RunsWithWolves26 said:

---

Dr. Berx made a very good point. The federal government and to a lesser extent, state and local governments will not stop this. It's us, the citizens that can. She made the point about HIV. It was activist and people standing up and calling it out. If we, and by we I mean ALL OF US, would just practise what is being recommended, this curve could flatten greatly. Hopefully, the new measure being implemented by state and local will assist in forcing all of us to actually follow these steps.

---

Absolutely.

GoPack2008 said:

---

metcalfmafia said:

---

Is the CDC website the best place to get good / non biased reporting on this?

I just want a place to read updates and steps we need to take without any political biases on either side. Twitter aint doing it for me anymore.

---

Yes, CDC is where we should all be going for info.

---

Figured. Thanks!

RunsWithWolves26 said:

---

I do like the steps that the state and local governments are taking. You aren't going to stop the spike in cases but you can help to flatten the curve and keep the spike to a lesser extent. This, in and of itself would be a huge win against this virus.

With that said, I notice most media reports the number of confirmed cases. I've only heard one report the number of cases that came back negative. My numbers won't be exactly correct but of the roughly 50,000 people tested, roughly 46,000 have tested negative for COVID19. That may not be a big deal to some but it seems like a pretty good indicator to me. My hope is with what the state and local governments are doing, this allows us, as a country, to avoid the massive spikes that other countries have seen. The next two weeks will be extremely interesting to me. If the steps taken now work, this could be winding down in about 2-3 weeks. If not, it could be going for another 6-8 weeks. Personally, i am hoping for the 2-3 week situation.

---

Well said. We have never seen more drastic steps taken for pretty much anything in most of our lifetimes. Let's hope this does the trick and quickly. I feel like once we get by the worst of this and businesses open back up again the economy will come roaring back.

ncsualum05 said:

---

RunsWithWolves26 said:

---

I do like the steps that the state and local governments are taking. You aren't going to stop the spike in cases but you can help to flatten the curve and keep the spike to a lesser extent. This, in and of itself would be a huge win against this virus.

With that said, I notice most media reports the number of confirmed cases. I've only heard one report the number of cases that came back negative. My numbers won't be exactly correct but of the roughly 50,000 people tested, roughly 46,000 have tested negative for COVID19. That may not be a big deal to some but it seems like a pretty good indicator to me. My hope is with what the state and local governments are doing, this allows us, as a country, to avoid the massive spikes that other countries have seen. The next two weeks will be extremely interesting to me. If the steps taken now work, this could be winding down in about 2-3 weeks. If not, it could be going for another 6-8 weeks. Personally, i am hoping for the 2-3 week situation.

---

Well said. We have never seen more drastic steps taken for pretty much anything in most of our lifetimes. Let's hope this does the trick and quickly. I feel like once we get by the worst of this and businesses open back up again the economy will come roaring back.

---

I agree. The economy is strong. It's not like a financial event caused the drop. The virus has. It will come roaring back. At the moment, my only concern is getting past this virus. My grandma, my female hero growing up, is in a nursing home. Worried sick about her.

This issue is who starts to shut their doors 1st. Several people I know that own restaurants in the Triangle are maybe looking at shutting their doors by weeks end until things improve. My wife's company which is global sent everyone home today. Work remote if you can. Things will recover in time but we are heading for a recession although I think it will be short lived

ncsualum05 said:

---

RunsWithWolves26 said:

---

I do like the steps that the state and local governments are taking. You aren't going to stop the spike in cases but you can help to flatten the curve and keep the spike to a lesser extent. This, in and of itself would be a huge win against this virus.

With that said, I notice most media reports the number of confirmed cases. I've only heard one report the number of cases that came back negative. My numbers won't be exactly correct but of the roughly 50,000 people tested, roughly 46,000 have tested negative for COVID19. That may not be a big deal to some but it seems like a pretty good indicator to me. My hope is with what the state and local governments are doing, this allows us, as a country, to avoid the massive spikes that other countries have seen. The next two weeks will be extremely interesting to me. If the steps taken now work, this could be winding down in about 2-3 weeks. If not, it could be going for another 6-8 weeks. Personally, i am hoping for the 2-3 week situation.

---

Well said. We have never seen more drastic steps taken for pretty much anything in most of our lifetimes. Let's hope this does the trick and quickly. I feel like once we get by the worst of this and businesses open back up again the economy will come roaring back.

---

I hope, though I fear it will not be so.

It's a question of suppression vs mitigation. We might be able to achieve suppression but it won't be in a few weeks. Wuhan succeeded and it's taken months.

Hope for the best, but hang on if this takes a long time. Do not count on summer saving us, and even if it does, prepare for round 2 in the fall.

PackBacker07 said:

---

---

Wouldn't it be nice if he had balanced the budget as promised so we could take out massive investments like this?

I'm not sure how a payroll tax cut affects workers hardest hit by this? Especially those who will be laid off, hourly employees, etc?

And now the governor has ordered restaurants and bars closed at 5 today except for takeout or delivery

GuerrillaPack said:

---

Glasswolf said:

---

And now the governor has ordered restaurants and bars closed at 5 today except for takeout or delivery

---

How wonderful. Hope you guys enjoy these draconian measures -- over something far less than the regular flu.

This is so ridiculous.

---

Have you bought any of Alex Jones' toothpaste yet?

40 cases, 0 deaths in a state of 10 million and the governor is shutting down restaurants.

Glasswolf said:

---

And now the governor has ordered restaurants and bars closed at 5 today except for takeout or delivery

---

If that is what it takes, I am all for it. Unlike some, I am looking at this thing and seeing the potential for a positive outcome instead of constantly wanting to scream It's gonna be terrible for months and months. If the state and local governments can help, great. More importantly, THE CITIZENS need to do our part.

RunsWithWolves26 said:

---

Glasswolf said:

---

And now the governor has ordered restaurants and bars closed at 5 today except for takeout or delivery

---

If that is what it takes, I am all for it. Unlike some, I am looking at this thing and seeing the potential for a positive outcome instead of constantly wanting to scream It's gonna be terrible for months and months. If the state and local governments can help, great. More importantly, THE CITIZENS need to do our part.

---

Easy to say when you're not a single mom waitress that relies on that money to make ends meet. This is a bit excessive, imo, and could cause far reaching issues for those unable to weather this type of financial storm.

griff17matt said:

---

RunsWithWolves26 said:

---

Glasswolf said:

---

And now the governor has ordered restaurants and bars closed at 5 today except for takeout or delivery

---

If that is what it takes, I am all for it. Unlike some, I am looking at this thing and seeing the potential for a positive outcome instead of constantly wanting to scream It's gonna be terrible for months and months. If the state and local governments can help, great. More importantly, THE CITIZENS need to do our part.

---

Easy to say when you're not a single mom waitress that relies on that money to make ends meet. This is a bit excessive, imo, and could cause far reaching issues for those unable to weather this type of financial storm.

---

I see your point but playing devils advocate. What if it is as bad as the thinking of some? Could that single mom contract it, bring it home and cause her kids to contract it as well? I'm just glad I'm not in the position to have to make these critical decisions

This is the 4th your post has been deleted. It's your normal junk. Post it a 5th time and take a vacation.

These decisions almost have to be accompanied by some sort of economic relief. The vast majority of people in this country live paycheck to paycheck. People that I know in the business are actually just laying off all their employees so they can collect unemployment and hoping their is a business to come back to.

I think we will get through this and maybe this is what it takes. But I am concerned about the long term fall out. No matter how much "relief" they try to pass through congress or the WH this is going to destroy a lot of people financially.

RunsWithWolves26 said:

---

griff17matt said:

---

RunsWithWolves26 said:

---

Glasswolf said:

---

And now the governor has ordered restaurants and bars closed at 5 today except for takeout or delivery

---

If that is what it takes, I am all for it. Unlike some, I am looking at this thing and seeing the potential for a positive outcome instead of constantly wanting to scream It's gonna be terrible for months and months. If the state and local governments can help, great. More importantly, THE CITIZENS need to do our part.

---

Easy to say when you're not a single mom waitress that relies on that money to make ends meet. This is a bit excessive, imo, and could cause far reaching issues for those unable to weather this type of financial storm.

---

I see your point but playing devils advocate. What if it is as bad as the thinking of some? Could that single mom contract it, bring it home and cause her kids to contract it as well? I'm just glad I'm not in the position to have to make these critical decisions

---

Maybe, maybe not Could causing her to not work force her into homelessness? I'd wager that is a more likely outcome than the 20 people that have this damn thing in the state coming into contact with her and she passes it to her kids and they're sick for a couple days and nothing else. This will sound more callous than I intend, but I'd care more about kids eating and having a place to sleep than an elderly person getting this and passing from it.

Honestly though, how the hell does the governor have the authority to tell a business to close down? This is getting a bit too totalitarian for me.

GuerrillaPack said:

---

This is the 4th your post has been deleted. It's your normal junk. Post it a 5th time and take a vacation.

---

Why is my post being deleted? It is 100% completely on the topic of the thread.

griff17matt said:

---

RunsWithWolves26 said:

---

Glasswolf said:

---

And now the governor has ordered restaurants and bars closed at 5 today except for takeout or delivery

---

If that is what it takes, I am all for it. Unlike some, I am looking at this thing and seeing the potential for a positive outcome instead of constantly wanting to scream It's gonna be terrible for months and months. If the state and local governments can help, great. More importantly, THE CITIZENS need to do our part.

---

Easy to say when you're not a single mom waitress that relies on that money to make ends meet. This is a bit excessive, imo, and could cause far reaching issues for those unable to weather this type of financial storm.

---

Absolutely agree. The economic consequences of these actions will be huge. That's why they are talking about $800 billion in "stimulus" to offset the impacts of these shutdowns.

People are going to lose their jobs over these actions.

griff17matt said:

---

RunsWithWolves26 said:

---

griff17matt said:

---

RunsWithWolves26 said:

---

Glasswolf said:

---

And now the governor has ordered restaurants and bars closed at 5 today except for takeout or delivery

---

If that is what it takes, I am all for it. Unlike some, I am looking at this thing and seeing the potential for a positive outcome instead of constantly wanting to scream It's gonna be terrible for months and months. If the state and local governments can help, great. More importantly, THE CITIZENS need to do our part.

---

Easy to say when you're not a single mom waitress that relies on that money to make ends meet. This is a bit excessive, imo, and could cause far reaching issues for those unable to weather this type of financial storm.

---

I see your point but playing devils advocate. What if it is as bad as the thinking of some? Could that single mom contract it, bring it home and cause her kids to contract it as well? I'm just glad I'm not in the position to have to make these critical decisions

---

Maybe, maybe not Could causing her to not work force her into homelessness? I'd wager that is a more likely outcome than the 20 people that have this damn thing in the state coming into contact with her and she passes it to her kids and they're sick for a couple days and nothing else. This will sound more callous than I intend, but I'd care more about kids eating and having a place to sleep than an elderly person getting this and passing from it.

Honestly though, how the hell does the governor have the authority to tell a business to close down? This is getting a bit too totalitarian for me.

---

I said nothing about an elderly person. I said what if she works, gets the virus and passes it to her kids? Companies and government are already stepping in to help with the money, food, etc situations. If the chance she or her child get it and possibly die, a worse or better outcome then her being laid off of work for a couple of weeks?

RunsWithWolves26 said:

---

griff17matt said:

---

RunsWithWolves26 said:

---

griff17matt said:

---

RunsWithWolves26 said:

---

Glasswolf said:

---

And now the governor has ordered restaurants and bars closed at 5 today except for takeout or delivery

---

If that is what it takes, I am all for it. Unlike some, I am looking at this thing and seeing the potential for a positive outcome instead of constantly wanting to scream It's gonna be terrible for months and months. If the state and local governments can help, great. More importantly, THE CITIZENS need to do our part.

---

Easy to say when you're not a single mom waitress that relies on that money to make ends meet. This is a bit excessive, imo, and could cause far reaching issues for those unable to weather this type of financial storm.

---

I see your point but playing devils advocate. What if it is as bad as the thinking of some? Could that single mom contract it, bring it home and cause her kids to contract it as well? I'm just glad I'm not in the position to have to make these critical decisions

---

Maybe, maybe not Could causing her to not work force her into homelessness? I'd wager that is a more likely outcome than the 20 people that have this damn thing in the state coming into contact with her and she passes it to her kids and they're sick for a couple days and nothing else. This will sound more callous than I intend, but I'd care more about kids eating and having a place to sleep than an elderly person getting this and passing from it.

Honestly though, how the hell does the governor have the authority to tell a business to close down? This is getting a bit too totalitarian for me.

---

I said nothing about an elderly person. I said what if she works, gets the virus and passes it to her kids? Companies and government are already stepping in to help with the money, food, etc situations. If the chance she or her child get it and possibly die, a worse or better outcome then her being laid off of work for a couple of weeks?

---

There are 40 cases. In the state. The majority being in the two biggest metros. Do you really think it's fair to shut down restaurants in the rest of the state because of that? Because of what might could happen? This fear mongering is out of control.

Edit to add... not saying you are fear mongering. The fear mongering that led to this decision.

packgrad said:

---

RunsWithWolves26 said:

---

griff17matt said:

---

RunsWithWolves26 said:

---

griff17matt said:

---

RunsWithWolves26 said:

---

Glasswolf said:

---

And now the governor has ordered restaurants and bars closed at 5 today except for takeout or delivery

---

If that is what it takes, I am all for it. Unlike some, I am looking at this thing and seeing the potential for a positive outcome instead of constantly wanting to scream It's gonna be terrible for months and months. If the state and local governments can help, great. More importantly, THE CITIZENS need to do our part.

---

Easy to say when you're not a single mom waitress that relies on that money to make ends meet. This is a bit excessive, imo, and could cause far reaching issues for those unable to weather this type of financial storm.

---

I see your point but playing devils advocate. What if it is as bad as the thinking of some? Could that single mom contract it, bring it home and cause her kids to contract it as well? I'm just glad I'm not in the position to have to make these critical decisions

---

Maybe, maybe not Could causing her to not work force her into homelessness? I'd wager that is a more likely outcome than the 20 people that have this damn thing in the state coming into contact with her and she passes it to her kids and they're sick for a couple days and nothing else. This will sound more callous than I intend, but I'd care more about kids eating and having a place to sleep than an elderly person getting this and passing from it.

Honestly though, how the hell does the governor have the authority to tell a business to close down? This is getting a bit too totalitarian for me.

---

I said nothing about an elderly person. I said what if she works, gets the virus and passes it to her kids? Companies and government are already stepping in to help with the money, food, etc situations. If the chance she or her child get it and possibly die, a worse or better outcome then her being laid off of work for a couple of weeks?

---

There are 40 cases. In the state. The majority being in the two biggest metros. Do you really think it's fair to shut down restaurants in the rest of the state because of that? Because of what might could happen? This fear mongering is out of control.

Edit to add... not saying you are fear mongering. The fear mongering that led to this decision.

---

I guess I'm trying to look at it in a couple of different ways. I don't think anyone even has a remote clue how many cases are actually out there. There hasn't been nearly enough test done to even begin to accurately assess that. I believe for that reason, the state and local officials are trying to act ahead to flatten the curve and hopefully prevent, to an extent, what has happened in other parts of the world.

If we were testing the amount of people we should be testing and the numbers were what they are now, I would tend to agree with your assessment. But without the proper testing, I can't say they are or are not doing the correct thing in this situation as it stand now. I do believe next week this time with the increase in testing, 2-5 million by end of next week, we will have a better idea of where things are. At that time, I hope the government officials will be able to better assess things and make the proper changes needed.

The puzzling part of all of this is why are Americans not dying? These other countries have seen exponential daily death tolls once it hits. The last six days saw us lose 8, 5, 8, 8, 11 and 18 people. So far today it looks like we've lost another 11 with about six hours left on the daily clock. The first death in the States was on February 29th. We're 17 days into this and still haven't breached 100 deaths.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/

Everpack said:

---

The puzzling part of all of this is why are Americans not dying? These other countries have seen exponential daily death tolls once it hits. The last six days saw us lose 8, 5, 8, 8, 11 and 18 people. So far today it looks like we've lost another 11 with about six hours left on the daily clock. The first death in the States was on February 29th. We're 17 days into this and still haven't breached 100 deaths.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/

---

The countries seeing the most deaths are Iran, China, and Italy. The first two have large populates with poor access to healthcare. Italy has the 2nd oldest population in the world.

But no doubt in my mind that the death toll will pick up. I see we are up to 45 cases but the real number is likely well over 100. New York went from under 1,000 cases early this morning to 1700 when I last checked.

Everpack said:

---

The puzzling part of all of this is why are Americans not dying? These other countries have seen exponential daily death tolls once it hits. The last six days saw us lose 8, 5, 8, 8, 11 and 18 people. So far today it looks like we've lost another 11 with about six hours left on the daily clock. The first death in the States was on February 29th. We're 17 days into this and still haven't breached 100 deaths.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/

---

Deaths in large droves don't start until the local health system is overwhelmed and until those most likely to die are infected.

Population density in the United States is very low, so natural spread is slower even in our urban areas which are quasi rural compared to urban areas over seas


Italy has an average age of 47 and a population density of 532 per square mile
China has an average age of 39 and a population density of 375 per square mile
US has an average age of 38 and a population density of 94 per square mile

Density matters.

Density in China rises in some cities to 9000 per square mile. NYC is the only place in the US that comes close to such density so while the spread from major city to city may be as fast as other nations, the spread within urban areas will be slower because our areas are less dense.

We are probably 8-10 days before any large number of deaths because we have equipment and people to last that long in urban areas. Two weeks from now when the medical system is overtaxed and the equipment and supplies are down you will start to see a Katrinia like triage where those that are not likely to survive despite a herculean effort don't get that effort and the effort goes to the less critically ill. Some of it depends where the deep pockets are - a deep pocket here in the Triangle is one thing, a deep pocket in say Pikeville KY is another based on who you can plug into the system to provide care.

Plus we've taken good preventative measures so far to limit death in the US

Fauci says Trump nor CDC to blame for testing delay.

https://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/487985-fauci-neither-trump-nor-cdc-to-blame-for-testing-delay

lumberpack5 said:

---

Everpack said:

---

The puzzling part of all of this is why are Americans not dying? These other countries have seen exponential daily death tolls once it hits. The last six days saw us lose 8, 5, 8, 8, 11 and 18 people. So far today it looks like we've lost another 11 with about six hours left on the daily clock. The first death in the States was on February 29th. We're 17 days into this and still haven't breached 100 deaths.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/

---

Deaths in large droves don't start until the local health system is overwhelmed and until those most likely to die are infected.

Population density in the United States is very low, so natural spread is slower even in our urban areas which are quasi rural compared to urban areas over seas


Italy has an average age of 47 and a population density of 532 per square mile
China has an average age of 39 and a population density of 375 per square mile
US has an average age of 38 and a population density of 94 per square mile

Density matters.

Density in China rises in some cities to 9000 per square mile. NYC is the only place in the US that comes close to such density so while the spread from major city to city may be as fast as other nations, the spread within urban areas will be slower because our areas are less dense.

---

That follows my thoughts. But doesn't it beg the question of why are we shutting down restaurants in my rural WNC town of 5,000? Where the poverty rate is already through the roof and child homelessness is a real chronic problem?

King Leary said:

---

Plus we've taken good preventative measures so far to limit death in the US

---

Not really, our real response is running about 14-21 days behind South Korea's timeline. The timeline is not far enough along for us to evaluate response and give out pats on the back.

Clinical trials have begun.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/coronavirus-vaccine-jennifer-haller-seattle-first-patient-injected-with-covid-19-shot-in-clinical-trial-cure/

packgrad said:

---

https://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/487985-fauci-neither-trump-nor-cdc-to-blame-for-testing-delay

---

So we have a testing delay of our own tests, and also at the same time decline to use the ones produced by WHO?

Quote:

---

On Saturday Jan. 11 a month and a half before the first Covid-19 case not linked to travel was diagnosed in the United States Chinese scientists posted the genome of the mysterious new virus, and within a week virologists in Berlin had produced the first diagnostic test for the disease.
Soon after, researchers in other nations rolled out their own tests, too, sometimes with different genetic targets. By the end of February, the World Health Organization had shipped tests to nearly 60 countries.

The United States was not among them.

Why the United States declined to use the WHO test, even temporarily as a bridge until the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention could produce its own test, remains a perplexing question and the key to the Trump administration's failure to provide enough tests to identify the coronavirus infections before they could be passed on, according to POLITICO interviews with dozens of viral-disease experts, former officials and some officials within the administration's health agencies.

---

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/03/06/coronavirus-testing-failure-123166

Everpack said:

---

lumberpack5 said:

---

Everpack said:

---

The puzzling part of all of this is why are Americans not dying? These other countries have seen exponential daily death tolls once it hits. The last six days saw us lose 8, 5, 8, 8, 11 and 18 people. So far today it looks like we've lost another 11 with about six hours left on the daily clock. The first death in the States was on February 29th. We're 17 days into this and still haven't breached 100 deaths.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/

---

Deaths in large droves don't start until the local health system is overwhelmed and until those most likely to die are infected.

Population density in the United States is very low, so natural spread is slower even in our urban areas which are quasi rural compared to urban areas over seas


Italy has an average age of 47 and a population density of 532 per square mile
China has an average age of 39 and a population density of 375 per square mile
US has an average age of 38 and a population density of 94 per square mile

Density matters.

Density in China rises in some cities to 9000 per square mile. NYC is the only place in the US that comes close to such density so while the spread from major city to city may be as fast as other nations, the spread within urban areas will be slower because our areas are less dense.

---

That follows my thoughts. But doesn't it beg the question of why are we shutting down restaurants in my rural WNC town of 5,000? Where the poverty rate is already through the roof and child homelessness is a real chronic problem?

---

Rural areas are **** ed.

Politico is propaganda.