Steve Videtich said:

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ncsualum05 said:

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New technologies should develop and eventually replace old through the natural course of innovation and business models. They should not be pushed by corrupt governments who want to pound the drum on "climate and energy" when it's really about oppression of people, picking winners, and enriching themselves.

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That's the highlight of the free market of business and ideas, correct?

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The free markets needs to work! That being said, our government can make it difficult to import products from other country's. Unfortunately, we have competing sides with the same interest.

Big business wants cheap labor. Big government is bought and paid for by big business. Who wins? Big business. Who loses? Small business and American workers.

It's Okay to Wonder about Biden's Mental State

Quote:

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Because of Biden's long history of habitual dishonesty, it is difficult to tell how much of this is Biden being Biden and how much of it is Biden no longer quite being Biden how much is his longstanding and familiar moral disability and how much is, as it may be, late-life mental disability.

We need an independent medical assessment of the president's mental health. That is a sobering fact to face, but face it we must. And right now, we need a Democrat who will say so in public.

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WPNfamily said:

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PackFansXL said:

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It's Okay to Wonder about Biden's Mental State

Quote:

---

Because of Biden's long history of habitual dishonesty, it is difficult to tell how much of this is Biden being Biden and how much of it is Biden no longer quite being Biden how much is his longstanding and familiar moral disability and how much is, as it may be, late-life mental disability.

We need an independent medical assessment of the president's mental health. That is a sobering fact to face, but face it we must. And right now, we need a Democrat who will say so in public.

---

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If ya think Biden sucks wait until you see Kamala

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Kamala will never happen! The Dems know it was a mistake to put her with Biden. Hell, she's lost three staffers in the last two weeks.

caryking said:

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WPNfamily said:

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PackFansXL said:

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It's Okay to Wonder about Biden's Mental State

Quote:

---

Because of Biden's long history of habitual dishonesty, it is difficult to tell how much of this is Biden being Biden and how much of it is Biden no longer quite being Biden how much is his longstanding and familiar moral disability and how much is, as it may be, late-life mental disability.

We need an independent medical assessment of the president's mental health. That is a sobering fact to face, but face it we must. And right now, we need a Democrat who will say so in public.

---

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If ya think Biden sucks wait until you see Kamala

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Kamala will never happen! The Dems know it was a mistake to put her with Biden. Hell, she's lost three staffers in the last two weeks.

---

Agree.

Dems and Pubs are in an interesting place where the presumptive favorites to lead the charge in both parties (Kamala and Trump) both face significant electability problems before the race even begins.

Will be interesting to see who ultimately takes the nominations. If I had to guess today, I think it's mayor Pete and DeSantis but who knows.

Civilized said:

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caryking said:

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WPNfamily said:

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PackFansXL said:

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It's Okay to Wonder about Biden's Mental State

Quote:

---

Because of Biden's long history of habitual dishonesty, it is difficult to tell how much of this is Biden being Biden and how much of it is Biden no longer quite being Biden how much is his longstanding and familiar moral disability and how much is, as it may be, late-life mental disability.

We need an independent medical assessment of the president's mental health. That is a sobering fact to face, but face it we must. And right now, we need a Democrat who will say so in public.

---

---

If ya think Biden sucks wait until you see Kamala

---

Kamala will never happen! The Dems know it was a mistake to put her with Biden. Hell, she's lost three staffers in the last two weeks.

---

Agree.

Dems and Pubs are in an interesting place where the presumptive favorites to lead the charge in both parties (Kamala and Trump) both face significant electability problems before the race even begins.

Will be interesting to see who ultimately takes the nominations. If I had to guess today, I think it's mayor Pete and DeSantis but who knows.

---

If I am not mistaken Trump got the second most votes ever. He can get the votes.

Civilized said:

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Cthepack said:

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Civilized said:

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caryking said:

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WPNfamily said:

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PackFansXL said:

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It's Okay to Wonder about Biden's Mental State

Quote:

---

Because of Biden's long history of habitual dishonesty, it is difficult to tell how much of this is Biden being Biden and how much of it is Biden no longer quite being Biden how much is his longstanding and familiar moral disability and how much is, as it may be, late-life mental disability.

We need an independent medical assessment of the president's mental health. That is a sobering fact to face, but face it we must. And right now, we need a Democrat who will say so in public.

---

---

If ya think Biden sucks wait until you see Kamala

---

Kamala will never happen! The Dems know it was a mistake to put her with Biden. Hell, she's lost three staffers in the last two weeks.

---

Agree.

Dems and Pubs are in an interesting place where the presumptive favorites to lead the charge in both parties (Kamala and Trump) both face significant electability problems before the race even begins.

Will be interesting to see who ultimately takes the nominations. If I had to guess today, I think it's mayor Pete and DeSantis but who knows.

---

If I am not mistaken Trump got the second most votes ever. He can get the votes.

---

You're correct. But he lost to a mediocre candidate who garnered the most votes ever, largely because tens of millions voted against Trump. That's the risk. That's the electability problem for Trump.

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Those that voted against Trump see what they got. Probably the worst President ever. Will not be as inclined to vote against trump the next time.

packgrad said:

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Lol at Mayor Pete being the front runner for Dems. Identity politics is really all they have.

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He's not the frontrunner. Kamala is. Just like Trump is for Republicans.

Buttigieg is third, behind Harris and Biden. But he may be more electable than both.

Cthepack said:

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Civilized said:

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Cthepack said:

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Civilized said:

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caryking said:

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WPNfamily said:

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PackFansXL said:

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It's Okay to Wonder about Biden's Mental State

Quote:

---

Because of Biden's long history of habitual dishonesty, it is difficult to tell how much of this is Biden being Biden and how much of it is Biden no longer quite being Biden how much is his longstanding and familiar moral disability and how much is, as it may be, late-life mental disability.

We need an independent medical assessment of the president's mental health. That is a sobering fact to face, but face it we must. And right now, we need a Democrat who will say so in public.

---

---

If ya think Biden sucks wait until you see Kamala

---

Kamala will never happen! The Dems know it was a mistake to put her with Biden. Hell, she's lost three staffers in the last two weeks.

---

Agree.

Dems and Pubs are in an interesting place where the presumptive favorites to lead the charge in both parties (Kamala and Trump) both face significant electability problems before the race even begins.

Will be interesting to see who ultimately takes the nominations. If I had to guess today, I think it's mayor Pete and DeSantis but who knows.

---

If I am not mistaken Trump got the second most votes ever. He can get the votes.

---

You're correct. But he lost to a mediocre candidate who garnered the most votes ever, largely because tens of millions voted against Trump. That's the risk. That's the electability problem for Trump.

---

Those that voted against Trump see what they got. Probably the worst President ever. Will not be as inclined to vote against trump the next time.

---

False dichotomy, Trump doesn't have to be the choice, and Trump may not be running against Biden again. He may be running against a candidate that lacks Biden's drawbacks.

Ask yourself, who would have the greater odds of losing, Trump or DeSantis?

Civilized said:

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Cthepack said:

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Civilized said:

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Cthepack said:

---

Civilized said:

---

caryking said:

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WPNfamily said:

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PackFansXL said:

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It's Okay to Wonder about Biden's Mental State

Quote:

---

Because of Biden's long history of habitual dishonesty, it is difficult to tell how much of this is Biden being Biden and how much of it is Biden no longer quite being Biden how much is his longstanding and familiar moral disability and how much is, as it may be, late-life mental disability.

We need an independent medical assessment of the president's mental health. That is a sobering fact to face, but face it we must. And right now, we need a Democrat who will say so in public.

---

---

If ya think Biden sucks wait until you see Kamala

---

Kamala will never happen! The Dems know it was a mistake to put her with Biden. Hell, she's lost three staffers in the last two weeks.

---

Agree.

Dems and Pubs are in an interesting place where the presumptive favorites to lead the charge in both parties (Kamala and Trump) both face significant electability problems before the race even begins.

Will be interesting to see who ultimately takes the nominations. If I had to guess today, I think it's mayor Pete and DeSantis but who knows.

---

If I am not mistaken Trump got the second most votes ever. He can get the votes.

---

You're correct. But he lost to a mediocre candidate who garnered the most votes ever, largely because tens of millions voted against Trump. That's the risk. That's the electability problem for Trump.

---

Those that voted against Trump see what they got. Probably the worst President ever. Will not be as inclined to vote against trump the next time.

---

False dichotomy, Trump doesn't have to be the choice, and Trump may not be running against Biden again. He may be running against a candidate that lacks Biden's drawbacks.

Ask yourself, who would have the greater odds of losing, Trump or DeSantis?

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You brought up Trump. I did not. Specifically you said trump and Harris.

Cthepack said:

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Civilized said:

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Cthepack said:

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Civilized said:

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Cthepack said:

---

Civilized said:

---

caryking said:

---

WPNfamily said:

---

PackFansXL said:

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It's Okay to Wonder about Biden's Mental State

Quote:

---

Because of Biden's long history of habitual dishonesty, it is difficult to tell how much of this is Biden being Biden and how much of it is Biden no longer quite being Biden how much is his longstanding and familiar moral disability and how much is, as it may be, late-life mental disability.

We need an independent medical assessment of the president's mental health. That is a sobering fact to face, but face it we must. And right now, we need a Democrat who will say so in public.

---

---

If ya think Biden sucks wait until you see Kamala

---

Kamala will never happen! The Dems know it was a mistake to put her with Biden. Hell, she's lost three staffers in the last two weeks.

---

Agree.

Dems and Pubs are in an interesting place where the presumptive favorites to lead the charge in both parties (Kamala and Trump) both face significant electability problems before the race even begins.

Will be interesting to see who ultimately takes the nominations. If I had to guess today, I think it's mayor Pete and DeSantis but who knows.

---

If I am not mistaken Trump got the second most votes ever. He can get the votes.

---

You're correct. But he lost to a mediocre candidate who garnered the most votes ever, largely because tens of millions voted against Trump. That's the risk. That's the electability problem for Trump.

---

Those that voted against Trump see what they got. Probably the worst President ever. Will not be as inclined to vote against trump the next time.

---

False dichotomy, Trump doesn't have to be the choice, and Trump may not be running against Biden again. He may be running against a candidate that lacks Biden's drawbacks.

Ask yourself, who would have the greater odds of losing, Trump or DeSantis?

---

You brought up Trump. I did not. Specifically you said trump and Harris.

---

Who do you think takes the Republican nomination, if you had to guess today?

Civilized said:

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Cthepack said:

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Civilized said:

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Cthepack said:

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Civilized said:

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Cthepack said:

---

Civilized said:

---

caryking said:

---

WPNfamily said:

---

PackFansXL said:

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It's Okay to Wonder about Biden's Mental State

Quote:

---

Because of Biden's long history of habitual dishonesty, it is difficult to tell how much of this is Biden being Biden and how much of it is Biden no longer quite being Biden how much is his longstanding and familiar moral disability and how much is, as it may be, late-life mental disability.

We need an independent medical assessment of the president's mental health. That is a sobering fact to face, but face it we must. And right now, we need a Democrat who will say so in public.

---

---

If ya think Biden sucks wait until you see Kamala

---

Kamala will never happen! The Dems know it was a mistake to put her with Biden. Hell, she's lost three staffers in the last two weeks.

---

Agree.

Dems and Pubs are in an interesting place where the presumptive favorites to lead the charge in both parties (Kamala and Trump) both face significant electability problems before the race even begins.

Will be interesting to see who ultimately takes the nominations. If I had to guess today, I think it's mayor Pete and DeSantis but who knows.

---

If I am not mistaken Trump got the second most votes ever. He can get the votes.

---

You're correct. But he lost to a mediocre candidate who garnered the most votes ever, largely because tens of millions voted against Trump. That's the risk. That's the electability problem for Trump.

---

Those that voted against Trump see what they got. Probably the worst President ever. Will not be as inclined to vote against trump the next time.

---

False dichotomy, Trump doesn't have to be the choice, and Trump may not be running against Biden again. He may be running against a candidate that lacks Biden's drawbacks.

Ask yourself, who would have the greater odds of losing, Trump or DeSantis?

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You brought up Trump. I did not. Specifically you said trump and Harris.

---

Who do you think takes the Republican nomination, if you had to guess today?

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I am not here to discuss that. At this point I really do not care and dislike both parties. Lean more conservative because I do not like gov taking my money.

I responded to your comment about Trump and Harris. You are a strong dem who hates the bad orange man so I made a point about trumps ability to get votes.

Civilized said:

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You're correct. But he lost to a mediocre candidate who garnered the most votes ever, largely because tens of millions voted against Trump. That's the risk. That's the electability problem for Trump.

---

That was before this current **** show rolled up their sleeves and got to work also.

TheStorm said:

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Civilized said:

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You're correct. But he lost to a mediocre candidate who garnered the most votes ever, largely because tens of millions voted against Trump. That's the risk. That's the electability problem for Trump.

---

That was before this current **** show rolled up their sleeves and got to work also.

---

I do think thank that if trump runs on his policy and what he's done, and dials back the abrasiveness a bit, he could win again. Have heard a Trump/DeSantis ticket is possible.

WPNfamily said:

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caryking said:

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WPNfamily said:

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PackFansXL said:

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It's Okay to Wonder about Biden's Mental State

Quote:

---

Because of Biden's long history of habitual dishonesty, it is difficult to tell how much of this is Biden being Biden and how much of it is Biden no longer quite being Biden how much is his longstanding and familiar moral disability and how much is, as it may be, late-life mental disability.

We need an independent medical assessment of the president's mental health. That is a sobering fact to face, but face it we must. And right now, we need a Democrat who will say so in public.

---

---

If ya think Biden sucks wait until you see Kamala

---

Kamala will never happen! The Dems know it was a mistake to put her with Biden. Hell, she's lost three staffers in the last two weeks.

---

The article was about Biden's mental state. If he is not mentally there to complete his term then Kamala is absolutely who we are stuck with. I do agree Kamala is not electable from the dem base. But if it is sooner than later it's what we get and I prefer the existing vegetable to be the leader if Kamala is the other option.

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Supposedly, Dr. Jill is trying to figure out was to get rid of Kamala. Also the money Dems know Kamala is a liability, so, they are trying to help Dr. Jill. Kamala is noose around their neck. Three of her senior people have left recently. The writing is on the wall!!!

Steve Videtich said:

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RunsWithWolves26 said:

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Just so no one forgets.


**** YOU JOE BIDEN!!!

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I thought it was LET'S GO BRANDON!?!

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It's both!

TheStorm said:

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Civilized said:

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You're correct. But he lost to a mediocre candidate who garnered the most votes ever, largely because tens of millions voted against Trump. That's the risk. That's the electability problem for Trump.

---

That was before this current **** show rolled up their sleeves and got to work also.

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Very true.

There would be many Biden-to-Trump voters this time around.

Steve Videtich said:

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TheStorm said:

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Civilized said:

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You're correct. But he lost to a mediocre candidate who garnered the most votes ever, largely because tens of millions voted against Trump. That's the risk. That's the electability problem for Trump.

---

That was before this current **** show rolled up their sleeves and got to work also.

---

I do think thank that if trump runs on his policy and what he's done, and dials back the abrasiveness a bit, he could win again. Have heard a Trump/DeSantis ticket is possible.

---

Agree, but him becoming less abrasive is a really big caveat.

If Trump could find a way to dial back the buffoonery 35% and adds DeSantis to the ticket I think that could be a winning play.

I think a much stronger play would be a DeSantis/Haley or a DeSantis/Scott ticket or something similar (not happening, I'm just using as an example) where there's a Trump pub at the top of the ticket being balanced by someone charismatic and less divisive as VP.

I don't see how that type of ticket loses in this climate. It sure as hell ain't losing to Biden or Kamala, that's for sure.

Civilized said:

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Steve Videtich said:

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TheStorm said:

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Civilized said:

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You're correct. But he lost to a mediocre candidate who garnered the most votes ever, largely because tens of millions voted against Trump. That's the risk. That's the electability problem for Trump.

---

That was before this current **** show rolled up their sleeves and got to work also.

---

I do think thank that if trump runs on his policy and what he's done, and dials back the abrasiveness a bit, he could win again. Have heard a Trump/DeSantis ticket is possible.

---

Agree, but him becoming less abrasive is a really big caveat.

If Trump could find a way to dial back the buffoonery 35% and adds DeSantis to the ticket I think that could be a winning play.

I think a much stronger play would be a DeSantis/Haley or a DeSantis/Scott ticket or something similar (not happening, I'm just using as an example) where there's a Trump pub at the top of the ticket being balanced by someone charismatic and less divisive as VP.

I don't see how that type of ticket loses in this climate. It sure as hell ain't losing to Biden or Kamala, that's for sure.

---

I think the plan would be for Trump to get 4 more years and then roll DeSantis right into the next 8 years. But yes, lose the steal rhetoric and stick to policy.

Civilized said:

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Steve Videtich said:

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TheStorm said:

---

Civilized said:

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You're correct. But he lost to a mediocre candidate who garnered the most votes ever, largely because tens of millions voted against Trump. That's the risk. That's the electability problem for Trump.

---

That was before this current **** show rolled up their sleeves and got to work also.

---

I do think thank that if trump runs on his policy and what he's done, and dials back the abrasiveness a bit, he could win again. Have heard a Trump/DeSantis ticket is possible.

---

Agree, but him becoming less abrasive is a really big caveat.

If Trump could find a way to dial back the buffoonery 35% and adds DeSantis to the ticket I think that could be a winning play.

I think a much stronger play would be a DeSantis/Haley or a DeSantis/Scott ticket or something similar (not happening, I'm just using as an example) where there's a Trump pub at the top of the ticket being balanced by someone charismatic and less divisive as VP.

I don't see how that type of ticket loses in this climate. It sure as hell ain't losing to Biden or Kamala, that's for sure.

---

Civ, I think I heard Trump say he would do things differently regarding Social Media. I'm not sure what that means.

Nikki Haley is a hard PASS!!! Scott hasn't shown he is an America First candidate. Desantis needs to remain Governor until it's his time for President.

caryking said:

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Civilized said:

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Steve Videtich said:

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TheStorm said:

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Civilized said:

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You're correct. But he lost to a mediocre candidate who garnered the most votes ever, largely because tens of millions voted against Trump. That's the risk. That's the electability problem for Trump.

---

That was before this current **** show rolled up their sleeves and got to work also.

---

I do think thank that if trump runs on his policy and what he's done, and dials back the abrasiveness a bit, he could win again. Have heard a Trump/DeSantis ticket is possible.

---

Agree, but him becoming less abrasive is a really big caveat.

If Trump could find a way to dial back the buffoonery 35% and adds DeSantis to the ticket I think that could be a winning play.

I think a much stronger play would be a DeSantis/Haley or a DeSantis/Scott ticket or something similar (not happening, I'm just using as an example) where there's a Trump pub at the top of the ticket being balanced by someone charismatic and less divisive as VP.

I don't see how that type of ticket loses in this climate. It sure as hell ain't losing to Biden or Kamala, that's for sure.

---

Civ, I think I heard Trump say he would do things differently regarding Social Media. I'm not sure what that means.

Nikki Haley is a hard PASS!!! Scott hasn't shown he is an America First candidate. Desantis needs to remain Governor until it's his time for President.

---

Trump isn't dumb, he's just incredibly impulsive.

If he can temper that urge to lash out and stay on message, especially on social media, that would be huge.

That's exactly the type of refinement that could help win over enough of the moderate vote to steal the election, if you know what I'm sayin'.

Steve Videtich said:

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Civilized said:

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Steve Videtich said:

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TheStorm said:

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Civilized said:

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You're correct. But he lost to a mediocre candidate who garnered the most votes ever, largely because tens of millions voted against Trump. That's the risk. That's the electability problem for Trump.

---

That was before this current **** show rolled up their sleeves and got to work also.

---

I do think thank that if trump runs on his policy and what he's done, and dials back the abrasiveness a bit, he could win again. Have heard a Trump/DeSantis ticket is possible.

---

Agree, but him becoming less abrasive is a really big caveat.

If Trump could find a way to dial back the buffoonery 35% and adds DeSantis to the ticket I think that could be a winning play.

I think a much stronger play would be a DeSantis/Haley or a DeSantis/Scott ticket or something similar (not happening, I'm just using as an example) where there's a Trump pub at the top of the ticket being balanced by someone charismatic and less divisive as VP.

I don't see how that type of ticket loses in this climate. It sure as hell ain't losing to Biden or Kamala, that's for sure.

---

I think the plan would be for Trump to get 4 more years and then roll DeSantis right into the next 8 years. But yes, lose the steal rhetoric and stick to policy.

---

I just wonder if that falls in the category of "you don't want to be the man that follows the man, you want to be the man that follows the man that followed the man."

My fear there as a pub is that a lame-duck Trump poisons the electoral well for whichever Republican follows him. Pubs may be able to get Trump re-elected in 24 but following that up with 8 more years of Trumpism leadership seems unlikely.

Although we'll never know the answer definitively, the question for me if I'm a Republican becomes would I rather gamble on being able to get DeSantis elected after Trump, if Trump were to win, or do I want to run DeSantis in 2024 when much of the country will be hungry for change.

In football parlance, 2024 is a weak quarterback class but 2028 looks a lot stronger.

IseWolf22 said:

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Steve Videtich said:

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TheStorm said:

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Civilized said:

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You're correct. But he lost to a mediocre candidate who garnered the most votes ever, largely because tens of millions voted against Trump. That's the risk. That's the electability problem for Trump.

---

That was before this current **** show rolled up their sleeves and got to work also.

---

I do think thank that if trump runs on his policy and what he's done, and dials back the abrasiveness a bit, he could win again. Have heard a Trump/DeSantis ticket is possible.

---

I don't think he's capable of that. Advisors spent his entire term trying to get to get him to stay on message and failed.

Trump may be the weakest general election candidate who has a shot at the Republican primary. Pick anyone else, anyone.

---

Yet he still could possibly win!

Civilized said:

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Steve Videtich said:

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Civilized said:

---

Steve Videtich said:

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TheStorm said:

---

Civilized said:

---

You're correct. But he lost to a mediocre candidate who garnered the most votes ever, largely because tens of millions voted against Trump. That's the risk. That's the electability problem for Trump.

---

That was before this current **** show rolled up their sleeves and got to work also.

---

I do think thank that if trump runs on his policy and what he's done, and dials back the abrasiveness a bit, he could win again. Have heard a Trump/DeSantis ticket is possible.

---

Agree, but him becoming less abrasive is a really big caveat.

If Trump could find a way to dial back the buffoonery 35% and adds DeSantis to the ticket I think that could be a winning play.

I think a much stronger play would be a DeSantis/Haley or a DeSantis/Scott ticket or something similar (not happening, I'm just using as an example) where there's a Trump pub at the top of the ticket being balanced by someone charismatic and less divisive as VP.

I don't see how that type of ticket loses in this climate. It sure as hell ain't losing to Biden or Kamala, that's for sure.

---

I think the plan would be for Trump to get 4 more years and then roll DeSantis right into the next 8 years. But yes, lose the steal rhetoric and stick to policy.

---

I just wonder if that falls in the category of "you don't want to be the man that follows the man, you want to be the man that follows the man that followed the man."

My fear there as a pub is that a lame-duck Trump poisons the electoral well for whichever Republican follows him. Pubs may be able to get Trump re-elected in 24 but following that up with 8 more years of Trumpism leadership seems unlikely.

Although we'll never know the answer definitively, the question for me if I'm a Republican becomes would I rather gamble on being able to get DeSantis elected after Trump, if Trump were to win, or do I want to run DeSantis in 2024 when much of the country will be hungry for change.

In football parlance, 2024 is a weak quarterback class but 2028 looks a lot stronger.

---

What you could potentially see is similar to 1980, coming out of the Carter years. It was so bad, then rolled into 12 years of Republican presidency. Would DeSantis be strong enough to get some voters back that didn't like the antics and couldn't look beyond it to see the solid things he did.