I get a lot of what you're saying but the product on track has been very good. Days of second place being multiple laps down are over. This is just my opinion but I think a lot of the downhill has a lot to do with changing views, for one how many teens love working on their own cars? Heck, how many even know how to change their own tires? For me it has more to do with shifting interest in teens/people. Lastly, people don't want to admit this but I believe some of the growth was a fad. Just some of my opinions.

Call me one that continues to watch. Yes, I think the product has gone down hill; however, I still watch it. Probably, my southern roots...

That said, I started watching F1, in the 70's (albeit, not on TV much) and continue to watch it today. At one point, Nascar was my favorite; now, its starting to get close...

F1 is really cutting into the motorsports fanbase, here in the States. If Andretti gets a team, and with the new US born driver, things are a changing.

ncsupack1 said:

---

I get a lot of what you're saying but the product on track has been very good. Days of second place being multiple laps down are over. This is just my opinion but I think a lot of the downhill has a lot to do with changing views, for one how many teens love working on their own cars? Heck, how many even know how to change their own tires? For me it has more to do with shifting interest in teens/people. Lastly, people don't want to admit this but I believe some of the growth was a fad. Just some of my opinions.

---

I think it has more to do with the marketing and the target demographics moving from their roots to what they view as a more socially diverse crowd.

Just my two cents... had they kept races in the South, a few in the Midwest and a few rotations out West all would have been fine.

When you have the same race at the same track only in different states the boredom is too much to withstand.

How many tracks have the same configurations? Running 400 laps in a line for 3 hours is mundane even for the most diehard fan. They lost fans' interest during that 5-6 year span and we found out there are more things to do on Sunday afternoons.

Add in all the politically correct nonsense they seem to be shoving down our throats and they have took a billion dollar sport and made it scramble for sponsors, network attention and most of all, fans.

ncsupack1 said:

---

BBW12OG said:

---

ncsupack1 said:

---

I get a lot of what you're saying but the product on track has been very good. Days of second place being multiple laps down are over. This is just my opinion but I think a lot of the downhill has a lot to do with changing views, for one how many teens love working on their own cars? Heck, how many even know how to change their own tires? For me it has more to do with shifting interest in teens/people. Lastly, people don't want to admit this but I believe some of the growth was a fad. Just some of my opinions.

---

I think it has more to do with the marketing and the target demographics moving from their roots to what they view as a more socially diverse crowd.

Just my two cents... had they kept races in the South, a few in the Midwest and a few rotations out West all would have been fine.

When you have the same race at the same track only in different states the boredom is too much to withstand.

How many tracks have the same configurations? Running 400 laps in a line for 3 hours is mundane even for the most diehard fan. They lost fans' interest during that 5-6 year span and we found out there are more things to do on Sunday afternoons.

Add in all the politically correct nonsense they seem to be shoving down our throats and they have took a billion dollar sport and made it scramble for sponsors, network attention and most of all, fans.

---

We will have to agree to disagree on a few of those points. As for the woke thing, heck they are the least of sports that do that. I can't even watch a football, basketball, or really any other league game without either seeing it on court/end zone or having said station beating the drum on some issue. The tracks still pray before the race and do a pretty good job of honoring our fallen. Just my two cents. It is a fantastic thing to talk about for sure, why's and ifs.

---

Praying before the race and honoring the Military is awesome. Agree with the other sports as well.

Bubba Wallace, the "noose" and the FBI launching an all hands on deck investigation into a hate crime that everyone knew full well was BS will forever be a stain on NASCAR and the clowns that pushed it.

Wallace being the main one.

Little change up from the Sunday mess...

does anyone know whatever happened to the "hat man" ? You older guys will know who I'm taking about. Just like Harold Kinder, he was always there at the end.

Steve Williams said:

---

Sunday night was awful. Probably the worst NASCAR event I've seen, maybe ever.

---

the Indy race in 2008 where there were tire issues was a mess too

.@ConorDaly22 is attempting the Daytona 500 with @TMTRacing50.

💬@FloydMayweather: "Conor is like a hungry fighter and my kind of guy. I sure wouldn’t bet against him." pic.twitter.com/RpW9rx8YBb

— Adam Stern (@A_S12) February 7, 2023

.@FoxTV earned a 2.01 rating and 3.647 million viewers for Sunday's second edition of the Busch Light Clash @LAColiseum, down 15% from the inaugural edition which drew a 2.32 rating and 4.283 million.

🔲The race was second most watched sports event of the weekend after Pro Bowl. pic.twitter.com/Ufa7krKeZ3

— Adam Stern (@A_S12) February 7, 2023

Ratings, viewership, decline for second edition of NASCAR's "Clash" at the LA Coliseum. Still the largest NASCAR audience since last year's Coca-Cola 600: https://t.co/vCNOGRNXl4

— Sports Media Watch (@paulsen_smw) February 7, 2023

Growing up in eastern NC, my family and friends were all die hard NASCAR fans. We watched it every week and often times we would be camping at the tracks waiting for Sunday to come. We would drag the ol camper to Rockingham, Darlington, Charlotte or Daytona and camp for 5 to 6 days, usually a group of 5 to 6 campers/motorhomes. The best times were camping for the Rockingham races, we stayed right across the track and had a blast. We would ride scooters around the outside of the track during the night, no one cared. Of course, the Rockingham races ended in 04/05 and we quit going to Charlotte and the other races not many years after that. The sport was changing and just wasn't the same.

About that same time, I started going to some local short tracks to see what it was all about...the good ol Friday and Saturday night races. If you've not been to any, you should give it a go. Those folks are still racing for the right reasons and still have the passion. There are many divisions to watch, with the smaller cars sometimes putting on the best racing.

The late model racing in this area is some of the best racing you will see. Yes there are teams that have an unlimited supply of money to throw at them but the close quarter racing is fun to watch. They have to conserve tires, they have to know when to give it a little more and pass folks, they beat and bang, they have to strategize. You get to see them all over the Carolinas and Virginia, running both historic and newer tracks like Hickory, Southern National, South Boston, New River Speedway and just this past year North Wilkesboro. And if you want a true experience like no other, go to Martinsville when the late models run there. They have the ValleyStar 300 each year, usually in late September. You won't be disappointed. Those heat races are a blast, they are racing to make the biggest race of the year for them.

I've found myself watching more and more of the Xfinity and truck series races over the last couple of years, moreso than the Cup series. Some of the local late model drivers get an opportunity to race a few races in the trucks or Xfinity cars and they are giving it their best. Josh Berry has done an awesome job the past few years.

And for those that didn't already know, Dale. Jr, Jeff Burton, Kevin Harvick and Justin Marks just bought the Cars Tour series from Jack McNeely. That is the late model touring series that runs around the Carolinas and Virginia. Those guys have seen the reemergence of that series and late model racing in general and their support is appreciated throughout the grassroots community.

Anyways, give it a try if you haven't already.

NASCAR's 2023 season will be a year of change as Next Gen evolves, generational shift looms over grid

https://www.espn.com/racing/story/_/id/35607778

ge_traveler said:

---

Growing up in eastern NC, my family and friends were all die hard NASCAR fans. We watched it every week and often times we would be camping at the tracks waiting for Sunday to come. We would drag the ol camper to Rockingham, Darlington, Charlotte or Daytona and camp for 5 to 6 days, usually a group of 5 to 6 campers/motorhomes. The best times were camping for the Rockingham races, we stayed right across the track and had a blast. We would ride scooters around the outside of the track during the night, no one cared. Of course, the Rockingham races ended in 04/05 and we quit going to Charlotte and the other races not many years after that. The sport was changing and just wasn't the same.

About that same time, I started going to some local short tracks to see what it was all about...the good ol Friday and Saturday night races. If you've not been to any, you should give it a go. Those folks are still racing for the right reasons and still have the passion. There are many divisions to watch, with the smaller cars sometimes putting on the best racing.

The late model racing in this area is some of the best racing you will see. Yes there are teams that have an unlimited supply of money to throw at them but the close quarter racing is fun to watch. They have to conserve tires, they have to know when to give it a little more and pass folks, they beat and bang, they have to strategize. You get to see them all over the Carolinas and Virginia, running both historic and newer tracks like Hickory, Southern National, South Boston, New River Speedway and just this past year North Wilkesboro. And if you want a true experience like no other, go to Martinsville when the late models run there. They have the ValleyStar 300 each year, usually in late September. You won't be disappointed. Those heat races are a blast, they are racing to make the biggest race of the year for them.

I've found myself watching more and more of the Xfinity and truck series races over the last couple of years, moreso than the Cup series. Some of the local late model drivers get an opportunity to race a few races in the trucks or Xfinity cars and they are giving it their best. Josh Berry has done an awesome job the past few years.

And for those that didn't already know, Dale. Jr, Jeff Burton, Kevin Harvick and Justin Marks just bought the Cars Tour series from Jack McNeely. That is the late model touring series that runs around the Carolinas and Virginia. Those guys have seen the reemergence of that series and late model racing in general and their support is appreciated throughout the grassroots community.

Anyways, give it a try if you haven't already.

---

I love the local track. Also, for those in the Raleigh/Garner area, Wake County Speedway has really made improvements. We go have a great time. Go check it out.

Wolfer79 said:

---

.@FoxTV earned a 2.01 rating and 3.647 million viewers for Sunday's second edition of the Busch Light Clash @LAColiseum, down 15% from the inaugural edition which drew a 2.32 rating and 4.283 million.

🔲The race was second most watched sports event of the weekend after Pro Bowl. pic.twitter.com/Ufa7krKeZ3

— Adam Stern (@A_S12) February 7, 2023

---

Now I'd love to see the numbers of how many people found it unwatchable and turned it off...

ncsupack1 said:

---

ge_traveler said:

---

Growing up in eastern NC, my family and friends were all die hard NASCAR fans. We watched it every week and often times we would be camping at the tracks waiting for Sunday to come. We would drag the ol camper to Rockingham, Darlington, Charlotte or Daytona and camp for 5 to 6 days, usually a group of 5 to 6 campers/motorhomes. The best times were camping for the Rockingham races, we stayed right across the track and had a blast. We would ride scooters around the outside of the track during the night, no one cared. Of course, the Rockingham races ended in 04/05 and we quit going to Charlotte and the other races not many years after that. The sport was changing and just wasn't the same.

About that same time, I started going to some local short tracks to see what it was all about...the good ol Friday and Saturday night races. If you've not been to any, you should give it a go. Those folks are still racing for the right reasons and still have the passion. There are many divisions to watch, with the smaller cars sometimes putting on the best racing.

The late model racing in this area is some of the best racing you will see. Yes there are teams that have an unlimited supply of money to throw at them but the close quarter racing is fun to watch. They have to conserve tires, they have to know when to give it a little more and pass folks, they beat and bang, they have to strategize. You get to see them all over the Carolinas and Virginia, running both historic and newer tracks like Hickory, Southern National, South Boston, New River Speedway and just this past year North Wilkesboro. And if you want a true experience like no other, go to Martinsville when the late models run there. They have the ValleyStar 300 each year, usually in late September. You won't be disappointed. Those heat races are a blast, they are racing to make the biggest race of the year for them.

I've found myself watching more and more of the Xfinity and truck series races over the last couple of years, moreso than the Cup series. Some of the local late model drivers get an opportunity to race a few races in the trucks or Xfinity cars and they are giving it their best. Josh Berry has done an awesome job the past few years.

And for those that didn't already know, Dale. Jr, Jeff Burton, Kevin Harvick and Justin Marks just bought the Cars Tour series from Jack McNeely. That is the late model touring series that runs around the Carolinas and Virginia. Those guys have seen the reemergence of that series and late model racing in general and their support is appreciated throughout the grassroots community.

Anyways, give it a try if you haven't already.

---

I love the local track. Also, for those in the Raleigh/Garner area, Wake County Speedway has really made improvements. We go have a great time. Go check it out.

---

We go to Wake County as well. Great track!

I live near Carteret County Speedway but we travel to Wake County, Caraway, Ace, Orange County, Hickory, Goodyear, Southern National, Florence, Dillon, North Wilkesboro. Martinsville and others. Plenty out there for all to enjoy.

Caraway Speedway kicks major ass.... If you haven't ever been it's reminiscent of the old Rock and N Wilksboro days.... smaller scale but same atmosphere.

I went to both Spring and Fall races in Rockingham religiously from 87-95 or 96.... Cold as hell in February in the morning and sometimes hot as hell by midrace.

I believe at one point it was the second longest race of the year after the 600 and they cut it 100 laps??? I could be misremembering but I recall several races where the day seemed like it was never going to end.

If the group that bought that series would put races at the old NASCAR tracks and some local tracks I'd be willing to say there is a hearty enough appetite that they could make some serious inroads on taking the sport back from the clown show that it has evolved into.

Are they still racing at Orange County Speedway? Saw the Burton bro's race back before they went to NASCAR

ncsupack1 said:

---

BBW12OG said:

---

ncsupack1 said:

---

I get a lot of what you're saying but the product on track has been very good. Days of second place being multiple laps down are over. This is just my opinion but I think a lot of the downhill has a lot to do with changing views, for one how many teens love working on their own cars? Heck, how many even know how to change their own tires? For me it has more to do with shifting interest in teens/people. Lastly, people don't want to admit this but I believe some of the growth was a fad. Just some of my opinions.

---

I think it has more to do with the marketing and the target demographics moving from their roots to what they view as a more socially diverse crowd.

Just my two cents... had they kept races in the South, a few in the Midwest and a few rotations out West all would have been fine.

When you have the same race at the same track only in different states the boredom is too much to withstand.

How many tracks have the same configurations? Running 400 laps in a line for 3 hours is mundane even for the most diehard fan. They lost fans' interest during that 5-6 year span and we found out there are more things to do on Sunday afternoons.

Add in all the politically correct nonsense they seem to be shoving down our throats and they have took a billion dollar sport and made it scramble for sponsors, network attention and most of all, fans.

---

We will have to agree to disagree on a few of those points. As for the woke thing, heck they are the least of sports that do that. I can't even watch a football, basketball, or really any other league game without either seeing it on court/end zone or having said station beating the drum on some issue. The tracks still pray before the race and do a pretty good job of honoring our fallen. Just my two cents. It is a fantastic thing to talk about for sure, why's and ifs.

---

LOL yeah NASCAR is not woke. Can't read what the guy posted, but I'm guessing he's upset about Bubba Wallace.
Probably upset NASCAR has restricted rebel flags from being flown at the race tracks any more.

My sons grew up as NASCAR fans because I was. Two of them watched the race the other night (i didn't even know it was on) --- but they are more interested in, and plugged into, the F1 happenings.

ETA: When i first became a fan, it was all about liking driver -- one who resonated. I think NASCAR became so corporate really impacted that, because the drivers had no personality. One is like another (I do think Chastain breaks that mold). I think the social media presence / documentary really helped F1 with that. Not only with drivers, but the key team members.
In NASCAR, even the drivers we "want" to like --- as a former Bill Elliott fan I want to like Chase -- are not as relateable today as the generations before them

NASCAR has been corporate since the 70's. STP (Petty) Purolator (Wood Brothers) Mountain Dew (Junior Johnson. the days of being sponsored by Plymouth by Petty are long gone. Nothing Woke about it. Remember Winston being the series sponsor? Everything was geared around cigarette's and tobacco. $$ fuels every sport. NFL, NBA, CFB and CBB. NASCAR is no different

Glasswolf said:

---

NASCAR has been corporate since the 70's. STP (Petty) Purolator (Wood Brothers) Mountain Dew (Junior Johnson. the days of being sponsored by Plymouth by Petty are long gone. Nothing Woke about it. Remember Winston being the series sponsor? Everything was geared around cigarette's and tobacco. $$ fuels every sport. NFL, NBA, CFB and CBB. NASCAR is no different

---

Agree Glass... NASCAR has bowed down to the "woke" culture and the almighty dollar.

All the inclusiveness in the world won't save this sinking ship.

The noose hoax was the final nail in the coffin and selling out to ESPN who promptly ditched them at the first opportunity after they milked it for all they could.

Packchem91 said:

---

ncsupack1 said:

---

BBW12OG said:

---

ncsupack1 said:

---

I get a lot of what you're saying but the product on track has been very good. Days of second place being multiple laps down are over. This is just my opinion but I think a lot of the downhill has a lot to do with changing views, for one how many teens love working on their own cars? Heck, how many even know how to change their own tires? For me it has more to do with shifting interest in teens/people. Lastly, people don't want to admit this but I believe some of the growth was a fad. Just some of my opinions.

---

I think it has more to do with the marketing and the target demographics moving from their roots to what they view as a more socially diverse crowd.

Just my two cents... had they kept races in the South, a few in the Midwest and a few rotations out West all would have been fine.

When you have the same race at the same track only in different states the boredom is too much to withstand.

How many tracks have the same configurations? Running 400 laps in a line for 3 hours is mundane even for the most diehard fan. They lost fans' interest during that 5-6 year span and we found out there are more things to do on Sunday afternoons.

Add in all the politically correct nonsense they seem to be shoving down our throats and they have took a billion dollar sport and made it scramble for sponsors, network attention and most of all, fans.

---

We will have to agree to disagree on a few of those points. As for the woke thing, heck they are the least of sports that do that. I can't even watch a football, basketball, or really any other league game without either seeing it on court/end zone or having said station beating the drum on some issue. The tracks still pray before the race and do a pretty good job of honoring our fallen. Just my two cents. It is a fantastic thing to talk about for sure, why's and ifs.

---

LOL yeah NASCAR is not woke. Can't read what the guy posted, but I'm guessing he's upset about Bubba Wallace.
Probably upset NASCAR has restricted rebel flags from being flown at the race tracks any more.

My sons grew up as NASCAR fans because I was. Two of them watched the race the other night (i didn't even know it was on) --- but they are more interested in, and plugged into, the F1 happenings.

ETA: When i first became a fan, it was all about liking driver -- one who resonated. I think NASCAR became so corporate really impacted that, because the drivers had no personality. One is like another (I do think Chastain breaks that mold). I think the social media presence / documentary really helped F1 with that. Not only with drivers, but the key team members.
In NASCAR, even the drivers we "want" to like --- as a former Bill Elliott fan I want to like Chase -- are not as relateable today as the generations before them

---

The woke one has spoken! BTW, you can read BBW's post because it's just above the post you responded to…

Glasswolf said:

---

Are they still racing at Orange County Speedway? Saw the Burton bro's race back before they went to NASCAR

---

Yep, they are still running there. Still a good track.

caryking said:

---

Packchem91 said:

---

ncsupack1 said:

---

BBW12OG said:

---

ncsupack1 said:

---

I get a lot of what you're saying but the product on track has been very good. Days of second place being multiple laps down are over. This is just my opinion but I think a lot of the downhill has a lot to do with changing views, for one how many teens love working on their own cars? Heck, how many even know how to change their own tires? For me it has more to do with shifting interest in teens/people. Lastly, people don't want to admit this but I believe some of the growth was a fad. Just some of my opinions.

---

I think it has more to do with the marketing and the target demographics moving from their roots to what they view as a more socially diverse crowd.

Just my two cents... had they kept races in the South, a few in the Midwest and a few rotations out West all would have been fine.

When you have the same race at the same track only in different states the boredom is too much to withstand.

How many tracks have the same configurations? Running 400 laps in a line for 3 hours is mundane even for the most diehard fan. They lost fans' interest during that 5-6 year span and we found out there are more things to do on Sunday afternoons.

Add in all the politically correct nonsense they seem to be shoving down our throats and they have took a billion dollar sport and made it scramble for sponsors, network attention and most of all, fans.

---

We will have to agree to disagree on a few of those points. As for the woke thing, heck they are the least of sports that do that. I can't even watch a football, basketball, or really any other league game without either seeing it on court/end zone or having said station beating the drum on some issue. The tracks still pray before the race and do a pretty good job of honoring our fallen. Just my two cents. It is a fantastic thing to talk about for sure, why's and ifs.

---

LOL yeah NASCAR is not woke. Can't read what the guy posted, but I'm guessing he's upset about Bubba Wallace.
Probably upset NASCAR has restricted rebel flags from being flown at the race tracks any more.

My sons grew up as NASCAR fans because I was. Two of them watched the race the other night (i didn't even know it was on) --- but they are more interested in, and plugged into, the F1 happenings.

ETA: When i first became a fan, it was all about liking driver -- one who resonated. I think NASCAR became so corporate really impacted that, because the drivers had no personality. One is like another (I do think Chastain breaks that mold). I think the social media presence / documentary really helped F1 with that. Not only with drivers, but the key team members.
In NASCAR, even the drivers we "want" to like --- as a former Bill Elliott fan I want to like Chase -- are not as relateable today as the generations before them

---

The woke one has spoken! BTW, you can read BBW's post because it's just above the post you responded to…

---

Actually, you are wrong. I can see that he responded to ncsupack, but since no one has quoted him, i can't read his response. But maybe you can tell me, did he reference Bubba? I'd bet a whole lot of $$ that that is what he meant by woke....you too.

And if by "woke", you mean i think we should treat all people equally, regardless of color, ethnicity, immigrant status, socioeconomic standing, etc, and that we shouldn't use derogatory slurs to mock somoene with whom we politically disagree, well then I am ok with htat, and I see how that does differentiate you and I.

Glasswolf said:

---

NASCAR has been corporate since the 70's. STP (Petty) Purolator (Wood Brothers) Mountain Dew (Junior Johnson. the days of being sponsored by Plymouth by Petty are long gone. Nothing Woke about it. Remember Winston being the series sponsor? Everything was geared around cigarette's and tobacco. $$ fuels every sport. NFL, NBA, CFB and CBB. NASCAR is no different

---

I do think it is a different type of sponsor now, and one trying to market to a different crowd. Its not to the southern man who grew up in, and had no plans to ever leave, the southern states. And companies who are sponsoring are now having to contribute significantly more $$$, so I'm sure want more of a say in who represents them and how they are presented.

Packchem91 said:

---

Glasswolf said:

---

NASCAR has been corporate since the 70's. STP (Petty) Purolator (Wood Brothers) Mountain Dew (Junior Johnson. the days of being sponsored by Plymouth by Petty are long gone. Nothing Woke about it. Remember Winston being the series sponsor? Everything was geared around cigarette's and tobacco. $$ fuels every sport. NFL, NBA, CFB and CBB. NASCAR is no different

---

I do think it is a different type of sponsor now, and one trying to market to a different crowd. Its not to the southern man who grew up in, and had no plans to ever leave, the southern states. And companies who are sponsoring are now having to contribute significantly more $$$, so I'm sure want more of a say in who represents them and how they are presented.

---

You generalize a lot in that statement. Your passive aggressive insults to the men, and I'm 100% certain you are referring to straight white males, that they could never pull themselves out of where they were born due to certain preconceived stereotypes that you are inferring. Nice... tell us who you are in the first sentence.

Companies have shifted as far left as the media they have to pay in order to keep them in business. FACT.



Racin', as I know it, will continue to go on. There are plenty of places scattered across the country, North and South, that will provide true fans with a venue to watch something they enjoy.

Now shift this back to NASCAR.......

THE "Hat Man"

Packchem91 said:

---

caryking said:

---

Packchem91 said:

---

ncsupack1 said:

---

BBW12OG said:

---

ncsupack1 said:

---

I get a lot of what you're saying but the product on track has been very good. Days of second place being multiple laps down are over. This is just my opinion but I think a lot of the downhill has a lot to do with changing views, for one how many teens love working on their own cars? Heck, how many even know how to change their own tires? For me it has more to do with shifting interest in teens/people. Lastly, people don't want to admit this but I believe some of the growth was a fad. Just some of my opinions.

---

I think it has more to do with the marketing and the target demographics moving from their roots to what they view as a more socially diverse crowd.

Just my two cents... had they kept races in the South, a few in the Midwest and a few rotations out West all would have been fine.

When you have the same race at the same track only in different states the boredom is too much to withstand.

How many tracks have the same configurations? Running 400 laps in a line for 3 hours is mundane even for the most diehard fan. They lost fans' interest during that 5-6 year span and we found out there are more things to do on Sunday afternoons.

Add in all the politically correct nonsense they seem to be shoving down our throats and they have took a billion dollar sport and made it scramble for sponsors, network attention and most of all, fans.

---

We will have to agree to disagree on a few of those points. As for the woke thing, heck they are the least of sports that do that. I can't even watch a football, basketball, or really any other league game without either seeing it on court/end zone or having said station beating the drum on some issue. The tracks still pray before the race and do a pretty good job of honoring our fallen. Just my two cents. It is a fantastic thing to talk about for sure, why's and ifs.

---

LOL yeah NASCAR is not woke. Can't read what the guy posted, but I'm guessing he's upset about Bubba Wallace.
Probably upset NASCAR has restricted rebel flags from being flown at the race tracks any more.

My sons grew up as NASCAR fans because I was. Two of them watched the race the other night (i didn't even know it was on) --- but they are more interested in, and plugged into, the F1 happenings.

ETA: When i first became a fan, it was all about liking driver -- one who resonated. I think NASCAR became so corporate really impacted that, because the drivers had no personality. One is like another (I do think Chastain breaks that mold). I think the social media presence / documentary really helped F1 with that. Not only with drivers, but the key team members.
In NASCAR, even the drivers we "want" to like --- as a former Bill Elliott fan I want to like Chase -- are not as relateable today as the generations before them

---

The woke one has spoken! BTW, you can read BBW's post because it's just above the post you responded to…

---

Actually, you are wrong. I can see that he responded to ncsupack, but since no one has quoted him, i can't read his response. But maybe you can tell me, did he reference Bubba? I'd bet a whole lot of $$ that that is what he meant by woke....you too.

And if by "woke", you mean i think we should treat all people equally, regardless of color, ethnicity, immigrant status, socioeconomic standing, etc, and that we shouldn't use derogatory slurs to mock somoene with whom we politically disagree, well then I am ok with htat, and I see how that does differentiate you and I.

---

Here you go…. Oh, and BTW, it was quoted in your response…

BBW12OG said:
I think it has more to do with the marketing and the target demographics moving from their roots to what they view as a more socially diverse crowd.

Just my two cents... had they kept races in the South, a few in the Midwest and a few rotations out West all would have been fine.

When you have the same race at the same track only in different states the boredom is too much to withstand.

How many tracks have the same configurations? Running 400 laps in a line for 3 hours is mundane even for the most diehard fan. They lost fans' interest during that 5-6 year span and we found out there are more things to do on Sunday afternoons.

Add in all the politically correct nonsense they seem to be shoving down our throats and they have took a billion dollar sport and made it scramble for sponsors, network attention and most of all, fans.

caryking said:

---

Packchem91 said:

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caryking said:

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Packchem91 said:

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ncsupack1 said:

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BBW12OG said:

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ncsupack1 said:

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I get a lot of what you're saying but the product on track has been very good. Days of second place being multiple laps down are over. This is just my opinion but I think a lot of the downhill has a lot to do with changing views, for one how many teens love working on their own cars? Heck, how many even know how to change their own tires? For me it has more to do with shifting interest in teens/people. Lastly, people don't want to admit this but I believe some of the growth was a fad. Just some of my opinions.

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I think it has more to do with the marketing and the target demographics moving from their roots to what they view as a more socially diverse crowd.

Just my two cents... had they kept races in the South, a few in the Midwest and a few rotations out West all would have been fine.

When you have the same race at the same track only in different states the boredom is too much to withstand.

How many tracks have the same configurations? Running 400 laps in a line for 3 hours is mundane even for the most diehard fan. They lost fans' interest during that 5-6 year span and we found out there are more things to do on Sunday afternoons.

Add in all the politically correct nonsense they seem to be shoving down our throats and they have took a billion dollar sport and made it scramble for sponsors, network attention and most of all, fans.

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We will have to agree to disagree on a few of those points. As for the woke thing, heck they are the least of sports that do that. I can't even watch a football, basketball, or really any other league game without either seeing it on court/end zone or having said station beating the drum on some issue. The tracks still pray before the race and do a pretty good job of honoring our fallen. Just my two cents. It is a fantastic thing to talk about for sure, why's and ifs.

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LOL yeah NASCAR is not woke. Can't read what the guy posted, but I'm guessing he's upset about Bubba Wallace.
Probably upset NASCAR has restricted rebel flags from being flown at the race tracks any more.

My sons grew up as NASCAR fans because I was. Two of them watched the race the other night (i didn't even know it was on) --- but they are more interested in, and plugged into, the F1 happenings.

ETA: When i first became a fan, it was all about liking driver -- one who resonated. I think NASCAR became so corporate really impacted that, because the drivers had no personality. One is like another (I do think Chastain breaks that mold). I think the social media presence / documentary really helped F1 with that. Not only with drivers, but the key team members.
In NASCAR, even the drivers we "want" to like --- as a former Bill Elliott fan I want to like Chase -- are not as relateable today as the generations before them

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The woke one has spoken! BTW, you can read BBW's post because it's just above the post you responded to…

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Actually, you are wrong. I can see that he responded to ncsupack, but since no one has quoted him, i can't read his response. But maybe you can tell me, did he reference Bubba? I'd bet a whole lot of $$ that that is what he meant by woke....you too.

And if by "woke", you mean i think we should treat all people equally, regardless of color, ethnicity, immigrant status, socioeconomic standing, etc, and that we shouldn't use derogatory slurs to mock somoene with whom we politically disagree, well then I am ok with htat, and I see how that does differentiate you and I.

---

Here you go…. Oh, and BTW, it was quoted in your response…

BBW12OG said:
I think it has more to do with the marketing and the target demographics moving from their roots to what they view as a more socially diverse crowd.

Just my two cents... had they kept races in the South, a few in the Midwest and a few rotations out West all would have been fine.

When you have the same race at the same track only in different states the boredom is too much to withstand.

How many tracks have the same configurations? Running 400 laps in a line for 3 hours is mundane even for the most diehard fan. They lost fans' interest during that 5-6 year span and we found out there are more things to do on Sunday afternoons.

Add in all the politically correct nonsense they seem to be shoving down our throats and they have took a billion dollar sport and made it scramble for sponsors, network attention and most of all, fans.

---

So now go to his post on 2/7, response to Ncsupack.
I can't see that one b/c it's not been quoted. But ncsupack had the audacity to disagree, so of course BBW responded. Tell me if he addresses Bubba there as "proof" there is malfeasance in NASCARS approach.

Packchem91 said:

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caryking said:

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Packchem91 said:

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caryking said:

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Packchem91 said:

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ncsupack1 said:

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BBW12OG said:

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ncsupack1 said:

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I get a lot of what you're saying but the product on track has been very good. Days of second place being multiple laps down are over. This is just my opinion but I think a lot of the downhill has a lot to do with changing views, for one how many teens love working on their own cars? Heck, how many even know how to change their own tires? For me it has more to do with shifting interest in teens/people. Lastly, people don't want to admit this but I believe some of the growth was a fad. Just some of my opinions.

---

I think it has more to do with the marketing and the target demographics moving from their roots to what they view as a more socially diverse crowd.

Just my two cents... had they kept races in the South, a few in the Midwest and a few rotations out West all would have been fine.

When you have the same race at the same track only in different states the boredom is too much to withstand.

How many tracks have the same configurations? Running 400 laps in a line for 3 hours is mundane even for the most diehard fan. They lost fans' interest during that 5-6 year span and we found out there are more things to do on Sunday afternoons.

Add in all the politically correct nonsense they seem to be shoving down our throats and they have took a billion dollar sport and made it scramble for sponsors, network attention and most of all, fans.

---

We will have to agree to disagree on a few of those points. As for the woke thing, heck they are the least of sports that do that. I can't even watch a football, basketball, or really any other league game without either seeing it on court/end zone or having said station beating the drum on some issue. The tracks still pray before the race and do a pretty good job of honoring our fallen. Just my two cents. It is a fantastic thing to talk about for sure, why's and ifs.

---

LOL yeah NASCAR is not woke. Can't read what the guy posted, but I'm guessing he's upset about Bubba Wallace.
Probably upset NASCAR has restricted rebel flags from being flown at the race tracks any more.

My sons grew up as NASCAR fans because I was. Two of them watched the race the other night (i didn't even know it was on) --- but they are more interested in, and plugged into, the F1 happenings.

ETA: When i first became a fan, it was all about liking driver -- one who resonated. I think NASCAR became so corporate really impacted that, because the drivers had no personality. One is like another (I do think Chastain breaks that mold). I think the social media presence / documentary really helped F1 with that. Not only with drivers, but the key team members.
In NASCAR, even the drivers we "want" to like --- as a former Bill Elliott fan I want to like Chase -- are not as relateable today as the generations before them

---

The woke one has spoken! BTW, you can read BBW's post because it's just above the post you responded to…

---

Actually, you are wrong. I can see that he responded to ncsupack, but since no one has quoted him, i can't read his response. But maybe you can tell me, did he reference Bubba? I'd bet a whole lot of $$ that that is what he meant by woke....you too.

And if by "woke", you mean i think we should treat all people equally, regardless of color, ethnicity, immigrant status, socioeconomic standing, etc, and that we shouldn't use derogatory slurs to mock somoene with whom we politically disagree, well then I am ok with htat, and I see how that does differentiate you and I.

---

Here you go…. Oh, and BTW, it was quoted in your response…

BBW12OG said:
I think it has more to do with the marketing and the target demographics moving from their roots to what they view as a more socially diverse crowd.

Just my two cents... had they kept races in the South, a few in the Midwest and a few rotations out West all would have been fine.

When you have the same race at the same track only in different states the boredom is too much to withstand.

How many tracks have the same configurations? Running 400 laps in a line for 3 hours is mundane even for the most diehard fan. They lost fans' interest during that 5-6 year span and we found out there are more things to do on Sunday afternoons.

Add in all the politically correct nonsense they seem to be shoving down our throats and they have took a billion dollar sport and made it scramble for sponsors, network attention and most of all, fans.

---

So now go to his post on 2/7, response to Ncsupack.
I can't see that one b/c it's not been quoted. But ncsupack had the audacity to disagree, so of course BBW responded. Tell me if he addresses Bubba there as "proof" there is malfeasance in NASCARS approach.

---

What is your deal? I literally placed his post, from your response. I'm not looking anywhere else…. Your racial tendencies are so ridiculous and woke!!!

caryking said:

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Packchem91 said:

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caryking said:

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Packchem91 said:

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caryking said:

---

Packchem91 said:

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ncsupack1 said:

---

BBW12OG said:

---

ncsupack1 said:

---

I get a lot of what you're saying but the product on track has been very good. Days of second place being multiple laps down are over. This is just my opinion but I think a lot of the downhill has a lot to do with changing views, for one how many teens love working on their own cars? Heck, how many even know how to change their own tires? For me it has more to do with shifting interest in teens/people. Lastly, people don't want to admit this but I believe some of the growth was a fad. Just some of my opinions.

---

I think it has more to do with the marketing and the target demographics moving from their roots to what they view as a more socially diverse crowd.

Just my two cents... had they kept races in the South, a few in the Midwest and a few rotations out West all would have been fine.

When you have the same race at the same track only in different states the boredom is too much to withstand.

How many tracks have the same configurations? Running 400 laps in a line for 3 hours is mundane even for the most diehard fan. They lost fans' interest during that 5-6 year span and we found out there are more things to do on Sunday afternoons.

Add in all the politically correct nonsense they seem to be shoving down our throats and they have took a billion dollar sport and made it scramble for sponsors, network attention and most of all, fans.

---

We will have to agree to disagree on a few of those points. As for the woke thing, heck they are the least of sports that do that. I can't even watch a football, basketball, or really any other league game without either seeing it on court/end zone or having said station beating the drum on some issue. The tracks still pray before the race and do a pretty good job of honoring our fallen. Just my two cents. It is a fantastic thing to talk about for sure, why's and ifs.

---

LOL yeah NASCAR is not woke. Can't read what the guy posted, but I'm guessing he's upset about Bubba Wallace.
Probably upset NASCAR has restricted rebel flags from being flown at the race tracks any more.

My sons grew up as NASCAR fans because I was. Two of them watched the race the other night (i didn't even know it was on) --- but they are more interested in, and plugged into, the F1 happenings.

ETA: When i first became a fan, it was all about liking driver -- one who resonated. I think NASCAR became so corporate really impacted that, because the drivers had no personality. One is like another (I do think Chastain breaks that mold). I think the social media presence / documentary really helped F1 with that. Not only with drivers, but the key team members.
In NASCAR, even the drivers we "want" to like --- as a former Bill Elliott fan I want to like Chase -- are not as relateable today as the generations before them

---

The woke one has spoken! BTW, you can read BBW's post because it's just above the post you responded to…

---

Actually, you are wrong. I can see that he responded to ncsupack, but since no one has quoted him, i can't read his response. But maybe you can tell me, did he reference Bubba? I'd bet a whole lot of $$ that that is what he meant by woke....you too.

And if by "woke", you mean i think we should treat all people equally, regardless of color, ethnicity, immigrant status, socioeconomic standing, etc, and that we shouldn't use derogatory slurs to mock somoene with whom we politically disagree, well then I am ok with htat, and I see how that does differentiate you and I.

---

Here you go…. Oh, and BTW, it was quoted in your response…

BBW12OG said:
I think it has more to do with the marketing and the target demographics moving from their roots to what they view as a more socially diverse crowd.

Just my two cents... had they kept races in the South, a few in the Midwest and a few rotations out West all would have been fine.

When you have the same race at the same track only in different states the boredom is too much to withstand.

How many tracks have the same configurations? Running 400 laps in a line for 3 hours is mundane even for the most diehard fan. They lost fans' interest during that 5-6 year span and we found out there are more things to do on Sunday afternoons.

Add in all the politically correct nonsense they seem to be shoving down our throats and they have took a billion dollar sport and made it scramble for sponsors, network attention and most of all, fans.

---

So now go to his post on 2/7, response to Ncsupack.
I can't see that one b/c it's not been quoted. But ncsupack had the audacity to disagree, so of course BBW responded. Tell me if he addresses Bubba there as "proof" there is malfeasance in NASCARS approach.

---

What is your deal? I literally placed his post, from your response. I'm not looking anywhere else…. Your racial tendencies are so ridiculous and woke!!!

---

Lol, I'll help you out. Im sure you already know what he said but don't want to show me correct. I just took him off ignore. Here is his response. But sure, im the one with the issue, lol.
I'll put him back on ignore now.
I've pretty much observed over time that anyone who says "NASCAR is too woke", really means they don't like Bubba and/or Wallace getting any special attention.

Bubba Wallace, the "noose" and the FBI launching an all hands on deck investigation into a hate crime that everyone knew full well was BS will forever be a stain on NASCAR and the clowns that pushed it.

Wallace being the main one.

Back to the actual racing. I can't recall as quiet of a buildup to the season as this year? I've heard almost nothing. Maybe I just didn't pay attention during Panthers games to promotions for the Clash?

Can't wait to watch Thursday night though. Seeing all the cars under lights in Daytona to kick off the season is awesome

Packchem91 said:

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caryking said:

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Packchem91 said:

---

caryking said:

---

Packchem91 said:

---

caryking said:

---

Packchem91 said:

---

ncsupack1 said:

---

BBW12OG said:

---

ncsupack1 said:

---

I get a lot of what you're saying but the product on track has been very good. Days of second place being multiple laps down are over. This is just my opinion but I think a lot of the downhill has a lot to do with changing views, for one how many teens love working on their own cars? Heck, how many even know how to change their own tires? For me it has more to do with shifting interest in teens/people. Lastly, people don't want to admit this but I believe some of the growth was a fad. Just some of my opinions.

---

I think it has more to do with the marketing and the target demographics moving from their roots to what they view as a more socially diverse crowd.

Just my two cents... had they kept races in the South, a few in the Midwest and a few rotations out West all would have been fine.

When you have the same race at the same track only in different states the boredom is too much to withstand.

How many tracks have the same configurations? Running 400 laps in a line for 3 hours is mundane even for the most diehard fan. They lost fans' interest during that 5-6 year span and we found out there are more things to do on Sunday afternoons.

Add in all the politically correct nonsense they seem to be shoving down our throats and they have took a billion dollar sport and made it scramble for sponsors, network attention and most of all, fans.

---

We will have to agree to disagree on a few of those points. As for the woke thing, heck they are the least of sports that do that. I can't even watch a football, basketball, or really any other league game without either seeing it on court/end zone or having said station beating the drum on some issue. The tracks still pray before the race and do a pretty good job of honoring our fallen. Just my two cents. It is a fantastic thing to talk about for sure, why's and ifs.

---

LOL yeah NASCAR is not woke. Can't read what the guy posted, but I'm guessing he's upset about Bubba Wallace.
Probably upset NASCAR has restricted rebel flags from being flown at the race tracks any more.

My sons grew up as NASCAR fans because I was. Two of them watched the race the other night (i didn't even know it was on) --- but they are more interested in, and plugged into, the F1 happenings.

ETA: When i first became a fan, it was all about liking driver -- one who resonated. I think NASCAR became so corporate really impacted that, because the drivers had no personality. One is like another (I do think Chastain breaks that mold). I think the social media presence / documentary really helped F1 with that. Not only with drivers, but the key team members.
In NASCAR, even the drivers we "want" to like --- as a former Bill Elliott fan I want to like Chase -- are not as relateable today as the generations before them

---

The woke one has spoken! BTW, you can read BBW's post because it's just above the post you responded to…

---

Actually, you are wrong. I can see that he responded to ncsupack, but since no one has quoted him, i can't read his response. But maybe you can tell me, did he reference Bubba? I'd bet a whole lot of $$ that that is what he meant by woke....you too.

And if by "woke", you mean i think we should treat all people equally, regardless of color, ethnicity, immigrant status, socioeconomic standing, etc, and that we shouldn't use derogatory slurs to mock somoene with whom we politically disagree, well then I am ok with htat, and I see how that does differentiate you and I.

---

Here you go…. Oh, and BTW, it was quoted in your response…

BBW12OG said:
I think it has more to do with the marketing and the target demographics moving from their roots to what they view as a more socially diverse crowd.

Just my two cents... had they kept races in the South, a few in the Midwest and a few rotations out West all would have been fine.

When you have the same race at the same track only in different states the boredom is too much to withstand.

How many tracks have the same configurations? Running 400 laps in a line for 3 hours is mundane even for the most diehard fan. They lost fans' interest during that 5-6 year span and we found out there are more things to do on Sunday afternoons.

Add in all the politically correct nonsense they seem to be shoving down our throats and they have took a billion dollar sport and made it scramble for sponsors, network attention and most of all, fans.

---

So now go to his post on 2/7, response to Ncsupack.
I can't see that one b/c it's not been quoted. But ncsupack had the audacity to disagree, so of course BBW responded. Tell me if he addresses Bubba there as "proof" there is malfeasance in NASCARS approach.

---

What is your deal? I literally placed his post, from your response. I'm not looking anywhere else…. Your racial tendencies are so ridiculous and woke!!!

---

Lol, I'll help you out. Im sure you already know what he said but don't want to show me correct. I just took him off ignore. Here is his response. But sure, im the one with the issue, lol.
I'll put him back on ignore now.
I've pretty much observed over time that anyone who says "NASCAR is too woke", really means they don't like Bubba and/or Wallace getting any special attention.

Bubba Wallace, the "noose" and the FBI launching an all hands on deck investigation into a hate crime that everyone knew full well was BS will forever be a stain on NASCAR and the clowns that pushed it.

Wallace being the main one.

---

Chem, that is BBW's opinion that the episode is a stain on NASCAR's eye. That said, do you not find it a little wired that this happened? And, yes, it happened exactly as BBW's account.

PLEASE GET THE POST BACK TO RACING.

BBW, KEEP THE POLITICS TO ONE OF YOUR SEVERAL THREADS AND MOVE YOUR POST THERE PLEASE. DAMN, IT GETS OLD.

Some of y'all will remember Trevor Boys


https://www.jayski.com/2023/02/07/sad-news-trevor-boys/