Bas2020 said:

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Steve Williams said:

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Forgive me if this has been mentioned previously but are there any reliable studies out there that compare natural immunity against vaccination?

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It may be old info but at one point it was me timed that you are 7 x times more protected if you have had COVID antibodies vs the vaccine . This calls into question why on earth people that have had COVID are being forced to also get the vaccine .... again unless the scientific data was wrong .

Nobody with common sense can answer this . This is another reason why people don't trust the decision makers .

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I too remember many articles/reports that said that you have much better protection from natural immunity than anything a vaccine could offer.

As for the "science" possibly being wrong, it could also be wrong right now. But ohhhh nooo...the cultists who trust "science" will never let you question the current "science". You can only question the "science" after the "experts" have decided to change the "science", and discard the old "science".

Bas2020 said:

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Steve Williams said:

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Forgive me if this has been mentioned previously but are there any reliable studies out there that compare natural immunity against vaccination?

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It may be old info but at one point it was me timed that you are 7 x times more protected if you have had COVID antibodies vs the vaccine . This calls into question why on earth people that have had COVID are being forced to also get the vaccine .... again unless the scientific data was wrong .

Nobody with common sense can answer this . This is another reason why people don't trust the decision makers .

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It doesn't seem accurate to say that you are 7x more protected if you have had COVID antibodies vs. the vaccine, at least not that I have been able to find. Do you have anything you've read about it? This is the latest I found:

https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2021/s0806-vaccination-protection.html

GuerrillaPack said:

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Bas2020 said:

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Steve Williams said:

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Forgive me if this has been mentioned previously but are there any reliable studies out there that compare natural immunity against vaccination?

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It may be old info but at one point it was me timed that you are 7 x times more protected if you have had COVID antibodies vs the vaccine . This calls into question why on earth people that have had COVID are being forced to also get the vaccine .... again unless the scientific data was wrong .

Nobody with common sense can answer this . This is another reason why people don't trust the decision makers .

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I too remember many articles/reports that said that you have much better protection from natural immunity than anything a vaccine could offer.

As for the "science" possibly being wrong, it could also be wrong right now. But ohhhh nooo...the cultists who trust "science" will never let you question the current "science". You can only question the "science" after the "experts" have decided to change the "science", and discard the old "science".

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And on top of that.....

https://networkinvegas.com/38-covid-deaths-in-fully-vaccinated-reported-in-the-last-week-in-clark-county/

Oldsouljer said:

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And on top of that.....

https://networkinvegas.com/38-covid-deaths-in-fully-vaccinated-reported-in-the-last-week-in-clark-county/

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Good find. That's what I posted about yesterday. I don't buy for one second the propaganda about this being a "pandemic of the unvaccinated", and the claims that "99% of hospitalizations and deaths are unvaxxed". They are monkeying with the "data" yet again to push their agenda. From "anecdotal" evidence (stories from people posting here, coworkers, etc) there are TONS of vaxxed people getting sick. If we had real data, I bet that the truth is that around half of the hospitalizations and deaths are from vaxxed people -- which would match the latest data on deaths in the UK and other nations.

GuerrillaPack said:

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Oldsouljer said:

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And on top of that.....

https://networkinvegas.com/38-covid-deaths-in-fully-vaccinated-reported-in-the-last-week-in-clark-county/

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Good find. That's what I posted about yesterday. I don't buy for one second the propaganda about this being a "pandemic of the unvaccinated", and the claims that "99% of hospitalizations and deaths are unvaxxed". They are monkeying with the "data" yet again to push their agenda. From "anecdotal" evidence (stories from people posting here, coworkers, etc) there are TONS of vaxxed people getting sick. If we had real data, I bet that the truth is that around half of the hospitalizations and deaths are from vaxxed people -- which would match the latest data on deaths in the UK and other nations.

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That's because you have more than one goal. You are anti-Mask AND anti-Vaxx. I'm vaccinated and now that I have done what I was asked to do am 100% anti-Mask and therefore, I think it's just more fear porn (ie. not true) to try to drive the politically driven mask mandate narrative.

You are trying to serve two masters that are in conflict with each other. I only have to serve one.

PackPA2015 said:

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No direct studies that I am aware of, but anecdotally, we have seen relatively equal immunity with natural infection or with vaccination.

We have documented positive antibodies up to 11 months out from original infection in multiple patients. The breakthrough cases we have seen with naturally immune patients tends to be right around the 8 month mark if they do happen. The numbers seem to be relatively close as to quantity of breakthrough with naturally immune vs. vaccine immune in our clinic.

My antibodies are still positive after being fully vaccinated in January of this year, so 7 months out. We have seen a few positive antibody tests in vaccinated individuals around the 10-11 month mark so far.

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Great info, thanks.

TheStorm said:

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GuerrillaPack said:

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Oldsouljer said:

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And on top of that.....

https://networkinvegas.com/38-covid-deaths-in-fully-vaccinated-reported-in-the-last-week-in-clark-county/

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Good find. That's what I posted about yesterday. I don't buy for one second the propaganda about this being a "pandemic of the unvaccinated", and the claims that "99% of hospitalizations and deaths are unvaxxed". They are monkeying with the "data" yet again to push their agenda. From "anecdotal" evidence (stories from people posting here, coworkers, etc) there are TONS of vaxxed people getting sick. If we had real data, I bet that the truth is that around half of the hospitalizations and deaths are from vaxxed people -- which would match the latest data on deaths in the UK and other nations.

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That's because you have more than one goal. You are anti-Mask AND anti-Vaxx. I'm vaccinated and now that I have done what I was asked to do am 100% anti-Mask and therefore, I think it's just more fear porn (ie. not true) to try to drive the politically driven mask mandate narrative.

You are trying to serve two masters that are in conflict with each other. I only have to serve one.

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It's a false choice. You don't have to pick one or the other. You can reject BOTH options, as I do. It's like, hypothetically, if the powers-that-be presented you with two options: 1) jump off a cliff or 2) inject poison into your veins. It's not a pick one scenario. It's reject both options.

I don't just "do what I'm asked to do" by the Satanic elites who run the communist Establishment media, government, and our other corrupt institutions in society.

If we are to just blindly "do what we are asked to do", the only authority we are to respect is God Himself. And speaking of serving two masters....that, of course, comes from the Bible. We are to serve God alone. Not these Satanic Marxist scum in the government and Establishment media, or any other powerful institutions.

bsorry11 said:

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Packchem91 said:

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So this is wild.

China’s state-run media is now denying that COVID came from there by calling that a lab at UNC be investigated.

Story link: https://t.co/NAer6rAVwi pic.twitter.com/5kiv2a73Kx

— Josh Graham (@JoshGrahamRadio) August 25, 2021

I'm guessing some folks will like the Chinese again for starting this rumor

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Odds that an old poster at PackPride tipped off the Chinese?

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Odds that the fake courses of yesteryear and now UNC maybe doing illegal germ warfare research gets UNC sports the death penalty? LOL

bsorry11 said:

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Packchem91 said:

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So this is wild.

China’s state-run media is now denying that COVID came from there by calling that a lab at UNC be investigated.

Story link: https://t.co/NAer6rAVwi pic.twitter.com/5kiv2a73Kx

— Josh Graham (@JoshGrahamRadio) August 25, 2021

I'm guessing some folks will like the Chinese again for starting this rumor

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Odds that an old poster at PackPride tipped off the Chinese?

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That was the first comment in the twitter thread -- something to the line of, if true, it would have been broken by PP.

https://www.newsobserver.com/news/local/education/article253732248.html

And here is someone with a little common sense also willing to take a stand against politics. Kudos to her.

Just got an email from WCPSS stating they are CONSIDERING going to back to masks required OUTSIDE for all staff AND students and for all activities, including athletics. The actual wording from the email is below:

Quote:

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In addition, we are considering the following updates to reduce the spread of the Delta variant:

• Regular COVID-19 testing for all student-athletes. Proof of vaccination would preclude students from having to be tested. This is under review due to statewide data from the ABC Science Collaborative and preliminary data collected by WCPSS suggesting the Delta variant spreads even more effectively during athletic activities. The Board of Education will discuss this topic at its Sept. 7 meeting.
• Regular COVID-19 testing for all employees. Proof of vaccination would preclude staff from having to be tested. This is under review due to numerous studies showing the Delta variant is far more likely to affect adults who are not vaccinated. The Board of Education will discuss this topic at its Sept. 7 meeting.
• A requirement that all individuals wear face coverings indoors and outdoors on WCPSS campuses. This would include recess, athletics and extracurricular activities.
  
  • This is being considered to reduce quarantines so we can increase daily in-person instruction to as many students as possible. According to current state health guidance, a student without a face covering is considered a close contact to an infected individual even if that exposure occurs outside. Such exposures can quickly produce dozens of quarantined students.
  • Scheduled "mask breaks" would be needed under this option.

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Packchem91 said:

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caryking said:

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Packchem91 said:

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So this is wild.

China’s state-run media is now denying that COVID came from there by calling that a lab at UNC be investigated.

Story link: https://t.co/NAer6rAVwi pic.twitter.com/5kiv2a73Kx

— Josh Graham (@JoshGrahamRadio) August 25, 2021

I'm guessing some folks will like the Chinese again for starting this rumor

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Chem, you are uninformed again. All evidence points to Wuhon for virus; however, Ralph Barric is being called out for "possibly" early help with the Wuhon Lab on the creation of the virus!

So, whether the virus came from Wuhon or not, we are supplying them with knowledge on how to create these viruses. I think that has been proven!

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LOL....dude, lighten up and get a sense of humor. I put a smiley face on it at the beginning just because UNC was called out. Of course teh article is bunk.....and I should have known some folks here are so wrapped up in their own intelligence (and agenda) that they'd not see that. Congratulations.

If it makes you happy....I don't trust the Chinese, nor their reasonings on thsi....I have no idea how it was created, but can buy easily that it was lab based. Just thought it funny of all the places they could blame, it to be UNC.

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Chem, you are the epitome of a person that wants to sound smart; however, not informed enough to make it happen! BTW, I supplied you a general understanding of certain information that helps support the Chinese thinking! Now, based on what I am reading, they perverted the message to fit their agenda! That's what you get from an autocratic government, very similar to the government we have!

Actually, not only our government; but, the technocrats, Media, and Corporatist Elites as well...

Mormad said:

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https://www.bbc.com/news/health-58270098

Discusses immunity. Easy read.

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I love British terms - "topping up".
Briefly addressed Bas's question earlier about why people who've ahd Covid would get vaxxed:

The biggest immune response comes from people who caught Covid and were then vaccinated. We're still waiting for data on what happens the other way round.

For adults, relying on immunity thru contracting Covid just seems risky -- even if you don't die...being out of work for a week isn't a good thing either
For kids and probably even young adults....its a compelling argument.

https://doi.org/10.1111/joim.13372

Discusses natural immunity vs post-vax immunity

Packchem91 said:

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caryking said:

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Packchem91 said:

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caryking said:

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Packchem91 said:

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So this is wild.

China’s state-run media is now denying that COVID came from there by calling that a lab at UNC be investigated.

Story link: https://t.co/NAer6rAVwi pic.twitter.com/5kiv2a73Kx

— Josh Graham (@JoshGrahamRadio) August 25, 2021

I'm guessing some folks will like the Chinese again for starting this rumor

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Chem, you are uninformed again. All evidence points to Wuhon for virus; however, Ralph Barric is being called out for "possibly" early help with the Wuhon Lab on the creation of the virus!

So, whether the virus came from Wuhon or not, we are supplying them with knowledge on how to create these viruses. I think that has been proven!

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LOL....dude, lighten up and get a sense of humor. I put a smiley face on it at the beginning just because UNC was called out. Of course teh article is bunk.....and I should have known some folks here are so wrapped up in their own intelligence (and agenda) that they'd not see that. Congratulations.

If it makes you happy....I don't trust the Chinese, nor their reasonings on thsi....I have no idea how it was created, but can buy easily that it was lab based. Just thought it funny of all the places they could blame, it to be UNC.

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Chem, you are the epitome of a person that wants to sound smart; however, not informed enough to make it happen! BTW, I supplied you a general understanding of certain information that helps support the Chinese thinking! Now, based on what I am reading, they perverted the message to fit their agenda! That's what you get from an autocratic government, very similar to the government we have!

Actually, not only our government; but, the technocrats, Media, and Corporatist Elites as well...

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LOL, ok, so doubling down and demonstrating a complete lack of self-awareness at the same time.
You mock my intelligence while flailing around after failing to see what was clearly a comical tweet.

Instead of continuing to go for the "gotcha moment" on all of my posts....take a deep breath, get off your high high high horse, and realize that humor still exists.

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Chem, have you ever thought? You're not that funny! In fact, you're well, I'll let BBW chime in

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.24.21262415v1.full.pdf

"Conclusions:
This study demonstrated that natural immunity confers longer lasting and stronger protection against infection, symptomatic disease and hospitalization caused by the Delta variant of SARS-CoV-2, compared to the BNT162b2 two-dose vaccine-induced immunity. Individuals who were both previously infected with SARS-CoV-2 and given a single dose of the vaccine gained additional protection against the Delta variant."

Well.... I posted my thoughts. And... if you don't think this is a politically motivated issue... then go pound sand.

It was/is/will be.

Sit back and watch.

PackPA2015 said:

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packgrad said:

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https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.24.21262415v1.full.pdf

"Conclusions:
This study demonstrated that natural immunity confers longer lasting and stronger protection against infection, symptomatic disease and hospitalization caused by the Delta variant of SARS-CoV-2, compared to the BNT162b2 two-dose vaccine-induced immunity. Individuals who were both previously infected with SARS-CoV-2 and given a single dose of the vaccine gained additional protection against the Delta variant."

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This is obviously a pre-print study and there is a big issue with comparing these individuals. They are not apples to apples.

The natural immunity group has much, much fewer individuals that are 65+ and have multiple chronic medical problems. That group also has less immunocompromised individuals. These individuals are at higher risk of having COVID anyways. I believe this study may not be fully published because of this. It needs to be studied for sure, but I don't think we can use this study as full evidence because of the big flaw in the design.

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Ok. So did another study already linked on this page that shows the opposite of this study.

"Finally, our cohort is overall skewed towards young healthy individuals. As such, the results described may not fully represent the durability of vaccine-induced immunity in older individuals or populations with chronic diseases and/or compromised immune systems, and future studies will be required to better quantify the immune response over time in these populations."