Coronavirus

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wilmwolf
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It is my belief that the total number of infections and those that have recovered from infections is much higher than what we know currently. That in turn would make the death rate much lower also. Testing enough to determine the true numbers wouldn't really "do" anything, but if it confirmed that the death rate is much lower, it would ease concerns and speed up the process of getting back towards something that resembles normal. At the very least, North Carolina should count the number of presumed positive cases, ie. the people with mild symptoms whom they are refusing to test, in the total number of positive cases. Not doing so is slanting the numbers.
Just a guy on the sunshine squad.
Mormad
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Yeah man, I agree. I'd love to know those numbers. I guess I'll assume those who are making decisions understand this and use such knowledge and assumptions to guide their decisions that effect us so greatly. Probably not a good assumption based my previous interactions with hospital decision makers or politicians.
Daviewolf83
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Mormad said:

You guys rock with the info you bring. Some of you must spend plenty of time following this thing really closely. Much appreciated.
Since I am now working from home, I am saving almost a 1-1/2 hours a day of time not spent in a car commuting. My typical commute of 18 miles in the morning on a very good day is 30 minutes and on an average day is 40 minutes. My afternoon commute is typically 45 minutes on an average day and an hour or more on a bad day (one or two days a week). So, you can see where some of my extra time is coming from these days.

As to the analysis, I am actually fascinated with statistical modeling. I actually enjoy building spreadsheets and extracting meaningful data from them. I also am quite experienced at quickly digesting lots of data and looking at trends. For the past 10 years, I have worked in the e-Commerce division of my company. We spend a large portion of our time looking at "big data" on an almost daily basis. We use this information to improve the customer's experience on the website and to determine how best to market and sell our products.

My undergraduate degree is Industrial Engineering (I also have an MS in Management) and as people with this degree know, a heavy part of the curriculum is grounded in statistics. As an undergrad, I completed two classes in statistics (the same level statistics majors take), classes in linear programming and stochastic modeling, including heavy emphasis on Markov chains to develop statistical models of systems, and statistical quality control. I have also taken graduate classes in statistics. As a result, I am able to look at graphs and data and quickly figure out what is important and what is not important. For me, it is fun to do and I enjoy getting insights out of the data that can help answer the who, what's and why's.

As to the discussion on false negatives in the testing data, Dr. Birx discussed this yesterday in answer to a question. She was actually surprised by the question, since the person asking it suggested that false negatives could be as high as 35%. Dr. Birx responded with the following quote:

"That would almost be impossible with having 35% positives. If that was true, you would have 100% positive or 66% positive. So what I can tell you is the number of positive tests is tracking very closely with the number of cases diagnosed. So I will look into that. I look at the Roche and Abbott numbers every night. They're trending exactly in the same way and that's important when you're validating data to really validate does this same site In other words, I'm looking between testing sites to see are there consistencies, is there an anomaly to make sure for what you just very specifically asked. So I will go back and look at it more carefully. I haven't seen that kind of anomaly."

I do enjoy the insights you provide as well on this topic, from a medical standpoint. My wife has worked on the administrative side of healthcare for many, many years. Additionally, I have a couple of really good friends who are doctors (one is a general surgeon and one is a cardiologist). I go to them when I have a question that I do not understand. My son is also pre-Med at Wake Forest (in addition to being on the football team), so medicine is topic of focus in our household.
Mormad
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Great stuff, man. That's really cool.

I heard Dr B yesterday. It's interesting because I think most docs are assuming a high FN rate for obvious reasons. There's only one limited study of 1014 Chinese pts that I know of, comparing the sensitivity of chest CT to RT-PCR. The FN rate of RT-PCR was indeed 30%. That's why the question, I think, was fair. The original Chinese doc who blew the whistle had negative tests before he died of covid-19. I think that most docs are telling those with typical symptoms that test negative to still assume they're positive from a social isolation standpoint. Im also encouraged and concerned about the 94-95% negative test rate when testing suspected cases. We're either bad at choosing who to test, or many with typical symptoms have more typical viral syndromes (this is the hope), or there are lots of FNs. I didn't really understand her reasoning (and maybe you can help me with the statistical math) for thinking a 30% FN rate seemed impossible. I suspect when she said the number of positive tests correlate with diagnosed cases she was assuming repeat testing also, otherwise wouldn't the two ALWAYS correlate (positive test = confirmed diagnosis)??? Thanks for any insight.
Wayland
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As long as one of these nursing homes doesn't blow up, I think the death toll will stay relatively low. But just one of these facilities can inflate numbers up because they are so filled with at risk population.

And now no matter what, we will see severely at risk elderly, trickle in with 'corona' related deaths. We will never be at '0' corona deaths again because it is everywhere.
RunsWithWolves26
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Wayland said:

As long as one of these nursing homes doesn't blow up, I think the death toll will stay relatively low. But just one of these facilities can inflate numbers up because they are so filled with at risk population.

And now no matter what, we will see severely at risk elderly, trickle in with 'corona' related deaths. We will never be at '0' corona deaths again because it is everywhere.


Argued with my dad for weeks to get my grandma out if the nursing home. He didn't think it was needed. He finally figured out it was.
RunsWithWolves26
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Just saw a headline ticker that says and I quote exactly, "talking and breathing can help spread COVID19". I have just about gotten to the point where I ain't even listening to "experts" anymore. What type of moronic statement is that?!! I guess you can stop this virus by just not talking and not breathing. Damn what an expert.
Wayland
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I was thinking about true rate of spread.

Roughly 22% of NC residents are under 18 but only account for 1% of the positive tests.

Do we really think they aren't ACTUALLY positive at a rate outside the rest of the population?


Again, would love to see true sampling.
Packchem91
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So these #s for Meck County seem very concerning. Data is from the Meck County officials to Brett Jensen, a reporter here in CLT.
Earlier today, it was 560 cases in Meck, next most in area was 60 in Union and 56 in Cabarrus, which are certainly low by comparison to other similarly sized states.

But then he tweeted that officials are suggesting, if curve is not flattened....

in late april, 8900 hospitalized, 3300 in ICU, and 1600 on ventilators.

If flattened, peak is in mid-May, and 4700 hospitalized, 1700 in ICU, and 850 on ventilators.

Those are huge #s, considering where things stand today. Not sure how many cases that suggests, but hospitalizations have been, what 10-20% of cases?
RunsWithWolves26
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Packchem91 said:

So these #s for Meck County seem very concerning. Data is from the Meck County officials to Brett Jensen, a reporter here in CLT.
Earlier today, it was 560 cases in Meck, next most in area was 60 in Union and 56 in Cabarrus, which are certainly low by comparison to other similarly sized states.

But then he tweeted that officials are suggesting, if curve is not flattened....

in late april, 8900 hospitalized, 3300 in ICU, and 1600 on ventilators.

If flattened, peak is in mid-May, and 4700 hospitalized, 1700 in ICU, and 850 on ventilators.

Those are huge #s, considering where things stand today. Not sure how many cases that suggests, but hospitalizations have been, what 10-20% of cases?


For me personally, I've basically stopped paying any attention to projections, models this or that. They've been so wrong and so far off this entire time that it's almost like looking at a weather model saying a hurricane is going to make a direct hit on your house 5 days out.
wilmwolf
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RunsWithWolves26 said:

Just saw a headline ticker that says and I quote exactly, "talking and breathing can help spread COVID19". I have just about gotten to the point where I ain't even listening to "experts" anymore. What type of moronic statement is that?!! I guess you can stop this virus by just not talking and not breathing. Damn what an expert.


If everyone stops breathing at the same time, the virus definitely won't spread. We'll all be dead, but that's beside the point.
Just a guy on the sunshine squad.
Colonel Armstrong
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Packchem91 said:

So these #s for Meck County seem very concerning. Data is from the Meck County officials to Brett Jensen, a reporter here in CLT.
Earlier today, it was 560 cases in Meck, next most in area was 60 in Union and 56 in Cabarrus, which are certainly low by comparison to other similarly sized states.

But then he tweeted that officials are suggesting, if curve is not flattened....

in late april, 8900 hospitalized, 3300 in ICU, and 1600 on ventilators.

If flattened, peak is in mid-May, and 4700 hospitalized, 1700 in ICU, and 850 on ventilators.

Those are huge #s, considering where things stand today. Not sure how many cases that suggests, but hospitalizations have been, what 10-20% of cases?
NC has basically been shut down for two weeks now. How is our peak not going to be this coming week with a decline starting mid April?
Packchem91
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King Leary said:

Packchem91 said:

So these #s for Meck County seem very concerning. Data is from the Meck County officials to Brett Jensen, a reporter here in CLT.
Earlier today, it was 560 cases in Meck, next most in area was 60 in Union and 56 in Cabarrus, which are certainly low by comparison to other similarly sized states.

But then he tweeted that officials are suggesting, if curve is not flattened....

in late april, 8900 hospitalized, 3300 in ICU, and 1600 on ventilators.

If flattened, peak is in mid-May, and 4700 hospitalized, 1700 in ICU, and 850 on ventilators.

Those are huge #s, considering where things stand today. Not sure how many cases that suggests, but hospitalizations have been, what 10-20% of cases?
NC has basically been shut down for two weeks now. How is our peak not going to be this coming week with a decline starting mid April?
That's what I had been thinking. And I could maybe have seen these #s if all of NC...but reportedly, that was just Mecklenburg County. Seems off to me.

Maybe it was context of, "if we had not acted..."
Ground_Chuck
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NC isn't shut down. People are still out and about. Just less than normal.

An a later peak is preferable. If I'm you flatten the curve, the peak moves out.
RunsWithWolves26
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wilmwolf80 said:

RunsWithWolves26 said:

Just saw a headline ticker that says and I quote exactly, "talking and breathing can help spread COVID19". I have just about gotten to the point where I ain't even listening to "experts" anymore. What type of moronic statement is that?!! I guess you can stop this virus by just not talking and not breathing. Damn what an expert.


If everyone stops breathing at the same time, the virus definitely won't spread. We'll all be dead, but that's beside the point.


Exactly! What an absolutely asshat thing for an expert to say. If these are experts, damnit, I ain't gonna believe anything they ever say. What damn degree did this expert get to make such a stupid comment?
RunsWithWolves26
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Just saw on worldometers, NC is at 27 deaths, up 9 today.
CLA327
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A member of my family is a nurse with specialized training in infectious diseases. She said if the covid virus is truly airborne (however the science isn't settled on this yet), then it can most certainly be spread through breathing and/or talking.
RunsWithWolves26
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CLA327 said:

A member of my family is a nurse with specialized training in infectious diseases. She said if the covid virus is truly airborne (however the science isn't settled on this yet), then it can most certainly be spread through breathing and/or talking.


Congrats on your first post but you totally missed the point of my post. The headline literally ran on the bottom of the screen "Breaking News. Expert says breathing and talking can spread COVID19." We already know that. Why in the blue hell is that breaking news and breaking news from an expert nonetheless?!?! If that statement classifies someone as an expert, then I'm a damn Einstein and half the time, I can't add 2+2 and get 4!
Wayland
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RunsWithWolves26 said:

Just saw on worldometers, NC is at 27 deaths, up 9 today.


We'll see, the increase is based off of a cited NandO article that isnt even consistent within itself on deaths. Later in the article they only list 6 deaths today. That being said, not much difference between 6 and 9. But I think worldometers made a mistake here using different trackers instead of just DHHS. Even WRAL hasnt posted that high yet and they love dead people, maybe they are slacking.
CLA327
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Don't get your panties in a wad, Wolfie. I just told you that if the virus is truly airborne, it could be transmitted via breathing and/or talking.

One other bit of advice, if you are going to keep referencing Dr. Birx repeatedly, please learn to spell her name properly.

You're welcome......hahahahahahahaaaaa
RunsWithWolves26
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CLA327 said:

Don't get your panties in a wad, Wolfie. I just told you that if the virus is truly airborne, it could be transmitted via breathing and/or talking.

One other bit of advice, if you are going to keep referencing Dr. Birx repeatedly, please learn to spell her name properly.

You're welcome......hahahahahahahaaaaa


You still don't get the joke but that is ok. Very good second post. I will star it for you in hopes it gets you to a 3 star post!
Mormad
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I think they're simply making the point that you don't have to cough or sneeze in somebody's face to transmit this. Simple conversation can be a risk of transmission. I suspect many people didn't really expect that, so the expert is just trying to inform the masses and maybe offer why the CDC will soon ask that we all wear masks in public.
Daviewolf83
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King Leary said:

Packchem91 said:

So these #s for Meck County seem very concerning. Data is from the Meck County officials to Brett Jensen, a reporter here in CLT.
Earlier today, it was 560 cases in Meck, next most in area was 60 in Union and 56 in Cabarrus, which are certainly low by comparison to other similarly sized states.

But then he tweeted that officials are suggesting, if curve is not flattened....

in late april, 8900 hospitalized, 3300 in ICU, and 1600 on ventilators.

If flattened, peak is in mid-May, and 4700 hospitalized, 1700 in ICU, and 850 on ventilators.

Those are huge #s, considering where things stand today. Not sure how many cases that suggests, but hospitalizations have been, what 10-20% of cases?
NC has basically been shut down for two weeks now. How is our peak not going to be this coming week with a decline starting mid April?
NC has been only partially shutdown for two weeks.Not all counties had shutdown orders. Also, even though it was shutdown, some people did not follow the guidelines. We will not peak in the coming week. NYC does have a chance to peak, but based on the curves I looked at this morning, NC is not close to peaking on cases. Case numbers are increasing on a percentage basis daily and until this flattens, NC will not peak. Also, deaths will not peak until approximately two weeks after cases peak (deaths are lagging indicator). Likely, deaths will not peak until the end of April, first of May - unless something kicks in and causes daily case increases to flatten and then reverse.
Daviewolf83
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Mormad said:

Great stuff, man. That's really cool.

I heard Dr B yesterday. It's interesting because I think most docs are assuming a high FN rate for obvious reasons. There's only one limited study of 1014 Chinese pts that I know of, comparing the sensitivity of chest CT to RT-PCR. The FN rate of RT-PCR was indeed 30%. That's why the question, I think, was fair. The original Chinese doc who blew the whistle had negative tests before he died of covid-19. I think that most docs are telling those with typical symptoms that test negative to still assume they're positive from a social isolation standpoint. Im also encouraged and concerned about the 94-95% negative test rate when testing suspected cases. We're either bad at choosing who to test, or many with typical symptoms have more typical viral syndromes (this is the hope), or there are lots of FNs. I didn't really understand her reasoning (and maybe you can help me with the statistical math) for thinking a 30% FN rate seemed impossible. I suspect when she said the number of positive tests correlate with diagnosed cases she was assuming repeat testing also, otherwise wouldn't the two ALWAYS correlate (positive test = confirmed diagnosis)??? Thanks for any insight.
Sorry I did not respond earlier. I am just getting back online. I went with my son to a football field to help chase down footballs while he did some punting practice.

I understand what you are saying about the Chinese tests and I do remember reports that some of the tests being used by other countries had false positives in the 30% range.It is possible this is what the reporter was referring to or she may have confused the reporting on the earlier tests with the testing the US is doing.I can see where this can get confusing. The fact other nations are using different tests does make it hard to get clean data. This has been one of the tougher things for the modelers to deal with when they try to construct their models. They are trying to account for some of these methodology differences and also dealing with noisy data. The way to deal with noise in data is to get more data. Unfortunately, the US is still not testing to the level they should be, so the researchers are left with models that are less than perfect.

It is concerning that 95% of test cases are coming back negative, since these end up being wasted tests.It is likely one of the reasons why NC has told people to not come for testing if they have the symptoms, but are doing okay from a breathing perspective. I think part of the issue is that we are in allergy season - at the same time a virus is hitting that produces similar types of symptoms (runny nose, cough, sneezing, headaches). I know I have been dealing with them for a couple of weeks and have taken a Claritin every couple of days to knock down the symptoms.

As to Dr. Birx's comments on 30% not being possible, she is seeing data that we are not seeing (but I would like to see it). With any testing process, there are statistics being captured on the actual process controls. You measure your process accuracy (in this case testing accuracy) by looking at the means and standard deviations of the process. She mentioned she is looking at data coming in from the different testing processes (Roche and Abbott Labs were mentioned and I know their tests are different) and comparing the results.

I suspect she is looking at some of the testing process data from these tests to draw conclusions on the accuracy. As I understand the testing, when they setup the tests to run, they have to test known positive and known negative samples. If this is the case, they can generate statistics on the accuracy of the testing setup. I suspect they are doing this regularly to insure the testing processes stay in acceptable bounds of standard deviation. If they start to see data (ie., results from the test outside the defined limits - typically we would use 3 times the standard deviation), it would indicate there is an issue with the testing equipment setup and it needs to be fixed. Also, since there are different testing methodologies being used, they are likely correlating the results between the different tests and if all of them are producing strongly correlated results, it would give her confidence that all of the different tests are stable and accurate.

I hope this makes sense.
Wayland
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Looks like those deaths are adding up. What is going on in Guilford County with all these deaths.
lumberpack5
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Wayland said:

Looks like those deaths are adding up. What is going on in Guilford County with all these deaths.
Guilford County has several exacerbating features I would think.

1. PTI Airport
2. I-85 and I-40
3. Two Urban Population Centers
4. A ton of old people who worked in the textile and furniture or fuels industries in the 60's, 70's, 80's etc.
5. Five Colleges - UNCG, NCAT, Guilford, Greensboro, and High Point U
6. A lot of hard core Sunday and Wednesday night church goers

Greensboro and High Point are effectively the State's largest mill villages. Smoking and past lung damage due to certain types of work, combined with the density of the some of the older housing stock in Greensboro and HP, and the students who would have been coming and going on Spring Break.

Their population demographic is more vulnerable than Wakes or Mecks from the get go.

But this is hypothesis. It could all be one stricken rest home.
I like the athletic type
Daviewolf83
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lumberpack5 said:

Wayland said:

Looks like those deaths are adding up. What is going on in Guilford County with all these deaths.
Guilford County has several exacerbating features I would think.

1. PTI Airport
2. I-85 and I-40
3. Two Urban Population Centers
4. A ton of old people who worked in the textile and furniture or fuels industries in the 60's, 70's, 80's etc.
5. Five Colleges - UNCG, NCAT, Guilford, Greensboro, and High Point U
6. A lot of hard core Sunday and Wednesday night church goers

Greensboro and High Point are effectively the State's largest mill villages. Smoking and past lung damage due to certain types of work, combined with the density of the some of the older housing stock in Greensboro and HP, and the students who would have been coming and going on Spring Break.

Their population demographic is more vulnerable than Wakes or Mecks from the get go.

But this is hypothesis. It could all be one stricken rest home.

I would also be interested in knowing the ages of the people who died. Currently in NC, 79% of deaths are people who are 65+, which we know is a big issue. You can really see how disproportionate this is when you also see 43% of the cases are people in the 25-49 year old range.

I have heard the state may issue even more strict guidelines after they review the cellphone records Google is publishing. Anyone can look at this data and if you want to see the NC data, you can go to the following URL:

Google Cellphone Tracking - North Carolina Report

The data is listed by country, so I did a quick look at the data and for the most part, I think Wake County where I live, is doing well. Grocery store and pharmacy visits seem to be okay, considering this is considered a necessary activity. The big area they may add restrictions to, based on the data is Parks and Recreation areas. I know they have encouraged people to exercise, but this seems to be an area where activity is way up and based on latest new case curves, NC is not bending the curve as much as we need to bend it.

If you want to see the full data set, you can use this link:

Google Mobility Covid-19 Reports


kmb717
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Worldomoter has now added columns for Total Tests and Tests/ 1 million people. As you can see as of this morning, we are still not doing anywhere close to the amount of testing we need to be. If we want to get back to normal, the only way to do that prior to a vaccine is mass testing. And unfortunately right now, we are no where close.
Daviewolf83
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kmb717 said:

Worldomoter has now added columns for Total Tests and Tests/ 1 million people. As you can see as of this morning, we are still not doing anywhere close to the amount of testing we need to be. If we want to get back to normal, the only way to do that prior to a vaccine is mass testing. And unfortunately right now, we are no where close.
To get out of the lockdowns we need to get to a point of doing Test and Trace. Dr. Fauci even said that after we get through this wave, we can avoid future lockdowns by using more specific testing and only isolating those people who have the virus or people who come in contact with this person.

To do Test and Trace, you have to test:
- Anyone who comes in contact regularly with at risk people - healthcare workers, nursing home workers, and people who work in service industries. If negative,they continue to do their normal activities.
- If any are found to be positive, you do contact tracing to find the people they came in contact with and test them. You quarantine anyone that tested positive and the rest go about their normal lives.
- You test anyone who shows symptoms. If positive, they quarantine and you do contract tracing to test everyone else they came in contact with when they may have been contagious. If any of them are positive, you quarantine them and do contact tracing on their contacts.

This is how we return to more normal lives. It is difficult to do contact tracing now due to:
- We are seeing a massive number of positive cases and people needing testing that is overwhelming the labs. This is extending the time it is taking to report on the test results.
- The rapid tests are not fully deployed yet and there are limited machines that can do the test. As such, they are currently allocated to areas of critical need.
- Current technology requires people administering the tests to where PPD which is currently seeing short supply in many areas.

Until the virus is more under control - models suggest by June/July, you can not really do large-scale Test-and-Trace. Once we do get to a point where labs are not overwhelmed, when we have tests that either do not require the wearing of PPD's (ie., self-tests where a person an swab themselves - these tests are coming), and we have more rapid test capabilities, Test-and-Trace will be possible and it must be implemented. It offers the best alternative in the absence of a vaccine.

Based on past statements from Dr.Fauci and others, it is likely the earliest we would see a vaccine is the first of next year. Quite frankly, I think this is the fastest we should expect it to be available. Developing vaccines is risky. They can:
- work in vitro, but not in animals or humans
- work in animals, but fail in humans
- fail in human testing

Failure would mean they either fail to produce the antibodies necessary to protect us from the virus or they cause complications that make them unsafe to administer. People should hope and pray we get an effective vaccine by early next year, but just realize their are risks that could delay it.

I also worry the vaccine they come up with only works for the current version of the virus, but the virus mutates. Every year, the experts try to predict the strain (or mutation) of flu virus that will be the most common version and design a vaccine around this strain, but they sometimes get it wrong and the vaccine is not as helpful as it was hoped.

There is a concern the coronovirus will mutate rapidly, creating so many strains that it becomes difficult to develop a vaccine. This is the case with the common cold which is also a coronavirus. There are too many versions to effectively create a vaccine for all the possible strains of the cold virus. We develop "herd immunity" to many versions of the cold virus mutation (especially when we are children), but there are so many versions, it is difficult to encounter them all and develop immunity.


Mormad
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Daviewolf83 said:

kmb717 said:

Worldomoter has now added columns for Total Tests and Tests/ 1 million people. As you can see as of this morning, we are still not doing anywhere close to the amount of testing we need to be. If we want to get back to normal, the only way to do that prior to a vaccine is mass testing. And unfortunately right now, we are no where close.
To get out of the lockdowns we need to get to a point of doing Test and Trace. Dr. Fauci even said that after we get through this wave, we can avoid future lockdowns by using more specific testing and only isolating those people who have the virus or people who come in contact with this person.

To do Test and Trace, you have to test:
- Anyone who comes in contact regularly with at risk people - healthcare workers, nursing home workers, and people who work in service industries. If negative,they continue to do their normal activities.
- If any are found to be positive, you do contact tracing to find the people they came in contact with and test them. You quarantine anyone that tested positive and the rest go about their normal lives.
- You test anyone who shows symptoms. If positive, they quarantine and you do contract tracing to test everyone else they came in contact with when they may have been contagious. If any of them are positive, you quarantine them and do contact tracing on their contacts.

This is how we return to more normal lives. It is difficult to do contact tracing now due to:
- We are seeing a massive number of positive cases and people needing testing that is overwhelming the labs. This is extending the time it is taking to report on the test results.
- The rapid tests are not fully deployed yet and there are limited machines that can do the test. As such, they are currently allocated to areas of critical need.
- Current technology requires people administering the tests to where PPD which is currently seeing short supply in many areas.

Until the virus is more under control - models suggest by June/July, you can not really do large-scale Test-and-Trace. Once we do get to a point where labs are not overwhelmed, when we have tests that either do not require the wearing of PPD's (ie., self-tests where a person an swab themselves - these tests are coming), and we have more rapid test capabilities, Test-and-Trace will be possible and it must be implemented. It offers the best alternative in the absence of a vaccine.

Based on past statements from Dr.Fauci and others, it is likely the earliest we would see a vaccine is the first of next year. Quite frankly, I think this is the fastest we should expect it to be available. Developing vaccines is risky. They can:
- work in vitro, but not in animals or humans
- work in animals, but fail in humans
- fail in human testing

Failure would mean they either fail to produce the antibodies necessary to protect us from the virus or they cause complications that make them unsafe to administer. People should hope and pray we get an effective vaccine by early next year, but just realize their are risks that could delay it.

I also worry the vaccine they come up with only works for the current version of the virus, but the virus mutates. Every year, the experts try to predict the strain (or mutation) of flu virus that will be the most common version and design a vaccine around this strain, but they sometimes get it wrong and the vaccine is not as helpful as it was hoped.

There is a concern the coronovirus will mutate rapidly, creating so many strains that it becomes difficult to develop a vaccine. This is the case with the common cold which is also a coronavirus. There are too many versions to effectively create a vaccine for all the possible strains of the cold virus. We develop "herd immunity" to many versions of the cold virus mutation (especially when we are children), but there are so many versions, it is difficult to encounter them all and develop immunity.





Really really great post
Wayland
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Wayland said:

https://www.ncdhhs.gov/covid-19-case-count-nc

3/31/2020 Morning DHHS update

NC Cases*
1,498
NC Deaths**
8
Currently Hospitalized
157

4/1/2020 Morning DHHS update

NC Cases*
1584
NC Deaths**
10
Currently Hospitalized
204


4/2/2020 Morning DHHS update (as of 11:00am)

NC Cases*
1857
NC Deaths**
16
Currently Hospitalized
184

4/3/2020 Morning DHHS update (as of 11:25am)

NC Cases*
2093
NC Deaths**
19
Currently Hospitalized
259

Guilford now shows 3 deaths and Mecklenburg 2.

15 deaths > 65 age (20% of positive cases)
2 deaths between 50-64 age (28% of positive cases)
2 deaths between 25-49 age (43% of positive cases)

2919 additional completed tests, 236 positive results for a 8.1% positive test rate day to day.

4/4/2020 Morning DHHS update (as of 11:00am)

NC Cases*
2402
NC Deaths**
24
Currently Hospitalized
271

Looks like DHHS is lagging in numbers today, since we should have had at least 5 more deaths in the morning count. Guilford only showing 3 deaths in this count and they are at 5 or 6. DHHS only reports lab confirmed reported deaths, so maybe the local health departments either aren't reporting or don't have lab confirmation on the media counts?

Congregate Data:
6 Nursing Homes, 4 Residential Care, 2 Correctional Facilities, and 1 Other have 2 more more lab confirmed cases. Considered Outbreak.
BruceDouble
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I think a lot of us are stat geeks here and this thread shows it haha.

I believe it's been mentioned but one thing I've been looking at is NC is the 10th most populated state but ranks 20th now in cases. Thats good.

We've been hovering around 18-19 in cases but I think Virginia just passed us.
WolfQuacker
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Finally got my test results back from my 3/22 test. Positive, as expected. I'm about 75% recovered. 5 days without fever, but still get winded really easily. Y'all be safe, it's not a fun disease.
kmb717
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Davie I think that was the best post of this entire thread. I agree with everything you mentioned.
PackMom
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WolfQuacker said:

Finally got my test results back from my 3/22 test. Positive, as expected. I'm about 75% recovered. 5 days without fever, but still get winded really easily. Y'all be safe, it's not a fun disease.
Glad to hear you're on the rebound. Take care of yourself. How is your family?
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