that's his choice and his leadership approves of his actions, but it's also clearly not working to make any kind of inroads whatsoever with protesters.

To that point, the idiots that were harassing him in the video you posted previously, and the one that pushed him, are also acting in bad faith. The one that pushed him should be arrested. I don't see it as black and white, I think it's easy to see that both parties were acting without any interest in communicating with each other in peaceful manner.

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How can you see that from the 2 videos above? Or am I missing something

There is another video in the thread of the cop taunting the crowd. Giving the "I can't hear you" hand gesture. Telling them to get louder.

metcalfmafia said:

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There is another video in the thread of the cop taunting the crowd. Giving the "I can't hear you" hand gesture. Telling them to get louder.

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I'm not saying that he deserved to get pushed for egging them on. However, he is a police officer and I assume he has gone through significant training on de-escalation techniques, working with the community, working with crowds, etc. Instead of utilizing those he took the route of egging them on.

metcalfmafia said:

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There is another video in the thread of the cop taunting the crowd. Giving the "I can't hear you" hand gesture. Telling them to get louder.

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Ah ok thanks. Figured I had to be missing something

statefan91 said:

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metcalfmafia said:

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There is another video in the thread of the cop taunting the crowd. Giving the "I can't hear you" hand gesture. Telling them to get louder.

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I'm not saying that he deserved to get pushed for egging them on. However, he is a police officer and I assume he has gone through significant training on de-escalation techniques, working with the community, working with crowds, etc. Instead of utilizing those he took the route of egging them on.

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There's exactly 1 respectable adult in these videos and thats the guy with the mask, gray/green shirt and dark shorts protecting the officer. That guy deserves kudos. Regardless of the hand gestures from the cop, not one of those snowflakes should get away with laying their hands on a police officer. Good for that guy for being the only voice of reason there.

I completely agree that the Officer shouldn't have been pushed, and good for the person that was protecting him from the crowd.

statefan91 said:

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metcalfmafia said:

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There is another video in the thread of the cop taunting the crowd. Giving the "I can't hear you" hand gesture. Telling them to get louder.

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I'm not saying that he deserved to get pushed for egging them on. However, he is a police officer and I assume he has gone through significant training on de-escalation techniques, working with the community, working with crowds, etc. Instead of utilizing those he took the route of egging them on.

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De-escalation training is not as common or comprehensive as you would think. He definitely didn't de-escalate.

"Not egging them on" is just common sense, and he didn't do that either.

statefan91 said:

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metcalfmafia said:

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There is another video in the thread of the cop taunting the crowd. Giving the "I can't hear you" hand gesture. Telling them to get louder.

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I'm not saying that he deserved to get pushed for egging them on. However, he is a police officer and I assume he has gone through significant training on de-escalation techniques, working with the community, working with crowds, etc. Instead of utilizing those he took the route of egging them on.

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So that's what you think he should be relieved of his duties for? Yes, this is exactly why there are police unions.

What do you think Officers should be relieved of their duties for?

Not that.