Coronavirus

2,626,582 Views | 20307 Replies | Last: 1 day ago by Werewolf
PackPA2015
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Trust me, the local providers have stressed and stressed to stay home when sick and the message has not landed. We have stressed importance of vaccination, washing hands, improving diet and exercise, etc. Yet again, here we are.

We are not able to see our normal follow-up patients, because we are having to see CLI patients in droves.

ETA: mask mandate in place at least for now. Board meets again in 10 days. Don't shoot the messenger.
TheStorm
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PackPA2015 said:

I appreciate you sharing the county I work in publicly friend.

Not sure what site you have seen this number, the update from our local health department on Tuesday was 36% fully vaccinated. Even if it is 39.1%, that's still pretty awful. It is showing in our cases and hospitalizations rather quickly.
https://www.newsobserver.com/news/coronavirus/article253682788.html

News & Observer from yesterday. You didn't have to confirm the county. That's on you. What's obvious is obvious.

18 and older. Why don't you give us the demographics of those in danger of dying.
PackPA2015
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Define "danger of dying". We have seen deaths in as young as 40's. Most of our county are obese and/or have more than 1 chronic medical problem, so risk is all over the place.

I have told you multiple times, I don't want my personal information shared on here. Does the right to privacy only apply to you?

ETA: Sorry, I am a little chippy tonight. Exhausted due to understaffing at the office and being on call.
TheStorm
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What are you talking about? You posted your numbers. Not me. I don't know you from Adam. But I know how to read a chart (that you undercut, by the way). And at 18 and above at that. First time I've seen that sht trolled out there.

Not willing to give us verifiable numbers by age? And who is actually at risk of dying?

Back to you.
PackPA2015
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You were the one that posted my county after I have asked to not have my information shared multiple times. It is a small county with limited number of providers. I post private information from our clinic and multiple hospital systems. I do that to help inform. I do that in hopes of it staying here. And I don't want my personal information associated with it. I didn't think that was too much to ask.

If you can read the chart, then you can find that information yourself brother. If you don't like my information, hit the ignore.
Daviewolf83
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Staff
I just checked NCDHHS data for Rutherford County:

One Dose = 24,248
Fully Vaccinated = 21,664
Population = 67,029
% of population fully vaccinated = 32.3%
Cases in last 7 days = 316 (47 for every 10,000 residents)

In comparison, let's look at Orange County, one of the most heavily vaccinated counties in NC:
One Dose = 119,323
Fully Vaccinated = 114,307
Population = 148,476
% of population fully vaccinated = 76.9%
Cases in last 7 days = 268 (18 for every 10,000 residents)

The case rate in Rutherford County is 2.6 times higher than the case rate for Orange County and the reason is the lack of vaccinations for the population in Rutherford County.

Bottom line - Vaccinations matter and the lower the rate of vaccination in a county, the higher the case rate in the county. This is a pandemic propelled by the unvaccinated. It is the unvaccinated that make up the vast majority of cases of Covid-19. It is the unvaccinated that make up the vast majority of hospitalizations for Covid-19. It is the unvaccinated that make up the vast majority of Covid deaths.
GuerrillaPack
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One way to protest draconian vaccine passports at restaurants:

https://instagr.am/p/CTCxidjnY5Y
"Ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you." - John 15:19
GuerrillaPack
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On the fact that natural immunity is much more effective than the "vaccines":

https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/medical/dr-makary-says-natural-immunity-is-more-effective-then-vaccine-immunity/ar-AAMX3sM

Quote:

Dr. Marty Makary, a professor at John Hopkins School of Medicine, during an appearance on The Vince Coglianese Show, said individuals formerly infected with COVID-19 are seven times more likely then vaccinated people to fight off the virus.

"It appears that natural immunity is better against the Delta variant. When you get infected with COVID, your body's immune system develops antibodies to the entire surface of the virus," Makary said. "Not just the slight protein that the vaccines gives you, but the entire surface. And so you get a more diverse antibody portfolio in your system."

Makary said data from Israel revealed that natural immunity appears to be 6.7x more effective than being vaccinated when it comes to fighting off COVID-19.
"Ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you." - John 15:19
packgrad
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GuerrillaPack said:

On the fact that natural immunity is much more effective than the "vaccines":

https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/medical/dr-makary-says-natural-immunity-is-more-effective-then-vaccine-immunity/ar-AAMX3sM

Quote:

Dr. Marty Makary, a professor at John Hopkins School of Medicine, during an appearance on The Vince Coglianese Show, said individuals formerly infected with COVID-19 are seven times more likely then vaccinated people to fight off the virus.

"It appears that natural immunity is better against the Delta variant. When you get infected with COVID, your body's immune system develops antibodies to the entire surface of the virus," Makary said. "Not just the slight protein that the vaccines gives you, but the entire surface. And so you get a more diverse antibody portfolio in your system."

Makary said data from Israel revealed that natural immunity appears to be 6.7x more effective than being vaccinated when it comes to fighting off COVID-19.


They don't want to talk about that guerilla. On studies that show natural immunity, we have to question the groups sampled. On ones that show vaccine positivity that underrepresent groups, silence.
PackPA2015
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packgrad said:

GuerrillaPack said:

On the fact that natural immunity is much more effective than the "vaccines":

https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/medical/dr-makary-says-natural-immunity-is-more-effective-then-vaccine-immunity/ar-AAMX3sM

Quote:

Dr. Marty Makary, a professor at John Hopkins School of Medicine, during an appearance on The Vince Coglianese Show, said individuals formerly infected with COVID-19 are seven times more likely then vaccinated people to fight off the virus.

"It appears that natural immunity is better against the Delta variant. When you get infected with COVID, your body's immune system develops antibodies to the entire surface of the virus," Makary said. "Not just the slight protein that the vaccines gives you, but the entire surface. And so you get a more diverse antibody portfolio in your system."

Makary said data from Israel revealed that natural immunity appears to be 6.7x more effective than being vaccinated when it comes to fighting off COVID-19.


They don't want to talk about that guerilla. On studies that show natural immunity, we have to question the groups sampled. On ones that show vaccine positivity that underrepresent groups, silence.


Come on Grad, that is a horrible misrepresentation of what I said. I said we need RCTs to prove it either way. I agreed that both studies were significantly flawed.
packgrad
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PackPA2015 said:

packgrad said:

GuerrillaPack said:

On the fact that natural immunity is much more effective than the "vaccines":

https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/medical/dr-makary-says-natural-immunity-is-more-effective-then-vaccine-immunity/ar-AAMX3sM

Quote:

Dr. Marty Makary, a professor at John Hopkins School of Medicine, during an appearance on The Vince Coglianese Show, said individuals formerly infected with COVID-19 are seven times more likely then vaccinated people to fight off the virus.

"It appears that natural immunity is better against the Delta variant. When you get infected with COVID, your body's immune system develops antibodies to the entire surface of the virus," Makary said. "Not just the slight protein that the vaccines gives you, but the entire surface. And so you get a more diverse antibody portfolio in your system."

Makary said data from Israel revealed that natural immunity appears to be 6.7x more effective than being vaccinated when it comes to fighting off COVID-19.


They don't want to talk about that guerilla. On studies that show natural immunity, we have to question the groups sampled. On ones that show vaccine positivity that underrepresent groups, silence.


Come on Grad, that is a horrible misrepresentation of what I said. I said we need RCTs to prove it either way. I agreed that both studies were significantly flawed.


Sure. 5 studies were posted with one narrative with no comment from you. One study posted with the contrarian position and you commented questioning the populations sampled. I believe you.
PackPA2015
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Ok.
packgrad
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Agreed.
Mormad
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TheStorm said:

Mormad, any update on your wife's friend that caught it a couple of weeks back and got pretty sick? Hope that she got better and still isn't suffering any lingering effects. Curious to hear the details when you get a chance to share them.


Both she and her husband have recovered with no ill effects.

She had the jj vax in April and got the disease from him, who was unvaxxed because of a health condition. He got it at work, and it shut down his business for 10 days (he owns a tire place). Most that worked there got it. He had diarrhea and vomiting with no resp symptoms, and overall wasn't all that sick. She, on the other hand, had no fever but bad cold like symptoms and difficulty breathing. She struggled with the resp issues. She got better with steroids, and the illness lasted about a week.

Both in early 50s. She's healthy and vaxxed and got sick enough for roids. He has a kidney issue that's worrisome, that could lead to transplant, and was unvaxxed and only had GI issues. Weird disease.

Thank you for asking. These are really great, salt of the earth people.
Daviewolf83
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Staff
Mormad said:

TheStorm said:

Mormad, any update on your wife's friend that caught it a couple of weeks back and got pretty sick? Hope that she got better and still isn't suffering any lingering effects. Curious to hear the details when you get a chance to share them.


Both she and her husband have recovered with no ill effects.

She had the jj vax in April and got the disease from him, who was unvaxxed because of a health condition. He got it at work, and it shut down his business for 10 days (he owns a tire place). Most that worked there got it. He had diarrhea and vomiting with no resp symptoms, and overall wasn't all that sick. She, on the other hand, had no fever but bad cold like symptoms and difficulty breathing. She struggled with the resp issues. She got better with steroids, and the illness lasted about a week.

Both in early 50s. She's healthy and vaxxed and got sick enough for roids. He has a kidney issue that's worrisome, that could lead to transplant, and was unvaxxed and only had GI issues. Weird disease.

Thank you for asking. These are really great, salt of the earth people.
Thanks for the update and good to hear they are doing better. Hopefully they make a full recovery.
packgrad
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Mask the children. Cases are rising in schools.

Intimate relationships- irrelevant. Cases are rising.
Obesity- irrelevant. Cases are rising
Depression- irrelevant. Cases are rising.
Language development- irrelevant. Cases are rising.

The godawful, horse****, partisan, fake professional society AAP said , "0.00%-0.03% of all child COVID-19 cases resulted in death" this past week. - irrelevant. Cases are rising.

Mask the children.

Emergency meeting.

packgrad
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hokiewolf
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packgrad said:

statefan91 said:

And just like that, covid cases have shut down daycare. Need adults to step up and get vaccinated and reduce transmission to these little kids.


Sounds like you need a new daycare.
Lol, Easier said then done! Every daycare in the triangle worth their salt has a looooooong waiting list. Ours shut down for two weeks too and just opened back up. Took their protocols very seriously and still had a case come into the daycare.
ciscopack
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On the 6th of January 1777, George Washington wrote to Dr. William Shippen Jr., ordering him to inoculate all of the forces that came through Philadelphia. He explained that: "Necessity not only authorizes but seems to require the measure, for should the disorder infect the Army . . . we should have more to dread from it, than from the Sword of the Enemy." (Small Pox)
TheStorm
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Mormad said:

TheStorm said:

Mormad, any update on your wife's friend that caught it a couple of weeks back and got pretty sick? Hope that she got better and still isn't suffering any lingering effects. Curious to hear the details when you get a chance to share them.


Both she and her husband have recovered with no ill effects.

She had the jj vax in April and got the disease from him, who was unvaxxed because of a health condition. He got it at work, and it shut down his business for 10 days (he owns a tire place). Most that worked there got it. He had diarrhea and vomiting with no resp symptoms, and overall wasn't all that sick. She, on the other hand, had no fever but bad cold like symptoms and difficulty breathing. She struggled with the resp issues. She got better with steroids, and the illness lasted about a week.

Both in early 50s. She's healthy and vaxxed and got sick enough for roids. He has a kidney issue that's worrisome, that could lead to transplant, and was unvaxxed and only had GI issues. Weird disease.

Thank you for asking. These are really great, salt of the earth people.
Glad to hear that they both have mostly recovered. What kind of steroids are they prescribing in these situations? Is it those ramped up doses of Prednisone like you get after surgery?
GuerrillaPack
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ciscopack said:

On the 6th of January 1777, George Washington wrote to Dr. William Shippen Jr., ordering him to inoculate all of the forces that came through Philadelphia. He explained that: "Necessity not only authorizes but seems to require the measure, for should the disorder infect the Army . . . we should have more to dread from it, than from the Sword of the Enemy." (Small Pox)

Just because he made such an order doesn't make it right. Just because you join the military doesn't mean you should no longer have any control over what goes into your own body. The only way that could be justifiable is if the person who joined the military knowingly consents to that -- which is guess is what is going on with today's military members when they sign the contract to join.

In the case there in what Washington apparently did, I highly doubt the military members had signed any sort of paperwork providing that consent. And in that case Washington was effectively acting as a "dictator", and violating the rights of those military members.

This in no way would apply to the general population today, as we are not all active military members who have "signed our lives away" to the government. We still have rights, including what we do with our own bodies.
"Ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you." - John 15:19
ciscopack
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GuerrillaPack said:

ciscopack said:

On the 6th of January 1777, George Washington wrote to Dr. William Shippen Jr., ordering him to inoculate all of the forces that came through Philadelphia. He explained that: "Necessity not only authorizes but seems to require the measure, for should the disorder infect the Army . . . we should have more to dread from it, than from the Sword of the Enemy." (Small Pox)

Just because he made such an order doesn't make it right. Just because you join the military doesn't mean you should no longer have any control over what goes into your own body. The only way that could be justifiable is if the person who joined the military knowingly consents to that -- which is guess is what is going on with today's military members.

This in no way would apply to the general population today, as we are not all active military members who have "signed our lives away" to the government. We still have rights, including what we do with our own bodies.
King George would be happy!!!! His troops had already been inoculated. Welcome back to England.
GuerrillaPack
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ciscopack said:



King George would be happy!!!! His troops had already been inoculated. Welcome to back England.
If your argument is that we should just do everything as the Founders did...then I guess you could also argue that we should bring back slavery. George Washington owned slaves too. Also, let's return to extremely limited government and abolish the income tax...and only let male landowners vote.

You're not going to like doing some of these things. I would actually support most of the Founders' views.

Each position/issue must be looked at separately from a logical and ethical standpoint. You don't just decide what is good or bad policy, by saying "hey let's do everything as this person did it"....unless we do things as God does them....which is the way we should be setting all policies/laws.
"Ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you." - John 15:19
BBW12OG
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BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!! BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!

You can spout your lefty jargon here but yet you won't participate in the Biden thread? Wonder why comrade?

Big Bad Wolf. OG...2002

"The Democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not."
- Thomas Jefferson
Daviewolf83
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Staff
Regarding the question of protection from past infection, Science Magazine has an article published yesterday concerning a large study out of Israel that shows natural immunity from previous infection provides stronger protection than vaccination. It also points out that vaccinations offer strong protection, so people should not try to get infected in an attempt to get this protection. Getting vaccinated is the safer approach to gaining protection.
Quote:

"The study demonstrates the power of the human immune system, but infectious disease experts emphasized that this vaccine and others for COVID-19 nonetheless remain highly protective against severe disease and death. And they caution that intentional infection among unvaccinated people would be extremely risky."

One key point, those who had been previously infected, had even stronger protection after receiving one dose of the Pfizer vaccine. This should help answer the question regarding people who have been previously infected getting vaccinated.
Quote:

"Individuals who were both previously infected with SARS-CoV-2 and given a single dose of the vaccine gained additional protection against the Delta variant."


You can read the article in Science Magazine at the following link:

Having SARS-CoV-2 once confers much greater immunity than a vaccinebut no infection parties, please


The study was just posted yesterday in MedRxiv and you can access it at the link below:

Comparing SARS-CoV-2 natural immunity to vaccine-induced immunity: reinfections versus breakthrough infections
Wayland
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Daviewolf83 said:

Regarding the question of protection from past infection, Science Magazine has an article published yesterday concerning a large study out of Israel that shows natural immunity from previous infection provides stronger protection than vaccination. It also points out that vaccinations offer strong protection, so people should not try to get infected in an attempt to get this protection. Getting vaccinated is the safer approach to gaining protection.
Quote:

"The study demonstrates the power of the human immune system, but infectious disease experts emphasized that this vaccine and others for COVID-19 nonetheless remain highly protective against severe disease and death. And they caution that intentional infection among unvaccinated people would be extremely risky."

One key point, those who had been previously infected, had even stronger protection after receiving one dose of the Pfizer vaccine. This should help answer the question regarding people who have been previously infected getting vaccinated.
Quote:

"Individuals who were both previously infected with SARS-CoV-2 and given a single dose of the vaccine gained additional protection against the Delta variant."


You can read the article in Science Magazine at the following link:

Having SARS-CoV-2 once confers much greater immunity than a vaccinebut no infection parties, please


The study was just posted yesterday in MedRxiv and you can access it at the link below:

Comparing SARS-CoV-2 natural immunity to vaccine-induced immunity: reinfections versus breakthrough infections


Oldsouljer
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ciscopack said:

On the 6th of January 1777, George Washington wrote to Dr. William Shippen Jr., ordering him to inoculate all of the forces that came through Philadelphia. He explained that: "Necessity not only authorizes but seems to require the measure, for should the disorder infect the Army . . . we should have more to dread from it, than from the Sword of the Enemy." (Small Pox)

Oooooh, I've been waiting for someone to bring up that little piece of history, That wasn't true inoculation as we know it today, it was an incredibly risky form of exposure called "variolation" and it had a 5-10% fatality rate. Edward Jenner would not demonstrate his famous (and less lethal) experiment with cowpox for more than a decade later. Washington's gambit paid off in the end but a lot of continental soldiers paid the ultimate price for it. The British didn't have the same problem because smallpox was endemic back in the old country.
GuerrillaPack
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Just went to the Chipotle at South Pointe Mall in Durham for the first time since the recent Durham County mask "mandate". They had a sign on the entrance about it, but specifying the medical exemption. I walked in without a mask, and told the first employee I saw that I have a medical exemption. She nonchalantly said "that's fine" and didn't really seem to care at all. Traffic in the store is much lower than usual. Only one other customer was in there when I ordered. No doubt that the mask mandates drive down business.

Also, the manager was interacting with employees without a mask on.

When you see a sign saying "Mask Required To Enter" it seems intimidating. But most places are just putting up those signs to give the appearance of complying with the local ordinance, and most businesses don't want to enforce it and probably aren't. Once you talk to an employee, probably 95% of them don't care if you don't wear a mask for ANY reason. And once you claim a medical exemption, they can't require you to wear one.
"Ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you." - John 15:19
Mormad
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Decadron (dexamethasone)
Oldsouljer
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Mormad said:

Decadron (dexamethasone)
If they sold that at a Carter-Finley concession stand, I'd buy it.
ciscopack
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ciscopack said:

GuerrillaPack said:

ciscopack said:

On the 6th of January 1777, George Washington wrote to Dr. William Shippen Jr., ordering him to inoculate all of the forces that came through Philadelphia. He explained that: "Necessity not only authorizes but seems to require the measure, for should the disorder infect the Army . . . we should have more to dread from it, than from the Sword of the Enemy." (Small Pox)

Just because he made such an order doesn't make it right. Just because you join the military doesn't mean you should no longer have any control over what goes into your own body. The only way that could be justifiable is if the person who joined the military knowingly consents to that -- which is guess is what is going on with today's military members.

This in no way would apply to the general population today, as we are not all active military members who have "signed our lives away" to the government. We still have rights, including what we do with our own bodies.
King George would be happy!!!! His troops had already been inoculated. Welcome back to England.
WE would not be the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA if not was that 1777 mandate to vaccinate the troops!

At the time, the practice of infecting the individual with a less-deadly form of the disease was widespread throughout Europe. Most British troops were immune to Variola (Small Pox), giving them an enormous advantage against the vulnerable colonists. (Fenn 2001, 131) Conversely, the history of inoculation in America (beginning with the efforts of the Reverend Cotton Mather in 1720) was pocked by the fear of the contamination potential of the process. Such fears led the Continental Congress to issue a proclamation in 1776 prohibiting Surgeons of the Army to inoculate.

Washington suspected the only available recourse was inoculation, yet contagion risks aside, he knew that a mass inoculation put the entire army in a precarious position should the British hear of his plans. Moreover, Historians estimate that less than a quarter of the Continental Army had ever had the virus; inoculating the remaining three quarters and every new recruit must have seemed daunting. Yet the high prevalence of disease among the army regulars was a significant deterrent to desperately needed recruits, and a dramatic reform was needed to allay their fears.

Weighing the risks, on February 5th of 1777, Washington finally committed to the unpopular policy of mass inoculation by writing to inform Congress of his plan. Throughout February, Washington, with no precedent for the operation he was about to undertake, covertly communicated to his commanding officers orders to oversee mass inoculations of their troops in the model of Morristown and Philadelphia (Dr. Shippen's Hospital). At least eleven hospitals had been constructed by the year's end.

Variola raged throughout the war, devastating the Native American population and slaves who had chosen to fight for the British in exchange for freedom. Yet the isolated infections that sprung up among Continental regulars during the southern campaign failed to incapacitate a single regiment. With few surgeons, fewer medical supplies, and no experience, Washington conducted the first mass inoculation of an army at the height of a war that immeasurably transformed the international system. Defeating the British was impressive, but simultaneously taking on Variola (Small Pox) was a risky stroke of genius.


statefan91
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Wayland
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statefan91 said:


We can go back to normal whenever we choose to stop the insane theater.

Over 80% of adults in Wake County (and >12) have received at least one dose of vaccine and yet we just had our ~6th highest day of cases by collection date.

Maybe Denmark gets hit later... maybe not. Other countries have been basically normal this whole time. While some seem to cycle through mostly useless broad interventions instead of small focused efforts.

I mean Sweden has been at basically zero deaths for months (and half the cases of Denmark) and they were well behind places like US, UK, and Israel when it came to vaccinations for a long time and Sweden is at basically 50% pop vaxxed now. Sweden has been about as close to normal as any Western country and yet here we are. It isn't as simple as % vax.

There are a huge number of variables in all of this.

Again, not saying don't get vax. Vax lowers chance of severe outcomes.

But policy is a choice. We have been abiding by failed polices for over a year and a half.

We go back to 'normal' when we stop abiding by the theater of failed public health policy.

TLDR: Stay home if sick.

caryking
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ciscopack said:

WE would not be the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA if not was that 1777 mandate to vaccinate the troops!

At the time, the practice of infecting the individual with a less-deadly form of the disease was widespread throughout Europe. Most British troops were immune to Variola (Small Pox), giving them an enormous advantage against the vulnerable colonists. (Fenn 2001, 131) Conversely, the history of inoculation in America (beginning with the efforts of the Reverend Cotton Mather in 1720) was pocked by the fear of the contamination potential of the process. Such fears led the Continental Congress to issue a proclamation in 1776 prohibiting Surgeons of the Army to inoculate.

Washington suspected the only available recourse was inoculation, yet contagion risks aside, he knew that a mass inoculation put the entire army in a precarious position should the British hear of his plans. Moreover, Historians estimate that less than a quarter of the Continental Army had ever had the virus; inoculating the remaining three quarters and every new recruit must have seemed daunting. Yet the high prevalence of disease among the army regulars was a significant deterrent to desperately needed recruits, and a dramatic reform was needed to allay their fears.

Weighing the risks, on February 5th of 1777, Washington finally committed to the unpopular policy of mass inoculation by writing to inform Congress of his plan. Throughout February, Washington, with no precedent for the operation he was about to undertake, covertly communicated to his commanding officers orders to oversee mass inoculations of their troops in the model of Morristown and Philadelphia (Dr. Shippen's Hospital). At least eleven hospitals had been constructed by the year's end.

Variola raged throughout the war, devastating the Native American population and slaves who had chosen to fight for the British in exchange for freedom. Yet the isolated infections that sprung up among Continental regulars during the southern campaign failed to incapacitate a single regiment. With few surgeons, fewer medical supplies, and no experience, Washington conducted the first mass inoculation of an army at the height of a war that immeasurably transformed the international system. Defeating the British was impressive, but simultaneously taking on Variola (Small Pox) was a risky stroke of genius.

We WOULD be the UNITED STATES of AMERICA if every liberal President were NEVER elected! Starting with Woodrow Wilson!!!
On the illegal or criminal immigrants…

“they built the country, the reason our economy is growing”

Joe Biden
Mormad
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Oldsouljer said:

Mormad said:

Decadron (dexamethasone)
If they sold that at a Carter-Finley concession stand, I'd buy it.


It makes everything feel better. All those little fitty yr old aches and pains...
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