packgrad said:

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This is pretty common phenomenon amongst those shouting the loudest on social media.

Steve Kerr, who last night demanded new gun laws to keep kids safe, protested to demand the removal of all armed police from schools two years go. https://t.co/Tx8heuvIG9

— Clay Travis (@ClayTravis) May 25, 2022

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Steve Kerr is a raging hypocrite and has been for years. One would think that the head coach of an NBA team, would have a lot of empathy for black human beings, but he never speaks up about the shootings that happen in major urban areas every week like Chicago, Philly, St. Louis and so on. You get a school shooting and people can't wait to quote Steve Kerr. "We have to do something." Well Steve why don't you and your players go to the South Side of Chicago and find out what is going on there every weekend and try to stop it.

How does a "mental health crisis" just pop out of nowhere? Is it all the chemicals in the water?

Orrrrrr....is the problem actually a worldview and belief system problem? In our atheistic Marxist-dominated culture, we are taught that "there is no God" and we all came into existence "by random chance of evolution" and human life is not valuable, and that unborn children can be murdered for convenience sake. And we are taught by the Left that humans are a "cancer" on the earth and must be controlled and their population lowered in order to "save the earth from climate change".

This devaluation of human life, and our general sick and morally degraded and perverted society seems like a much, much more likely culprit of causing these sorts of crimes, than any "mental health crisis". Unless you want to define that "mental illness" as the atheistic Marxist-Leftist belief system itself, then yes. I would agree with that. That is the true "mental illness".

packgrad said:

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Yet, will yell at anyone who puts an ounce of insinuation in his comments.

Werewolf said:

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The hell of it is, those with the power to help deal with it, just don't want to. And to me, that makes them as responsible for a lot of what we are seeing happen today as is the person(s) carrying out the actual event.

God, WILL help us. We must ask for his help.

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Specifically, what makes you think that? If He was going to help in some way, wouldn't he have done it by now?

Galatians 6:7-8

There are seven laws of the harvest. Over the next few weeks we want to consider each of them and learn from these principles.

• We Reap Only What Has Been Sown
• We Reap the Same In Kind As We Sow
• We Reap in a Different Season than We Sow
• We Reap More Than We Sow
• We Reap In Proportion to What We Sow
• We Reap the Full Harvest Of the Good Only if We Persevere
• We Can't do Anything About Last Year's Harvest, But We Can About This Year's

and I will say that I'm far from pure having lived a life in my 20's so I call no one out.

Things could be done concurrently; I never posted not to.

My point is that mental health is the biggest problem. I don't think it will take as long as you project for many people, but there are some chronically ill that it will take a long time to try to help. As I said, there are some that can't be helped with anything but permanent facility care.

As far as other things, whatever you are proposing will also take time. Gun control? Not everyone with guns will willingly give them back; I know I won't. More legislation? Legislate what, exactly? And enforce it how?

This is a multi-pronged problem that is way past needing help. Seems like answers are slow to come.

statefan91 said:

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Werewolf said:

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The hell of it is, those with the power to help deal with it, just don't want to. And to me, that makes them as responsible for a lot of what we are seeing happen today as is the person(s) carrying out the actual event.

God, WILL help us. We must ask for his help.

---

Specifically, what makes you think that? If He was going to help in some way, wouldn't he have done it by now?

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Why would God help people who hate and reject him, and celebrate the things that he considers abominations, such as murdering unborn children and sodomy and transgenderism?

The god of the Left is Satan. Maybe he will "help" them. And by "help", I mean that he will make this place a hell on earth. Which it is becoming.

It's so freaking hilarious to me that the people who's RELIGION is mass murdering millions of unborn children are the same people who suddenly "care about the children".

They are fanatically obsessed with taking our guns because of their "deep bleeding heart love for the children". Riiiiight

lmao

Bell Tower Grey said:

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Both you and Glass have provided interesting and common sense statements. Thanks to you both.

I've thought about this most of the night and Mrs. BTG and I talked about it at breakfast this morning. I still believe the larger part of the issue is lack of mental health treatment for people, regardless of their age. We discussed this some here in a previous topic recently. Maybe more than once in differing threads, actually.

If proper MH care, and enough facilities were available to help deal with the wide ranging degrees of MH problems, and those in need of such treatment were given (or if need be forced to go) it, once those folks were stabilized and able to function in society, we would see a welcome change for the better in our society.

Granted, some folks won't ever be able to be treated and released - maybe this man that killed the folks in Texas is one of them. Those are the folks that have to have long term to permanent institutional care (not prison). It used to be available years ago and from what I can tell, worked a lot better than how things are today.

Once the mental health crisis in America is seriously dealt with, then and only then can the other issues (guns, drugs, lack of parental control, etc.) be addressed.

The hell of it is, those with the power to help deal with it, just don't want to. And to me, that makes them as responsible for a lot of what we are seeing happen today as is the person(s) carrying out the actual event.

God, help us all.

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I agree 100%! Mental health care is a huge problem in this country and at the core of many of our issues. Social media in my opinion has created a great amount of this mental stress for our younger folks as well. I forget the topic, or who said it. But, another thread a couple of years back, somebody in the medical field stated that before the closure of many of our mental institutions, you didn't have the number of mass shooting, serial killings, etc that you have today.

We have a ton of root causes in this country that are creating the issues we face today. But everyone wants to attack the object and not the individuals and their root causes. Nobody called for SUV's to be banned after Waukesha. We need to get after these root causes. And like cowboy said, stop spending government time and money on parents protesting at school boards and start investigating every red flag that leads to a horrific event like yesterday.

GuerrillaPack said:

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It's so freaking hilarious to me that the people who's RELIGION is mass murdering millions of unborn children are the same people who suddenly "care about the children".

They are fanatically obsessed with taking our guns because of their "deep bleeding heart love for the children". Riiiiight

lmao

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I said that last night when all the Dem politicians were running to social media to make their statements. The party of hypocrisy never let's you down!

GuerrillaPack said:

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It's so freaking hilarious to me that the people who's RELIGION is mass murdering millions of unborn children are the same people who suddenly "care about the children".

They are fanatically obsessed with taking our guns because of their "deep bleeding heart love for the children". Riiiiight

lmao

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That's a hard one to understand! I wish those with that believe would help us understand the thinking. I don't get it; however, I truly would like to understand the thinking...

I talked to my wife after she got to work. She said that the school and the teachers have a certain calmness about the safety there. As stated earlier, all the doors are locked, from the outside. People are not getting in (easily).

BTW, she took her cannon with her. It's in the classroom waiting for any intruder...

BBW12OG said:

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Packchem91 said:

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GuerrillaPack said:

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Packchem91 said:

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PackFansXL said:

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Packchem91 said:

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PackFansXL said:

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Glasswolf said:

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Is there a more sad statement than having to have armed people at church or schools? These are supposed to be safe places to worship and learn. When I was in HS the only guns were in the back glass of most pick up trucks. Never ever saw one brought into a school

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What do you think has changed since the early 70's when you were in high school?

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A whole bunch of things - and I don't think even the most liberal person would argue human influences have changed from the 1940s and 1950s and 1970s. Hey, in the 1940s and 50s, we still made black people go to different bathrooms than us. So...things progress.

in most normal non-gun scenarios, we'd look for enhancements to make things safer. Add seat belts, lower speed limit, put "you're going to die" labels on cigarette packs.

But when 15 elementary kids get killed, gun amendment folks say, "just hire more security guards at churches and schools and give teachers big guns". We can't even afford teachers, and you want to hire 2-3 FT security guards at every. single. school in America, rather than make meaningful changes within the gun proliferation.
I'm sure we'll have lots of $$ to throw at top-notch security guards.

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Well, Chem, I would love to hear your well thought out solution. Do you honestly think putting labels on boxes of shells warning against shooting kids will actually have an effect? Do you truly believe restricting access to guns will somehow end all shootings? Perhaps if you lose the preachy BS, kneejerk reaction attitude, we can have a discussion.

As I suggested, deterrence seems to me to be the best solution. Perhaps you think we have a prayer of eliminating guns even if we pass the most draconian laws. The usual response is to go look where they have done that and see if it was effective. Chicago has those laws and they are supposedly the most dangerous city in the country. Perhaps the fear of getting shot at would deter the criminal. I think it's interesting that idiots have selected elementary schools and churches for many of these violent acts.

For the record, I have never owned a firearm, but I understand the deterrence aspect of having one. If we continue to see copycat shootings, I may have to get around to making the purchase. I know that gun purchases were dramatically up last year during all the defund police nonsense. Folks living in tough neighborhoods realized that if the police couldn't be relied on they better prepare themselves.

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I don't know the answer. But letting the NRA dictate any meaningful action on them is NOT the answer. What is sad is, some people don't want to even consider changes to reduce the availability of ARs or some of the ammo that is available --- that was not available in the romantic periods you want to reference.

Look, we've all just moved on and accept the individual killings in Chicago, NY, Detroit, Miami, etc. No one really cares, clearly, and it'll likely never be stopped.
I mean, you really want Austin and Charlotte and Marshville and _____ to be like Guatemala City and San Pedro Sula and Managua where everywhere you go, you have teenaged guards with rifles parading around (And plenty of people still get killed).
Maybe the guns over life crowd can start some bumper stickers -- we want our schools to be like those in Guatemala instead of Tokyo!!!

I just don't get it....where else do we have to hear stories like today? Or two weekends ago? But we just accept it.

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You know what makes places like Guatemala, Mexico, and South America so dangerous? The "type" of people who live there. And now we are importing tens of millions of those people here. THAT is the reason that so much of America is becoming crime-infested and dangerous. Because you are allowing the nation to be flooded with tens of millions of these type of people.

If you have good people making up the population (like America from it's founding until the mid 1900s), then you could have every person in the country having 2 or 3 firearms, and you would have virtually zero crime.

Banning weapons does not stop crime. Weapons are not the cause of crime. Wicked people are the cause of crime. Mexico and many central and south American nations have very strict gun control. And yet they have the highest crime in the world.

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Ahhh yes, the "brown people are bad" argument. I figured it would be you or BBW.

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As expected from lefties... when the facts are stacked against you always claim an "ism."

Wouldn't expect anything less from someone like you.

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Surely you see the irony in your crying about this, right Mr Marxist?

caryking said:

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I can say this…. An unfortunate tragedy, like this, has brought this forum back to life…. We have people commenting, debating, calling others names, sarcasm, and all the crap that brought us here in the first place.

Keep it up!!! I love it!!!

Cowboy, welcome back…

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Congratulations. Your concern about people is always overwhelming.

Bell Tower Grey said:

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Things could be done concurrently; I never posted not to.

My point is that mental health is the biggest problem. I don't think it will take as long as you project for many people, but there are some chronically ill that it will take a long time to try to help. As I said, there are some that can't be helped with anything but permanent facility care.

As far as other things, whatever you are proposing will also take time. Gun control? Not everyone with guns will willingly give them back; I know I won't. More legislation? Legislate what, exactly? And enforce it how?

This is a multi-pronged problem that is way past needing help. Seems like answers are slow to come.

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You said "Once the mental health crisis in America is seriously dealt with, then and only then can the other issues (guns, drugs, lack of parental control, etc.) be addressed."

Packchem91 said:

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caryking said:

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I can say this…. An unfortunate tragedy, like this, has brought this forum back to life…. We have people commenting, debating, calling others names, sarcasm, and all the crap that brought us here in the first place.

Keep it up!!! I love it!!!

Cowboy, welcome back…

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Congratulations. Your concern about people is always overwhelming.

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Chem, I do laugh at your post. I also think you're such an ass! That said, keep the humor going... It's good!

I'll tell you what I personally will never accept. Giving up my freedoms!

Giving up ones freedom, for security, will give you neither!!!

caryking said:

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Packchem91 said:

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caryking said:

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I can say this…. An unfortunate tragedy, like this, has brought this forum back to life…. We have people commenting, debating, calling others names, sarcasm, and all the crap that brought us here in the first place.

Keep it up!!! I love it!!!

Cowboy, welcome back…

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Congratulations. Your concern about people is always overwhelming.

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Chem, I do laugh at your post. I also think you're such an ass! That said, keep the humor going... It's good!

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says the self-proclaimed christian gleeful that we have a mass murder of kids to debate. Yep, lots to laugh and celebrate.

Lets hope we can get a hurricane to wipe out the eastern part of the state, a tornado to destroy parts of Charlotte so we can have a great fun spirited debate on global warming, right?

GuerrillaPack said:

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statefan91 said:

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Werewolf said:

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The hell of it is, those with the power to help deal with it, just don't want to. And to me, that makes them as responsible for a lot of what we are seeing happen today as is the person(s) carrying out the actual event.

God, WILL help us. We must ask for his help.

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Specifically, what makes you think that? If He was going to help in some way, wouldn't he have done it by now?

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Why would God help people who hate and reject him, and celebrate the things that he considers abominations, such as murdering unborn children and sodomy and transgenderism?

The god of the Left is Satan. Maybe he will "help" them. And by "help", I mean that he will make this place a hell on earth. Which it is becoming.

---

What did these children do with regards to "murdering unborn children" and the other things you listed?

If it wasn't them then was God allowing children to be killed to punish the Nation? Seems like God would have the ability to do more to direct the change He wants to see than killing children.

Packchem91 said:

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caryking said:

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Packchem91 said:

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caryking said:

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I can say this…. An unfortunate tragedy, like this, has brought this forum back to life…. We have people commenting, debating, calling others names, sarcasm, and all the crap that brought us here in the first place.

Keep it up!!! I love it!!!

Cowboy, welcome back…

---

Congratulations. Your concern about people is always overwhelming.

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Chem, I do laugh at your post. I also think you're such an ass! That said, keep the humor going... It's good!

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says the self-proclaimed christian gleeful that we have a mass murder of kids to debate. Yep, lots to laugh and celebrate.

Lets hope we can get a hurricane to wipe out the eastern part of the state, a tornado to destroy parts of Charlotte so we can have a great fun spirited debate on global warming, right?

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lmao...the "global warming is going to kill us all" fantasy-land mantra

What a complete slander. No right-winger is "gleeful" at mass murder. That couldn't be further from the truth. We actually value human life. We are opposed to the mass murder of millions of unborn children. We encourage people to own firearms so that they can protect themselves, and prevent criminals from harming them and their families.

statefan91 said:

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GuerrillaPack said:

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statefan91 said:

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Werewolf said:

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The hell of it is, those with the power to help deal with it, just don't want to. And to me, that makes them as responsible for a lot of what we are seeing happen today as is the person(s) carrying out the actual event.

God, WILL help us. We must ask for his help.

---

Specifically, what makes you think that? If He was going to help in some way, wouldn't he have done it by now?

---

Why would God help people who hate and reject him, and celebrate the things that he considers abominations, such as murdering unborn children and sodomy and transgenderism?

The god of the Left is Satan. Maybe he will "help" them. And by "help", I mean that he will make this place a hell on earth. Which it is becoming.

---

What did these children do with regards to "murdering unborn children" and the other things you listed?

If it wasn't them then was God allowing children to be killed to punish the Nation? Seems like God would have the ability to do more to direct the change He wants to see than killing children.

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It seems like you are blaming and angry at God. Is that the case?

GuerrillaPack said:

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Packchem91 said:

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caryking said:

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Packchem91 said:

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caryking said:

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I can say this…. An unfortunate tragedy, like this, has brought this forum back to life…. We have people commenting, debating, calling others names, sarcasm, and all the crap that brought us here in the first place.

Keep it up!!! I love it!!!

Cowboy, welcome back…

---

Congratulations. Your concern about people is always overwhelming.

---

Chem, I do laugh at your post. I also think you're such an ass! That said, keep the humor going... It's good!

---

says the self-proclaimed christian gleeful that we have a mass murder of kids to debate. Yep, lots to laugh and celebrate.

Lets hope we can get a hurricane to wipe out the eastern part of the state, a tornado to destroy parts of Charlotte so we can have a great fun spirited debate on global warming, right?

---

lmao

What a complete slander.

No right-winger is "gleeful" at mass murder. That couldn't be further from the truth. We actually value human life. We are opposed to the mass murder of millions of unborn children. We encourage people to own firearms so that they can protect themselves, and prevent criminals from harming them and their families.

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GP, Chem is an interesting person. He loves attacking me. its whatever... That said, I am a christian and proud of it! I'm also a flawed person. Perhaps, people like Chem should learn about humility as they would see their own flaws!

I'm living in an echo-chamber!!!

Nm. Agree with what you said but I'm going back to lurking. Getting fleas in here.

GuerrillaPack said:

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statefan91 said:

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What did these children do with regards to "murdering unborn children" and the other things you listed?

If it wasn't them then was God allowing children to be killed to punish the Nation? Seems like God would have the ability to do more to direct the change He wants to see than killing children.

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It seems like you are blaming and angry at God. Is that the case?

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Of course not, but I also don't see Him intervening to stop any of this which is what Werewolf seemed to be suggesting. You avoided my question as to why, if he is punishing "us," are the children killed. Why wouldn't He just take vengeance on those that are doing the things you described.

statefan91 said:

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GuerrillaPack said:

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statefan91 said:

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What did these children do with regards to "murdering unborn children" and the other things you listed?

If it wasn't them then was God allowing children to be killed to punish the Nation? Seems like God would have the ability to do more to direct the change He wants to see than killing children.

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It seems like you are blaming and angry at God. Is that the case?

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Of course not, but I also don't see Him intervening to stop any of this which is what Werewolf seemed to be suggesting. You avoided my question as to why, if he is punishing "us," are the children killed. Why wouldn't He just take vengeance on those that are doing the things you described.

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God punished the Israelites of long ago by allowing foreign armies to invade and massacre their children. Perhaps God punishes the wicked by allowing their children to be killed.

Whatever the case, God is always just and does what is right. Evil exists in the world because of Satan and mankind sinning. God gave us free will. He allows mankind to choose whether to do right or wrong. That's why evil exists.

cowboypack02 said:

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smitt86 said:

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BBW12OG said:

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smitt86 said:

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PackFansXL said:

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Glasswolf said:

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Is there a more sad statement than having to have armed people at church or schools? These are supposed to be safe places to worship and learn. When I was in HS the only guns were in the back glass of most pick up trucks. Never ever saw one brought into a school

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What do you think has changed since the early 70's when you were in high school?

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AR-15s weren't available to the public until the 90s. One thing to have a hunting rifle in your back glass, another to have a semi-automatic weapon that can be modified, illegally, to be fully automatic. From a family of avid hunters and concealed-carry certified, but still see zero reason for the general public to own an AR-15, and never will.

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Define an AR-15 please.

And you know it's illegal to have a fully automatic machine gun right?

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I do know that, that's why I said it was a "semi-automatic weapon" that COULD be modified ILLEGALLY and there are simple online tutorials on how to accomplish this.

Someone asked what was different from the 70s to now, and one major difference is that 18 year olds in the 70s didn't have access to AR-15s that they could learn to modify to automatic weapons at home. Several of the most high-profile mass shooting have been these type of weapons. I'm not saying ban guns, I just have a really hard time understanding the REASON anyone, let alone an 18 year old, would need a semi-automatic weapon with 30 rounds. My father and brother both own them, and they've ONLY used them at a gun range, so I see no legitimate reason for them to have them other than to say they do and because they can legally.

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Just because your brother and father only go to the gun range doesn't mean that's what everyone uses their's for. I have an AR-10 (basically the same rifle except chambered in a .308) that I just to hunt hogs with.

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I don't think the issue is that AR owners don't ever use their guns for something other than either murdering humans or target practice at the range; the issue is that you could hunt hogs essentially as effectively with other rifles that aren't as easily modified to be utilized to efficiently kill a bunch of people.

Regardless, like hokie has said I don't think the lowest hanging fruit is raising the bar substantially in order to get specific types of guns (although I don't think restricting AR's is without merit). Like others have said, I believe a minority of mass gun killings occur with an AR.

Well-crafted red flag laws have to happen though. There is no cogent argument against them.

statefan91 said:

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Bell Tower Grey said:

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Things could be done concurrently; I never posted not to.

My point is that mental health is the biggest problem. I don't think it will take as long as you project for many people, but there are some chronically ill that it will take a long time to try to help. As I said, there are some that can't be helped with anything but permanent facility care.

As far as other things, whatever you are proposing will also take time. Gun control? Not everyone with guns will willingly give them back; I know I won't. More legislation? Legislate what, exactly? And enforce it how?

This is a multi-pronged problem that is way past needing help. Seems like answers are slow to come.

---

You said "Once the mental health crisis in America is seriously dealt with, then and only then can the other issues (guns, drugs, lack of parental control, etc.) be addressed."

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Since you are on your horse, let me clarify my statement by writing it this way:

Once the mental health crisis in America is seriously dealt with, then and only then can the other issues (guns, drugs, lack of parental control, etc.) be PERHAPS EFFECTIVELY addressed."

You're welcome.

Civilized said:

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cowboypack02 said:

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smitt86 said:

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BBW12OG said:

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smitt86 said:

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PackFansXL said:

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Glasswolf said:

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Is there a more sad statement than having to have armed people at church or schools? These are supposed to be safe places to worship and learn. When I was in HS the only guns were in the back glass of most pick up trucks. Never ever saw one brought into a school

---

What do you think has changed since the early 70's when you were in high school?

---

AR-15s weren't available to the public until the 90s. One thing to have a hunting rifle in your back glass, another to have a semi-automatic weapon that can be modified, illegally, to be fully automatic. From a family of avid hunters and concealed-carry certified, but still see zero reason for the general public to own an AR-15, and never will.

---

Define an AR-15 please.

And you know it's illegal to have a fully automatic machine gun right?

---

I do know that, that's why I said it was a "semi-automatic weapon" that COULD be modified ILLEGALLY and there are simple online tutorials on how to accomplish this.

Someone asked what was different from the 70s to now, and one major difference is that 18 year olds in the 70s didn't have access to AR-15s that they could learn to modify to automatic weapons at home. Several of the most high-profile mass shooting have been these type of weapons. I'm not saying ban guns, I just have a really hard time understanding the REASON anyone, let alone an 18 year old, would need a semi-automatic weapon with 30 rounds. My father and brother both own them, and they've ONLY used them at a gun range, so I see no legitimate reason for them to have them other than to say they do and because they can legally.

---

Just because your brother and father only go to the gun range doesn't mean that's what everyone uses their's for. I have an AR-10 (basically the same rifle except chambered in a .308) that I just to hunt hogs with.

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I don't think the issue is that AR owners don't ever use their guns for something other than either murdering humans or target practice at the range; the issue is that you could hunt hogs essentially as effectively with other rifles that aren't as easily modified to be utilized to efficiently kill a bunch of people.

Regardless, like hokie has said I don't think the lowest hanging fruit is raising the bar substantially in order to get specific types of guns (although I don't think restricting AR's is without merit). Like others have said, I believe a minority of mass gun killings occur with an AR.

Well-crafted red flag laws have to happen though. There is no cogent argument against them.

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Absolutely false. "Red flag" laws are blatantly unconstitutional. It's confiscation of property and the denial of someone's Second Amendment rights without just cause. You are talking about seizing guns before the person has done anything wrong. And it's far more than when a person has made a specific threat, which is probably already addressed under existing laws. These "red flag" laws are broadly written to allow confiscation upon "suspicion" that a person "might" do something. These red flag laws are extremely dangerous, and designed to be abused to confiscate the guns of vast swaths of people. I see Leftist areas having judges target, for example, people who have posted online in support of the Jan 6th protest. They would argue that those people are "potential domestic terrorists".

Bell Tower Grey said:

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statefan91 said:

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You said "Once the mental health crisis in America is seriously dealt with, then and only then can the other issues (guns, drugs, lack of parental control, etc.) be addressed."

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Since you are on your horse, let me clarify my statement by writing it this way:

Once the mental health crisis in America is seriously dealt with, then and only then can the other issues (guns, drugs, lack of parental control, etc.) be PERHAPS EFFECTIVELY addressed."

You're welcome.

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You may have me mistaken with someone else, I'm not on a horse nor did I say thanks for anything you've posted. I was just asking why taking things on concurrently wasn't the goal.

Do you currently vote for politicians that will focus on how we deal with Mental Health issues? Is that somewhere on your radar when considering candidates?

hokiewolf said:

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hokiewolf said:

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Here's a great start at middle ground. And you are correct Big Beautiful Wolf, gun bans don't work.

https://frenchpress.thedispatch.com/p/pass-and-enforce-red-flag-laws-now

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I encourage you BBW to take the 5 mins to read this. This responds to all of your points. Gun laws on the books now are there to try and address your point that shootings related to crime don't get people as upset as mass shootings involving children.

It also addresses that new restrictions or bans on gun sales or guns doesn't address the problem at hand. But there is middle ground if everyone comes together and crafts well written red flag law..

As to your point about why threads aren't started about crime in other cities - I think it's very sad that shootings that occur as a result of gang and drug violence in inner cities don't get as much attention as these mass shooting do. Those numbers should be just as jarring as yesterdays shootings but the violence has gone on for so long that I think people are numb to it.

I look locally here to Durham, as a native of that city and I am very concerned and saddened by the violence that continues in areas of the city. You and I have had good discussions in the past about the whys and whats and the how to go about fixing it.

As someone who had a personal connection to people killed at the Virginia Tech mass shooting I do get extremely bothered when the next one happens. Especially when they involve young children. That tears me up inside and I struggle with that tremendously. I appreciate the advocacy for the 2nd Amendment and what it means, but at some point we have to collectively shed our tribalism ideals and come to the table with a solution that yes, impinges on that right, but doesn't completely eliminate the ability and the right to bear arms. That's why I think a red flag law might be the solution.

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Thanks for posting the link on Red Flag laws. The proposal by Gov. Ducey looks much more promising than the usual polarized political solutions. I did find it interesting that New York already has such a law and that did not stop the shooting in Buffalo. Unfortunately, even with well crafted laws, people still have to enforce them.

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In 2018after the horrific school shooting in Parkland, Florida, Arizona Gov. Doug Ducey proposed a comprehensive safe schools program that incorporated a series of measures that were based on careful analysis of each and every significant school shooting since Columbine. I'd urge you to read the entire document. Ducey proposed enhanced background checks, an increased security presence at schools, and increased mental health resources. He also proposed a red flag law, and to support that proposal he included this chart (which may be easier to read here):

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Do you currently vote for politicians that will focus on how we deal with Mental Health issues? Is that somewhere on your radar when considering candidates?

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I can honestly say that I have never seen a politician list mental health as a prominent plank in his/her platform. I would think the best approach would be directly contacting the office of elected officials to discuss this issue or any important issue would be a better approach.

God bless these sweet little souls. pic.twitter.com/JE95E6xRgp

— Marty Smith (@MartySmithESPN) May 25, 2022

Yes, very much so. If they have not made a public acknowledgement of it, I try when possible to find out what their position on mental health treatment is.

statefan91 said:

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Bell Tower Grey said:

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statefan91 said:

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You said "Once the mental health crisis in America is seriously dealt with, then and only then can the other issues (guns, drugs, lack of parental control, etc.) be addressed."

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Since you are on your horse, let me clarify my statement by writing it this way:

Once the mental health crisis in America is seriously dealt with, then and only then can the other issues (guns, drugs, lack of parental control, etc.) be PERHAPS EFFECTIVELY addressed."

You're welcome.

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You may have me mistaken with someone else, I'm not on a horse nor did I say thanks for anything you've posted. I was just asking why taking things on concurrently wasn't the goal.

Do you currently vote for politicians that will focus on how we deal with Mental Health issues? Is that somewhere on your radar when considering candidates?

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I believe the point he is trying to make, that you're evading, is that a person that wants to hurt people is going to find a way to do it no matter what tool he can get his hands on. Example: the SUV in Waukesha. The cause is not the gun. If you don't fix the cause, the tool is irrelevant.