There is a whole lot of irony in this story, given what we've been led to believe about the politics of masking, etc.
I do wonder, seriously...if those positives were vaccinated or not.

Two more Texas Democrats test positive for COVID after fleeing election vote | Fox News

Mormad said:

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packgrad said:

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Mormad said:

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packgrad said:

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Hard to take the data seriously when there are different standards for reporting the virus and the vaccine. They are still backdating deaths from a year ago as Covid deaths while not reporting deaths after being vaccinated as vaccine deaths. It's pretty much all propaganda at this point. It's unfortunate

---

Idk, man. Sometimes i think people here focus on the inconsequential. Since the vaccines we've seen a drop in cases, hospitalizations, and death. That's not propaganda. And it matters. Nobody knows the true number of vaccine deaths, but do you not feel confident that the vaccine has saved more lives and it has ended? And by a vast amount? Do you not think the number of deaths from COVID-19 has been reduced by the vaccines? Does the minutia change that?

---

I do think the vaccines have helped. I unfortunately also feel the books have been cooked though so there is not an accurate representation of Covid deaths. The reporting and statistics have been agenda based.

A patient can die of heart disease and test positive for Covid and be counted as a Covid death. A person with heart disease can die shortly after getting vaccinated and be considered a death from heart disease. That is my issue. Add to that the fact I went into Afib twice after getting the vaccine when I've never had it in my life. There is no follow up on how I've handled the vaccination so issues like mine don't get represented.

---

A patient dying of heart dz after surgery is still consider a mortality in the perioperative period and goes in the surgeon's and hospital's quality statistics. A person dying of heart dz WITH covid is both a cardiovascular death and a covid death from a health surveillance standpoint. A person dying a cardiac death FROM covid is a covid death, and both are typically listed on the cod. A person dying of heart dz after vax goes on both lists too, and rightfully so. If your afib hasn't been studied to determine if it's related to the vax, is that your fault, your provider's fault, or the government's fault? There's no gman looking over our shoulders telling us how to fill out death certificates or pressuring is to make things look bad. And docs certainly have no secondary gain from this sht. So where are these stats you're worried about coming from?

---

I can assure you it isn't my fault. Why are deaths and cases being added months later if the books aren't being cooked?

Maybe they'll start making people aware of these possible side effects in 6 months to a year the same way they keep adding old cases and deaths to the numbers.

packgrad said:

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Mormad said:

---

packgrad said:

---

Mormad said:

---

packgrad said:

---

Hard to take the data seriously when there are different standards for reporting the virus and the vaccine. They are still backdating deaths from a year ago as Covid deaths while not reporting deaths after being vaccinated as vaccine deaths. It's pretty much all propaganda at this point. It's unfortunate

---

Idk, man. Sometimes i think people here focus on the inconsequential. Since the vaccines we've seen a drop in cases, hospitalizations, and death. That's not propaganda. And it matters. Nobody knows the true number of vaccine deaths, but do you not feel confident that the vaccine has saved more lives and it has ended? And by a vast amount? Do you not think the number of deaths from COVID-19 has been reduced by the vaccines? Does the minutia change that?

---

I do think the vaccines have helped. I unfortunately also feel the books have been cooked though so there is not an accurate representation of Covid deaths. The reporting and statistics have been agenda based.

A patient can die of heart disease and test positive for Covid and be counted as a Covid death. A person with heart disease can die shortly after getting vaccinated and be considered a death from heart disease. That is my issue. Add to that the fact I went into Afib twice after getting the vaccine when I've never had it in my life. There is no follow up on how I've handled the vaccination so issues like mine don't get represented.

---

A patient dying of heart dz after surgery is still consider a mortality in the perioperative period and goes in the surgeon's and hospital's quality statistics. A person dying of heart dz WITH covid is both a cardiovascular death and a covid death from a health surveillance standpoint. A person dying a cardiac death FROM covid is a covid death, and both are typically listed on the cod. A person dying of heart dz after vax goes on both lists too, and rightfully so. If your afib hasn't been studied to determine if it's related to the vax, is that your fault, your provider's fault, or the government's fault? There's no gman looking over our shoulders telling us how to fill out death certificates or pressuring is to make things look bad. And docs certainly have no secondary gain from this sht. So where are these stats you're worried about coming from?

---

I can assure you it isn't my fault. Why are deaths and cases being added months later if the books aren't being cooked?

Maybe they'll start making people aware of these possible side effects in 6 months to a year the same way they keep adding old cases and deaths to the numbers.

---

The advisories are coming out. Even the CDC has made some. Why are they not being talked about? I don't know...

packgrad said:

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Mormad said:

---

packgrad said:

---

Mormad said:

---

packgrad said:

---

Hard to take the data seriously when there are different standards for reporting the virus and the vaccine. They are still backdating deaths from a year ago as Covid deaths while not reporting deaths after being vaccinated as vaccine deaths. It's pretty much all propaganda at this point. It's unfortunate

---

Idk, man. Sometimes i think people here focus on the inconsequential. Since the vaccines we've seen a drop in cases, hospitalizations, and death. That's not propaganda. And it matters. Nobody knows the true number of vaccine deaths, but do you not feel confident that the vaccine has saved more lives and it has ended? And by a vast amount? Do you not think the number of deaths from COVID-19 has been reduced by the vaccines? Does the minutia change that?

---

I do think the vaccines have helped. I unfortunately also feel the books have been cooked though so there is not an accurate representation of Covid deaths. The reporting and statistics have been agenda based.

A patient can die of heart disease and test positive for Covid and be counted as a Covid death. A person with heart disease can die shortly after getting vaccinated and be considered a death from heart disease. That is my issue. Add to that the fact I went into Afib twice after getting the vaccine when I've never had it in my life. There is no follow up on how I've handled the vaccination so issues like mine don't get represented.

---

A patient dying of heart dz after surgery is still consider a mortality in the perioperative period and goes in the surgeon's and hospital's quality statistics. A person dying of heart dz WITH covid is both a cardiovascular death and a covid death from a health surveillance standpoint. A person dying a cardiac death FROM covid is a covid death, and both are typically listed on the cod. A person dying of heart dz after vax goes on both lists too, and rightfully so. If your afib hasn't been studied to determine if it's related to the vax, is that your fault, your provider's fault, or the government's fault? There's no gman looking over our shoulders telling us how to fill out death certificates or pressuring is to make things look bad. And docs certainly have no secondary gain from this sht. So where are these stats you're worried about coming from?

---

I can assure you it isn't my fault. Why are deaths and cases being added months later if the books aren't being cooked?

Maybe they'll start making people aware of these possible side effects in 6 months to a year the same way they keep adding old cases and deaths to the numbers.

---

Yeah, I'm not blaming you. My point was, the side effects or complications of the vaccines can't be discovered, counted, studied, and reported if patients don't bring the issues to their providers or data banks and providers don't document, report, and study the issues. I don't think there's some nefarious underreporting of these side effects to trick people. Data can't be reported that isn't discovered. And once it's discovered, somebody has to determine causation as best they can.

You said there was no follow up to see how you did with the vaccine, so your issues weren't known. There's a website given to you when you get the vaccine to report side effects, and I'm assuming your doctor diagnosed the afib.

Mormad said:

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I don't know a provider who believes hydroxy made a difference

---

Same here. Probably because I don't know many providers. But I'm of the opinion that we'd be better off skipping the vaccines, let natural arrival of herd immunity commence, and for clinical cases, go with monoclonal antibody therapy. There are several mAb developers out there like Enzolytics that have promising products just now coming out of the pipeline.

Mormad said:

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packgrad said:

---

Mormad said:

---

packgrad said:

---

Mormad said:

---

packgrad said:

---

Hard to take the data seriously when there are different standards for reporting the virus and the vaccine. They are still backdating deaths from a year ago as Covid deaths while not reporting deaths after being vaccinated as vaccine deaths. It's pretty much all propaganda at this point. It's unfortunate

---

Idk, man. Sometimes i think people here focus on the inconsequential. Since the vaccines we've seen a drop in cases, hospitalizations, and death. That's not propaganda. And it matters. Nobody knows the true number of vaccine deaths, but do you not feel confident that the vaccine has saved more lives and it has ended? And by a vast amount? Do you not think the number of deaths from COVID-19 has been reduced by the vaccines? Does the minutia change that?

---

I do think the vaccines have helped. I unfortunately also feel the books have been cooked though so there is not an accurate representation of Covid deaths. The reporting and statistics have been agenda based.

A patient can die of heart disease and test positive for Covid and be counted as a Covid death. A person with heart disease can die shortly after getting vaccinated and be considered a death from heart disease. That is my issue. Add to that the fact I went into Afib twice after getting the vaccine when I've never had it in my life. There is no follow up on how I've handled the vaccination so issues like mine don't get represented.

---

A patient dying of heart dz after surgery is still consider a mortality in the perioperative period and goes in the surgeon's and hospital's quality statistics. A person dying of heart dz WITH covid is both a cardiovascular death and a covid death from a health surveillance standpoint. A person dying a cardiac death FROM covid is a covid death, and both are typically listed on the cod. A person dying of heart dz after vax goes on both lists too, and rightfully so. If your afib hasn't been studied to determine if it's related to the vax, is that your fault, your provider's fault, or the government's fault? There's no gman looking over our shoulders telling us how to fill out death certificates or pressuring is to make things look bad. And docs certainly have no secondary gain from this sht. So where are these stats you're worried about coming from?

---

I can assure you it isn't my fault. Why are deaths and cases being added months later if the books aren't being cooked?

Maybe they'll start making people aware of these possible side effects in 6 months to a year the same way they keep adding old cases and deaths to the numbers.

---

Yeah, I'm not blaming you. My point was, the side effects or complications of the vaccines can't be discovered, counted, studied, and reported if patients don't bring the issues to their providers or data banks and providers don't document, report, and study the issues. I don't think there's some nefarious underreporting of these side effects to trick people. Data can't be reported that isn't discovered. And once it's discovered, somebody has to determine causation as best they can.

You said there was no follow up to see how you did with the vaccine, so your issues weren't known. There's a website given to you when you get the vaccine to report side effects, and I'm assuming your doctor diagnosed the afib.

---

Technically Apple and I diagnosed my afib. Doctors screening nurse initially turned me away over the phone. Nothing about the vaccination was in my post visit notes either time I visited. I asked each time if they thought it had anything to do with it.

If I was given a website to report side effects when I got vaccinated, that's news to me. I'm sure it was probably in there somewhere though.

Dow drops more than 700 points on Monday, heads for worst decline of 2021

Public health implications aside, continued economic impacts as long as we have tens of millions of eligible adults unvaccinated are a good reason to try to motivate unvaxxed Americans to get vaxxed.

Whether or not they should be, public health, and public health care, are unfortunately fraught and politically charged but there should be no more bipartisan rallying cry than economic health and avoiding economic growth stagnation due to groundhog day COVID spikes.

Vaccination and ultimately herd immunity is our way off the COVID economic roller coaster.

Oh. Maybe you schedule an appt??

packgrad said:

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Mormad said:

---

packgrad said:

---

Mormad said:

---

packgrad said:

---

Mormad said:

---

packgrad said:

---

Hard to take the data seriously when there are different standards for reporting the virus and the vaccine. They are still backdating deaths from a year ago as Covid deaths while not reporting deaths after being vaccinated as vaccine deaths. It's pretty much all propaganda at this point. It's unfortunate

---

Idk, man. Sometimes i think people here focus on the inconsequential. Since the vaccines we've seen a drop in cases, hospitalizations, and death. That's not propaganda. And it matters. Nobody knows the true number of vaccine deaths, but do you not feel confident that the vaccine has saved more lives and it has ended? And by a vast amount? Do you not think the number of deaths from COVID-19 has been reduced by the vaccines? Does the minutia change that?

---

I do think the vaccines have helped. I unfortunately also feel the books have been cooked though so there is not an accurate representation of Covid deaths. The reporting and statistics have been agenda based.

A patient can die of heart disease and test positive for Covid and be counted as a Covid death. A person with heart disease can die shortly after getting vaccinated and be considered a death from heart disease. That is my issue. Add to that the fact I went into Afib twice after getting the vaccine when I've never had it in my life. There is no follow up on how I've handled the vaccination so issues like mine don't get represented.

---

A patient dying of heart dz after surgery is still consider a mortality in the perioperative period and goes in the surgeon's and hospital's quality statistics. A person dying of heart dz WITH covid is both a cardiovascular death and a covid death from a health surveillance standpoint. A person dying a cardiac death FROM covid is a covid death, and both are typically listed on the cod. A person dying of heart dz after vax goes on both lists too, and rightfully so. If your afib hasn't been studied to determine if it's related to the vax, is that your fault, your provider's fault, or the government's fault? There's no gman looking over our shoulders telling us how to fill out death certificates or pressuring is to make things look bad. And docs certainly have no secondary gain from this sht. So where are these stats you're worried about coming from?

---

I can assure you it isn't my fault. Why are deaths and cases being added months later if the books aren't being cooked?

Maybe they'll start making people aware of these possible side effects in 6 months to a year the same way they keep adding old cases and deaths to the numbers.

---

Yeah, I'm not blaming you. My point was, the side effects or complications of the vaccines can't be discovered, counted, studied, and reported if patients don't bring the issues to their providers or data banks and providers don't document, report, and study the issues. I don't think there's some nefarious underreporting of these side effects to trick people. Data can't be reported that isn't discovered. And once it's discovered, somebody has to determine causation as best they can.

You said there was no follow up to see how you did with the vaccine, so your issues weren't known. There's a website given to you when you get the vaccine to report side effects, and I'm assuming your doctor diagnosed the afib.

---

Technically Apple and I diagnosed my afib. Doctors screening nurse initially turned me away over the phone. Nothing about the vaccination was in my post visit notes either time I visited. I asked each time if they thought it had anything to do with it.

If I was given a website to report side effects when I got vaccinated, that's news to me. I'm sure it was probably in there somewhere though.

---

And unless you notified your primary care doctor, they wouldn't have had your vaccine in your med history. Or at least that is how mine worked....I got my 2nd at a pharmacy on april 30, and when i called my doctor's office last week to get a Rx refill, they asked me if I'd ever been vaccinated.

Perhaps I should have expected that, but I'd bet there are millions of people with no medical record of having been vaccinated, which could impact for downstream impacts.

**as an aside, hope your afib conditions abate. My wife had an early onset of AFib about 20 years ago, when she was still way younger than the normal condition. It was scary then, and every time she has an onset now, it is still worrisome, though with meds, it is usually very short-lived.

Nm

We're gonna keep getting reminded of this for a while

Greg Sankey says 6 of the 14 SEC football teams have reached 80 percent vaccination. "That number needs to grow and grow rapidly." Mentions NC State baseball.

— Stewart Mandel (@slmandel) July 19, 2021

Packchem91 said:

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We're gonna keep getting reminded of this for a while

Greg Sankey says 6 of the 14 SEC football teams have reached 80 percent vaccination. "That number needs to grow and grow rapidly." Mentions NC State baseball.

— Stewart Mandel (@slmandel) July 19, 2021

---

Why do injection rates "need" to go up? We played a college football season last year without the mystery injections. And these are 18-22 year old young people, who are at virtually ZERO risk from this boogeyman cold virus.

This entire covid psyop has ZERO to do with a virus or concern for public health. It's a pile of BS fabricated on bogus testing and bogus "data" on number of cases & deaths, and all about pushing a totalitarian agenda and forcing these injections on the population.

Civilized said:

---

Dow drops more than 700 points on Monday, heads for worst decline of 2021

Public health implications aside, continued economic impacts as long as we have tens of millions of eligible adults unvaccinated are a good reason to try to motivate unvaxxed Americans to get vaxxed.

Whether or not they should be, public health, and public health care, are unfortunately fraught and politically charged but there should be no more bipartisan rallying cry than economic health and avoiding economic growth stagnation due to groundhog day COVID spikes.

Vaccination and ultimately herd immunity is our way off the COVID economic roller coaster.

---

The Dow is down over 750 points and Peloton, one of the best performing stars of the lockdown, is up big. What’s going on? Wall Street is trying to figure out how England, one of the most vaccinated countries in the world, is closing in on an all time high in covid cases. pic.twitter.com/RaUCuLg4N7

— Clay Travis (@ClayTravis) July 19, 2021

More science from AAP.

Everyone older than age 2 should wear masks, regardless of vaccination status, when schools reopen in the fall, according to updated guidance from the American Academy of Pediatrics released Monday. https://t.co/u2OK0gVdy2

— NBC New York (@NBCNewYork) July 19, 2021

packgrad said:

---

More science from AAP.

Everyone older than age 2 should wear masks, regardless of vaccination status, when schools reopen in the fall, according to updated guidance from the American Academy of Pediatrics released Monday. https://t.co/u2OK0gVdy2

— NBC New York (@NBCNewYork) July 19, 2021

---

So are you suggesting the AAP is going against science (or it's best views of the well-being of these younger kids)?
If so, why would they do that? They are trying to change an election or anything.

GuerrillaPack said:

---

Packchem91 said:

---

We're gonna keep getting reminded of this for a while

Greg Sankey says 6 of the 14 SEC football teams have reached 80 percent vaccination. "That number needs to grow and grow rapidly." Mentions NC State baseball.

— Stewart Mandel (@slmandel) July 19, 2021

---

Why do injection rates "need" to go up? We played a college football season last year without the mystery injections. And these are 18-22 year old young people, who are at virtually ZERO risk from this boogeyman cold virus.

This entire covid psyop has ZERO to do with a virus or concern for public health. It's a pile of BS fabricated on bogus testing and bogus "data" on number of cases & deaths, and all about pushing a totalitarian agenda and forcing these injections on the population.

---

But last fall had many game cancellations and reschedules due to covid and contract trcing. Supposedly, Sankey is saying this year, thats a forfeit. Which is why he referenced us.

I think its safe to say, they aren't going to let teams with a bunch of covid cases, however asymptomatic, play.

C'mon, Chem, it's been proven on here over the last several months that the AAP, APA, and other seemingly apolitical medical establishments are actually run by partisan hacks serving as the right hand of Marx himself.

Try to keep up.

Civilized said:

---

C'mon, Chem, it's been proven on here over the last several months that the AAP, APA, and other seemingly apolitical medical establishments are actually run by partisan hacks serving as the right hand of Marx himself.

Try to keep up.

---

Yeah, I just don't get it....for advice on how young kids should handle this, I think the AAP would be in the top 1-2 sources we'd go to...and that yes, since they are dealing with small kids, their guidance may be different from WHO or CDC (though would expect tehre to be consultation).

But I'm sure this updated guidance will trigger a bunch of folks to these types of responses

packgrad said:

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Packchem91 said:

---

packgrad said:

---

More science from AAP.

Everyone older than age 2 should wear masks, regardless of vaccination status, when schools reopen in the fall, according to updated guidance from the American Academy of Pediatrics released Monday. https://t.co/u2OK0gVdy2

— NBC New York (@NBCNewYork) July 19, 2021

---

So are you suggesting the AAP is going against science (or it's best views of the well-being of these younger kids)?
If so, why would they do that? They are trying to change an election or anything.

---

There is no science to justify it.

---

Is it that, or is it that is a more narrowly defined view of the science / medical guidance at hand?

And I'm not trying to be difficult here, I just don't think every single group is out to hold you down.
What benefit does AAP get from suggesting this? If you think its bunk, there must be some weird reason a bunch of pediatricians would go off the beaten path?

Oldsouljer said:

---

packgrad said:

---

More science from AAP.

Everyone older than age 2 should wear masks, regardless of vaccination status, when schools reopen in the fall, according to updated guidance from the American Academy of Pediatrics released Monday. https://t.co/u2OK0gVdy2

— NBC New York (@NBCNewYork) July 19, 2021

---

To call it science should require making a rigorous evidence-based case to the public to justify a policy and the more extreme the measures, the more compelling the justification must be. I don't see anything here but "just do it and stop with the questions."

---

Spot on.

packgrad said:

---

Civilized said:

---

C'mon, Chem, it's been proven on here over the last several months that the AAP, APA, and other seemingly apolitical medical establishments are actually run by partisan hacks serving as the right hand of Marx himself.

Try to keep up.

---

Lol. They're as apolitical as you are independent.

---

I had deleted my earlier joking comment about the AAP having Randi Weingarten on speed dial, but since I saw this... I guess I wasn't far off....

AAP child-masking directive has zero citations to support its masking recommendations, but it does have a citation for their support to send *even more* federal $$$ to all schools, even schools that are closed: it's a teachers union lobbying document.https://t.co/1OBafu00MP pic.twitter.com/DTmkZvsJZd

— Phil Kerpen (@kerpen) July 19, 2021

Civilized said:

---

Dow drops more than 700 points on Monday, heads for worst decline of 2021

Public health implications aside, continued economic impacts as long as we have tens of millions of eligible adults unvaccinated are a good reason to try to motivate unvaxxed Americans to get vaxxed.

Whether or not they should be, public health, and public health care, are unfortunately fraught and politically charged but there should be no more bipartisan rallying cry than economic health and avoiding economic growth stagnation due to groundhog day COVID spikes.

Vaccination and ultimately herd immunity is our way off the COVID economic roller coaster.

---

That is some funny stuff, Civ...

GuerrillaPack said:

---

Packchem91 said:

---

We're gonna keep getting reminded of this for a while

Greg Sankey says 6 of the 14 SEC football teams have reached 80 percent vaccination. "That number needs to grow and grow rapidly." Mentions NC State baseball.

— Stewart Mandel (@slmandel) July 19, 2021

---

Why do injection rates "need" to go up? We played a college football season last year without the mystery injections. And these are 18-22 year old young people, who are at virtually ZERO risk from this boogeyman cold virus.

This entire covid psyop has ZERO to do with a virus or concern for public health. It's a pile of BS fabricated on bogus testing and bogus "data" on number of cases & deaths, and all about pushing a totalitarian agenda and forcing these injections on the population.

---

In the data base, as of today, we've had 328 deaths from kids under 18. Everyone of those deaths had an underlying disease (like leukemia). So, kids, under 18, essentially have a 0% chance of death from COVID.

The ridiculous rules need to change!!

Oh... the UK government announced that 60% of COVID hospitalizations have been vaccinated. Then they restated their number to 40% have been vaccinated! Either number is big number!!!

Let's give the vaccine a big kudos for working so effectively.