Daviewolf83 said:

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dogplasma said:

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Does anyone have a graph or source showing current ICU capacity in NC? The story out of Alabama is pretty alarming. Wondering how we're trending.

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Here's a graph showing the percentage of ICU capacity utilized on a daily basis.




Graph below shows the number of empty and occupied ICU beds across NC. Please note the reduction in the number of total ICU beds, since the Winter Wave, when capacity was at its highest.

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Thanks. When I said "anyone" I mostly meant you. .

Where does this come from, the CDC? I looked recently (admittedly briefly) and the ICU trend data I found had stopped trending back in March.

I'm no fan of masks - certainly not outdoors and especially not with vaccines widely available to everyone - but if returning to indoor masks helps keep us from overwhelming our hospitals then I'll get on board with it. It just seems like it should have been so easily avoidable.

covidestim with their overnight NC county updates. Again, just a model, so use caution.

How could Covid have been so easily avoidable?

packgrad said:

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How could Covid have been so easily avoidable?

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If their self-appointed Queen Hilldog would have won..... non-issue.

Now they are making sure they have complete control over elections like in California.

22 million ballots were mailed out this week for the recall election. Guess who mandated that? The very man that is being recalled.

There is nothing slimier than a Democrat. And present company is included. Sorry folks... but the truth is the truth.

Still waiting on President Trump's Nobel Peace Prize for curing the flu and the common cold.

Wayland said:

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dogplasma said:

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Daviewolf83 said:

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dogplasma said:

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Does anyone have a graph or source showing current ICU capacity in NC? The story out of Alabama is pretty alarming. Wondering how we're trending.

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Here's a graph showing the percentage of ICU capacity utilized on a daily basis.




Graph below shows the number of empty and occupied ICU beds across NC. Please note the reduction in the number of total ICU beds, since the Winter Wave, when capacity was at its highest.

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Thanks. When I said "anyone" I mostly meant you. .

Where does this come from, the CDC? I looked recently (admittedly briefly) and the ICU trend data I found had stopped trending back in March.

I'm no fan of masks - certainly not outdoors and especially not with vaccines widely available to everyone - but if returning to indoor masks helps keep us from overwhelming our hospitals then I'll get on board with it. It just seems like it should have been so easily avoidable.

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Indoor masking mandates have had no visible significant impact on case curves anywhere.

If you watch per capita case patterns of geographic and demographic similar areas with and without mandates, you will see no discernable significant difference.

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I don't have any data....but is that because the masks don't work, or because people still don't wear the in the most likely places to spread the virus -- at home, or more casual settings?

The current cases I mentioned yesterday that affected people I know. (1) two families with kids at a beach house, one kid was sick, he infected 2 boys in another family, then both parents in taht family got it. Even if they wore masks to a mall, school, etc, they would have still gotten it. (2) husband gets it -- no idea how/when/where - - but then wife, who is vaccinated and complies with masks when required, gets it from her husband, surely at home.

So....there could have been all kinds of mask mandates in place, and the masks could have been effective, but the vast majority of that spread would have occurred anyway.

ETA: I'm not arguing that masks are effective, just that if the metrics you reference don't clarify of the person was masked at the workplace and caught it, or was sleeping next to his wife and caught it, it's not really measuring mask effectiveness?

Ill admit there are a couple other factors that are going into it for me. It would just be the straw that broke the camels back.

I wore a mask during the first round of the Stanley Cup Playoffs when they were still requiring them despite being vaccinated. But there is a very large difference in a freezing building vs an outdoor stadium in summer heat (in my opinion, at least)

Definitely in a wait and see mode with it all. Im with Davie that I expect the state wide indoor mandate to return (despite my hatred for the move). Im not sold on the others yet, but we will see

packgrad said:

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So you want to prove that they don't work as opposed to that they do work? I'm not understanding your not arguing argument about mask effectiveness when sleeping beside an unmasked spouse.

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LOL. Can you imagine that there are actually people that sleep with masks on?!?

The thought has never even crossed my mind once... but now that it's been brought up, I'm sure there are some that probably do it. Hilarious!

BTW. How many people are actually dying from this in comparison to the last time when virtually the entire country was wearing masks?!?

Packchem91 said:

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Daviewolf83 said:

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Packchem91 said:

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Daviewolf83 said:

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I am guessing Cooper is going to announce some or all of the following:

1. Statewide indoor mask mandate, including for all schools. He will effectively over-rule any locale that has made it masking in schools optional. Personally, I believe this is the most likely thing he will put in place.
2. Requirement that all state employees, including teachers, be vaccinated. This one could be interesting, since some teachers could quit and most school systems are not fully staffed for the Fall and many have significant vacancies.
3. Outdoor mask mandate for all events - similar to what LA is now requiring. This would be in addition to an indoor mask mandate throughout the state.
4. Vaccination/negative test requirements for all indoor events.

I do not believe he will institute capacity limits, since this would be met with major revolt across the state, just as football season is about to start.

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That one would be shocking to me....has there yet to be any link between outdoor activities and covid spread? Even if you look at our baseball team....isn't it much much more likely that spread to the vaccinated players happened in dining, meeting rooms, hotel rooms, etc?

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No, but it did not stop LA from putting that exact mandate in place today. For example, a mask must be worn at all outdoor sporting events, including professional events. There is not much science behind a lot of mandates being put in place. It is all about giving the appearance the government is doing something - even if what they are doing will have little to any impact on the growth in cases.

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Agree, that one would be for show, fo sho.
But it would also be surprising because the Panthers just announced a policy that was only indoors in the stadium...and I'd be hard pressed to believe there would not have been some consultation between the state and the Panthers (if not, someone screwed up).

It would certainly create a nightmare for police and school staff on Friday night. One thing to make kids in school comply....but their parents and other community folks at a FB game? Ugly.

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I would never concede that kids in school deserve this crap.

Add this to the list of red flags that expose "covid" as a psyop and used to further an agenda...

The mantra now is the "vaccines are the ONLY way to beat the pandemic". This is false, and governments and the Establishment are completely ignoring ivermectin and other treatments. I've heard that in many hospitals with "covid patients", they do not even really treat the patients with any significant drugs or other treatments, and essentially just wait until things get bad and then put the person on a ventilator. And putting them on the ventilator is what actually kills many patients.

Similarly, governments and the Establishment have completely "memory-holed" natural immunity that covid-recovered patients have. Natural immunity is far better than anything a vaccine can offer. And yet, they keep pushing the vaccines as the "only" and "best" way to "beat covid".

The reason they are pushing vaccination so hard is because vaccine passports (aka "vaccine ID") are the first step in implementing this Chinese-style "social credit score" system, which is a precursor to a "Mark of the Beast" type system.

Has it been proven that most of the spread occurs at home? That's a new one on me...

And how, pray tell does the virus get into said home to begin with?

Mormad said:

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I must love Wolfpack football way too much, because there's no way in hell I'm letting a "flimsy arse mask" keep me out of the Carter when those gates open, my friends. That's like not seeing my family, and it's letting idiots win.

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I might in November, I'm not in September. Having worn masks all last summer, sometimes in attics, sometimes carrying ladders up and down three flights of stairs in the heat, it's just different. I already don't enjoy early season games in the east side sun, enduring that while also feeling that my ability to breathe is restricted, just not something I want to do. I wore my mask to the one game I was allowed to go to last year, and it was fine because it was cold, but in the summer heat, nah.

Packchem91 said:

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packgrad said:

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So you want to prove that they don't work as opposed to that they do work? I'm not understanding your not arguing argument about mask effectiveness when sleeping beside an unmasked spouse.

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So Way said metrics don't show improvement in areas where mask mandates are in effect. Well, is that because masks are ineffective, or because people wear them out in public but then take them off when they get home.

How can you say "look, masks don't work", when the reality is, most of the spread occurs in homes, where masks are not, and have never been worn?

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Do you think people wear masks at home where mask mandates are in effect? I tend to think the home situation is the same where there are mask mandates and where there are not.

wilmwolf80 said:

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Mormad said:

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I must love Wolfpack football way too much, because there's no way in hell I'm letting a "flimsy arse mask" keep me out of the Carter when those gates open, my friends. That's like not seeing my family, and it's letting idiots win.

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I might in November, I'm not in September. Having worn masks all last summer, sometimes in attics, sometimes carrying ladders up and down three flights of stairs in the heat, it's just different. I already don't enjoy early season games in the east side sun, enduring that while also feeling that my ability to breathe is restricted, just not something I want to do. I wore my mask to the one game I was allowed to go to last year, and it was fine because it was cold, but in the summer heat, nah.

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Do you equate carrying ladders up and down three flights of stairs with what you would experience at an NC State football game? I mean I totally get not wanting to wear a mask but it's readily apparent that you can get away with pretty much anything, including a gaiter.

statefan91 said:

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wilmwolf80 said:

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Mormad said:

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I must love Wolfpack football way too much, because there's no way in hell I'm letting a "flimsy arse mask" keep me out of the Carter when those gates open, my friends. That's like not seeing my family, and it's letting idiots win.

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I might in November, I'm not in September. Having worn masks all last summer, sometimes in attics, sometimes carrying ladders up and down three flights of stairs in the heat, it's just different. I already don't enjoy early season games in the east side sun, enduring that while also feeling that my ability to breathe is restricted, just not something I want to do. I wore my mask to the one game I was allowed to go to last year, and it was fine because it was cold, but in the summer heat, nah.

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Do you equate carrying ladders up and down three flights of stairs with what you would experience at an NC State football game? I mean I totally get not wanting to wear a mask but it's readily apparent that you can get away with pretty much anything, including a gaiter.

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No, I don't equate it, I was just using it as a reference point for trying to breathe in a mask in the heat. Sitting in a conditioned space all day wearing a mask is different than wearing a mask in the heat. It's not something I want to do. I've done it to work because I've had to. For pleasure, I'd rather sit on my couch with a bourbon, AC, and clean bathrooms. If you want to do it, knock yourself out dude.

TheStorm said:

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Has it been proven that most of the spread occurs at home? That's a new one on me...

And how, pray tell does the virus get into said home to begin with?

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I don't know...its why i asked the question. But it seems logical to me -- if spread is thru more intimate exposed contact, the home seems much more likely than the office. I don't know about you, but I don't get up close to my co-workers like I would with my family?
Seems like in the first wave, there was lots of evidence that the multi-generational, crowded homes were where entire families were getting sick? Often black, Latino, and other poor people?

Now...your 2nd question -- right, thats part of the equation -- so its a mixed bag. Someone gets it in the "world", but then brings it home? In the above scenaro....as I recall, the other part of that was, poor crowded work conditions, but you had to work, and you got sick, took it home, and then all your fam was sick?

packgrad said:

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How could Covid have been so easily avoidable?

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Flooding hospitals with unvaccinated Covid patients seems like it could have been avoided if those people had chosen one of the easily available vaccines. Now, we're talking about masks and ICU beds again.

I don't know exactly how effective masks are, but IMO it makes sense that, if you're able to transmit the virus, which I understand is unlikely but possible if you've been vaccinated, it would have some benefit to wear a mask in an indoor situation like a grocery store where you're there temporarily and are moving around in a relatively open space. It reduces your zone of influence, which I've seen for myself. If you're cooped up in a conference room or classroom for hours, then there's probably zero benefit.

It sounds like you just don't like the gameday experience at CF based on your comments?

wilmwolf80 said:

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Mormad said:

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I must love Wolfpack football way too much, because there's no way in hell I'm letting a "flimsy arse mask" keep me out of the Carter when those gates open, my friends. That's like not seeing my family, and it's letting idiots win.

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I might in November, I'm not in September. Having worn masks all last summer, sometimes in attics, sometimes carrying ladders up and down three flights of stairs in the heat, it's just different. I already don't enjoy early season games in the east side sun, enduring that while also feeling that my ability to breathe is restricted, just not something I want to do. I wore my mask to the one game I was allowed to go to last year, and it was fine because it was cold, but in the summer heat, nah.

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To each their own, my friend. I'm not judging anybody, and I've told you before i think you're the most reasonable, logical poster here. But i swear they could stick me on the east side in a Canada Goose with and N95 and I'm doing it! But I'm crazy. I'll admit I got scolded for having my mask down at the Liberty game so many times that i thought they were going to escort me outta the Carter.

packgrad said:

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Packchem91 said:

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packgrad said:

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So you want to prove that they don't work as opposed to that they do work? I'm not understanding your not arguing argument about mask effectiveness when sleeping beside an unmasked spouse.

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So Way said metrics don't show improvement in areas where mask mandates are in effect. Well, is that because masks are ineffective, or because people wear them out in public but then take them off when they get home.

How can you say "look, masks don't work", when the reality is, most of the spread occurs in homes, where masks are not, and have never been worn?

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Do you think people wear masks at home where mask mandates are in effect? I tend to think the home situation is the same where there are mask mandates and where there are not.

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That is exactly my point. Mask mandates, have never, to my knowledge (maybe NYC had it for a bit) said you had to wear a mask indoors in your home? So if home spread is feasible, and perhaps even a higher rate than "work spread" or "store spread", mask mandates would do nothing to help prevent that, right?

But I think what you're driving at is....while home spread may be the major contributor, if mask mandates really worked, there wouldn't be as much covid to start with, so home spread wouldn't be as big an issue as in places where mask mandates didn't exist. That is a fair observation, and one I don't have an answer for.

FlossyDFlynt said:

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wilmwolf80 said:

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If I have to wear a mask, outside, fully vaccinated, in the September heat, my seats in CF will be empty. Sorry.

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Yep, thats a hard stop for me. Not a chance I will go if I have to mask outside full vaccinated, it is the dumbest thing Ive heard in a long time.

I am so damn sick of all this BS. I did my part, I complied and waited my turn to get the vaccine. Now they want to punish everyone because of the actions of a few. Just leave me alone at this point, I dont care

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"Those who torment us 'for our own good' will do so without end for they have the approval of their concience."

wilmwolf80 said:

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statefan91 said:

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wilmwolf80 said:

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Mormad said:

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I must love Wolfpack football way too much, because there's no way in hell I'm letting a "flimsy arse mask" keep me out of the Carter when those gates open, my friends. That's like not seeing my family, and it's letting idiots win.

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I might in November, I'm not in September. Having worn masks all last summer, sometimes in attics, sometimes carrying ladders up and down three flights of stairs in the heat, it's just different. I already don't enjoy early season games in the east side sun, enduring that while also feeling that my ability to breathe is restricted, just not something I want to do. I wore my mask to the one game I was allowed to go to last year, and it was fine because it was cold, but in the summer heat, nah.

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Do you equate carrying ladders up and down three flights of stairs with what you would experience at an NC State football game? I mean I totally get not wanting to wear a mask but it's readily apparent that you can get away with pretty much anything, including a gaiter.

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No, I don't equate it, I was just using it as a reference point for trying to breathe in a mask in the heat. Sitting in a conditioned space all day wearing a mask is different than wearing a mask in the heat. It's not something I want to do. I've done it to work because I've had to. For pleasure, I'd rather sit on my couch with a bourbon, AC, and clean bathrooms. If you want to do it, knock yourself out dude.

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Taking masks out of the equation (b/c I don't think Cooper will be that dumb), I think it will be interesting to see if the past 18 mos just is the final straw that drives many fans to just stay at home. I think just having it back will result in huge crowds initially...but then people will say, darn, my 75" tv and easy walk to clean bathroom and my fridge sure is nicer than sitting in the 90 degree heat (mask or no!) and we'll see smaller in-person attendance.

packgrad said:

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statefan91 said:

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It sounds like you just don't like the gameday experience at CF based on your comments?

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It sounds like you're lying in saying that wearing a mask to football games is part of the gameday experience at CF?

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He/she was complaining about the bathrooms and heat by comparing to his home a/c and bathrooms. It sounded like the mask was just the cherry on top from what he/she already doesn't enjoy about coming to watch Wolfpack football.