Werewolf said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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Werewolf said:

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ALERT......... re the Nasville Christian School shooting. Different shoes, watch, belt and camou shown on body cam footage as compared with school security camera footage. Something amiss......

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Let's not start with the conspiracy theory non-sense

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pictures of Vanns on her feet and then picture of PUma on her feet.

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They are the same shoes. Same stripe, you can watch the shoes go from looking black to showing the flames as the camera autofocuses.

Cameras lose detail on things they are not focused on, especially color.

Please don't be a moron and play internet detective unless you actually… https://t.co/xt9yw0Zm9n pic.twitter.com/aMDY8cLade

— Carpe Donktum🔹 (@CarpeDonktum) March 29, 2023

Am I a conspiracy theorist? shoes. Nashville. I watched the video. pic.twitter.com/tTbDzvhKwF

— Erin Elizabeth Health Nut News 🙌 (@unhealthytruth) March 28, 2023

packgrad said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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I'm going to apologize to everyone. I'm only interested in honest conversation, and exchanging with PackChem clearly isn't an honest conversation because he isn't interested in that and it derailed the thread.

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Apology accepted. Put that lying clown on ignore.

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Wufpack17 said:

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Werewolf said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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Werewolf said:

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ALERT......... re the Nasville Christian School shooting. Different shoes, watch, belt and camou shown on body cam footage as compared with school security camera footage. Something amiss......

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Let's not start with the conspiracy theory non-sense

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pictures of Vanns on her feet and then picture of PUma on her feet.

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Don't they look similar?

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jkpackfan said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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I'm going to apologize to everyone. I'm only interested in honest conversation, and exchanging with PackChem clearly isn't an honest conversation because he isn't interested in that and it derailed the thread.

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Yeah you're wasting your time, better to put on ignore.

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Packchem91 said:

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jkpackfan said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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I'm going to apologize to everyone. I'm only interested in honest conversation, and exchanging with PackChem clearly isn't an honest conversation because he isn't interested in that and it derailed the thread.

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Yeah you're wasting your time, better to put on ignore.

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Lol. the guys who talk about "participation trophies ruining America" need a safe space from someone presenting actual facts and challenging the absurdity of the "it's not the guns" narrative

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.@RepThomasMassie just confronted Rep. Jamaal Bowman, who was throwing a very public temper tantrum in the halls of Congress. pic.twitter.com/w4tvzGWARm

— Townhall.com (@townhallcom) March 29, 2023

So since you asked for data about gun violence pic.twitter.com/B2WbJM0yzS

— PdV (@peterdevietien) March 30, 2023

It's all a game, folks. The Obama/Biden Democrats could not care less about gun safety. It's about disarming the general public. That's all it ever was about, right? pic.twitter.com/JUWZX69qla

— Steve (@oldguy_steve) March 30, 2023

BBW12OG said:

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Pass more laws right lefties?????

That's the answer correct????

It's all a game, folks. The Obama/Biden Democrats could not care less about gun safety. It's about disarming the general public. That's all it ever was about, right? pic.twitter.com/JUWZX69qla

— Steve (@oldguy_steve) March 30, 2023

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hokiewolf said:

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packgrad said:

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Very well stated.

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I will admit in the past I could be swayed to "action" after mass shootings due to emotional bias. But the more information I've read in the past year because I became more interested in it after Uvalde and honestly the arguments that were made here during that time has made me realize that emotional bias.

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hokiewolf said:

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Packchem91 said:

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jkpackfan said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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I'm going to apologize to everyone. I'm only interested in honest conversation, and exchanging with PackChem clearly isn't an honest conversation because he isn't interested in that and it derailed the thread.

---

Yeah you're wasting your time, better to put on ignore.

---

Lol. the guys who talk about "participation trophies ruining America" need a safe space from someone presenting actual facts and challenging the absurdity of the "it's not the guns" narrative

---

Lets say for a moment that it is the guns. You've made the case that other countries do not have the same issues as the US. Fine, let's use two of your favorite examples - UK and Australia.

You would seem to be ok with either removing the 2nd amendment or severely limiting it. But that doesn't get you to UK and Australia. You also need to be prepared for severely limiting or eliminating the 4th and 5th amendments as well. You would also need to ignore most of the 1st amendment as well to get to the countries that "don't have an issue with guns" level.

There are over 500 million guns in this country. You ok with trading the odds of being a victim of school shootings that is similar to the odds of being struck by lightening vs the amount of death that will happen with a gun confiscation program?

I think in reality, like most on your side of the argument is you like the idea of more gun laws, but that the unintended consequences of enacting these laws will then lean (as BBW has correctly pointed out) to a disproportionate amount of incarceration of people of color.

You in fact, now see that the EXISTING laws on the books on gun control are being ignored for this very purpose. You can look at New York City for example. Some of the strictest gun laws in the country yet you have prosecutors excusing gun crimes for the purpose of equity.

There are robust straw man purchase laws that are not followed in prosecutions in Chicago again because of equity.

So a great start would be just to enforce the laws that are already on the books. But there seems to be no stomach for doing such things on the progressive end of the political spectrum.

Finally, this BS that if you're 2nd Amendment you're then "Pro mass shooting" is a ludicrous argument to make and doesn't sit in reality.

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hokiewolf said:

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Also Chem, How would have enacting a red flag law type confiscation of guns been seen in this situation. The parents of the shooter have said that they had no business having those guns. What would have been the response in the media if the very Christian parents of a transgender child called the police and red flagged them and had their guns confiscated?

Note: I tried to use the correct pronouns so as not to trigger anyone.

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hokiewolf said:

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Packchem91 said:

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hokiewolf said:

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Packchem91 said:

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jkpackfan said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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I'm going to apologize to everyone. I'm only interested in honest conversation, and exchanging with PackChem clearly isn't an honest conversation because he isn't interested in that and it derailed the thread.

---

Yeah you're wasting your time, better to put on ignore.

---

Lol. the guys who talk about "participation trophies ruining America" need a safe space from someone presenting actual facts and challenging the absurdity of the "it's not the guns" narrative

---

Lets say for a moment that it is the guns. You've made the case that other countries do not have the same issues as the US. Fine, let's use two of your favorite examples - UK and Australia.

You would seem to be ok with either removing the 2nd amendment or severely limiting it. But that doesn't get you to UK and Australia. You also need to be prepared for severely limiting or eliminating the 4th and 5th amendments as well. You would also need to ignore most of the 1st amendment as well to get to the countries that "don't have an issue with guns" level.

There are over 500 million guns in this country. You ok with trading the odds of being a victim of school shootings that is similar to the odds of being struck by lightening vs the amount of death that will happen with a gun confiscation program?

I think in reality, like most on your side of the argument is you like the idea of more gun laws, but that the unintended consequences of enacting these laws will then lean (as BBW has correctly pointed out) to a disproportionate amount of incarceration of people of color.

You in fact, now see that the EXISTING laws on the books on gun control are being ignored for this very purpose. You can look at New York City for example. Some of the strictest gun laws in the country yet you have prosecutors excusing gun crimes for the purpose of equity.

There are robust straw man purchase laws that are not followed in prosecutions in Chicago again because of equity.

So a great start would be just to enforce the laws that are already on the books. But there seems to be no stomach for doing such things on the progressive end of the political spectrum.

Finally, this BS that if you're 2nd Amendment you're then "Pro mass shooting" is a ludicrous argument to make and doesn't sit in reality.

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Let's be clear - it is the guns. Sure, you have to have someone who will pull the trigger

I get it. We'll never get back the weapons out there (though I'd like the policies like in FL where if you break a law, a judge can order them confiscated). Should be extended, if not, to mental stability as well

You discuss the unintended consequences of trying to curb guns. I mean, sure. But Don't we have some pretty severe unintended consequences now?

Here is my issue - there is no one size fits all answer. But when I look at stats and see we have 10x the # of gun killings than any other 1st world country, i gues i see that as "something is broken"
Even factoring out the gang violence (we act as if other countries don't have gangs) - just look at school shootings, we are overwhelmingly the leader in that too

You say enforce the laws - great, but let's not blame one party for that. It's not happening in most red or blue states. Tennessee is a red state but this person has no issue getting guns.

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What law did this person break before committing a crime? You continue to bang on this issue of the number of gun killings is 10x any other country, you're ignoring the simple fact that gun laws on the books are not being prosecuted in the name of equity. The cure for one issue is poison for the other.

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hokiewolf said:

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packgrad said:

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Very well stated.

---

I will admit in the past I could be swayed to "action" after mass shootings due to emotional bias. But the more information I've read in the past year because I became more interested in it after Uvalde and honestly the arguments that were made here during that time has made me realize that emotional bias.

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Wufpack17 said:

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If it were "the guns!!!", then explain why 99.9% of gun owners haven't committed a gun crime?

The issue is people who willingly choose to kill others. This isn't rocket science, this doesn't require mental gymnastics.

You will have to explain to me why we better protect our arenas and concert venues than we do our schools. Hell, you can't get into my office without a key fob! But you can walk right into my kids school. That's a problem.

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Packchem91 said:

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hokiewolf said:

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Also Chem, How would have enacting a red flag law type confiscation of guns been seen in this situation. The parents of the shooter have said that they had no business having those guns. What would have been the response in the media if the very Christian parents of a transgender child called the police and red flagged them and had their guns confiscated?

Note: I tried to use the correct pronouns so as not to trigger anyone.

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LOL, I've not been sure what to call "her"? I'm not even sure was it a girl trying to be a boy or a boy trying to be a girl?

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hokiewolf said:

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Also Chem, How would have enacting a red flag law type confiscation of guns been seen in this situation. The parents of the shooter have said that they had no business having those guns. What would have been the response in the media if the very Christian parents of a transgender child called the police and red flagged them and had their guns confiscated?

Note: I tried to use the correct pronouns so as not to trigger anyone.

---

hokiewolf said:

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Packchem91 said:

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hokiewolf said:

---

Packchem91 said:

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jkpackfan said:

---

Wufpack17 said:

---

I'm going to apologize to everyone. I'm only interested in honest conversation, and exchanging with PackChem clearly isn't an honest conversation because he isn't interested in that and it derailed the thread.

---

Yeah you're wasting your time, better to put on ignore.

---

Lol. the guys who talk about "participation trophies ruining America" need a safe space from someone presenting actual facts and challenging the absurdity of the "it's not the guns" narrative

---

Lets say for a moment that it is the guns. You've made the case that other countries do not have the same issues as the US. Fine, let's use two of your favorite examples - UK and Australia.

You would seem to be ok with either removing the 2nd amendment or severely limiting it. But that doesn't get you to UK and Australia. You also need to be prepared for severely limiting or eliminating the 4th and 5th amendments as well. You would also need to ignore most of the 1st amendment as well to get to the countries that "don't have an issue with guns" level.

There are over 500 million guns in this country. You ok with trading the odds of being a victim of school shootings that is similar to the odds of being struck by lightening vs the amount of death that will happen with a gun confiscation program?

I think in reality, like most on your side of the argument is you like the idea of more gun laws, but that the unintended consequences of enacting these laws will then lean (as BBW has correctly pointed out) to a disproportionate amount of incarceration of people of color.

You in fact, now see that the EXISTING laws on the books on gun control are being ignored for this very purpose. You can look at New York City for example. Some of the strictest gun laws in the country yet you have prosecutors excusing gun crimes for the purpose of equity.

There are robust straw man purchase laws that are not followed in prosecutions in Chicago again because of equity.

So a great start would be just to enforce the laws that are already on the books. But there seems to be no stomach for doing such things on the progressive end of the political spectrum.

Finally, this BS that if you're 2nd Amendment you're then "Pro mass shooting" is a ludicrous argument to make and doesn't sit in reality.

---

Let's be clear - it is the guns. Sure, you have to have someone who will pull the trigger

I get it. We'll never get back the weapons out there (though I'd like the policies like in FL where if you break a law, a judge can order them confiscated). Should be extended, if not, to mental stability as well

You discuss the unintended consequences of trying to curb guns. I mean, sure. But Don't we have some pretty severe unintended consequences now?

Here is my issue - there is no one size fits all answer. But when I look at stats and see we have 10x the # of gun killings than any other 1st world country, i gues i see that as "something is broken"
Even factoring out the gang violence (we act as if other countries don't have gangs) - just look at school shootings, we are overwhelmingly the leader in that too

You say enforce the laws - great, but let's not blame one party for that. It's not happening in most red or blue states. Tennessee is a red state but this person has no issue getting guns.

---

What law did this person break before committing a crime? You continue to bang on this issue of the number of gun killings is 10x any other country, you're ignoring the simple fact that gun laws on the books are not being prosecuted in the name of equity. The cure for one issue is poison for the other.

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caryking said:

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Packchem91 said:

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hokiewolf said:

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Also Chem, How would have enacting a red flag law type confiscation of guns been seen in this situation. The parents of the shooter have said that they had no business having those guns. What would have been the response in the media if the very Christian parents of a transgender child called the police and red flagged them and had their guns confiscated?

Note: I tried to use the correct pronouns so as not to trigger anyone.

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LOL, I've not been sure what to call "her"? I'm not even sure was it a girl trying to be a boy or a boy trying to be a girl?

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Chem, that answers the question of the day!!! Our society is so screwed, from leftist (actually, let's call it MARXIST) ideology that YOU can't simply identify the GENDER of a person.

Why? I think that's what real DIS-INFORMATION or MIS-INFORMATION is from MSM.

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