Civilized said:

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ncsupack1 said:

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🚨#BREAKING: President Joe Biden appeared in public for the first time in six days since his week-long COVID diagnosis, during which he remained silent and was not heard from. Later, as he boarded Air Force One in Delaware en route to the White House, he announced the suspension… pic.twitter.com/GeMonwkowS

— R A W S A L E R T S (@rawsalerts) July 23, 2024

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Phew. What a cliffhanger.

Without clicking on the tweet I was certain it said "...he announced the suspension...of democracy and life in this country as we know it."

Glad it's all working out OK.

---

That post was to show that he is alive

SmaptyWolf said:

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Wolfpack8602 said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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Civilized said:

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CoachCase said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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CoachCase said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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CoachCase said:

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Civilized said:

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CoachCase said:

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Civilized said:

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Gulfstream4 said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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Gulfstream4 said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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Civilized said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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1st, It was a Tweet. 2nd, it's a photo copy. 3rd, it's not on official letterhead. 4th, he's never signed his signature with line under his signature.

It's not coming from the President. It's coming from others. If it were really his decision, there would have been somehing far more official than a freaking tweet.

---

So what are you suggesting?

He's being held hostage in his beach house basement?

He's all tubes and respirators now? Laid up in some hospital bed, half man, half machine?

What exactly is your paranoid Biden delusion du jour?

---

I am suggesting he is unwell and didn't make this decision on his own. This isn't a delusion, it's coming from the horses mouth.

"Frank Biden made comments to both CBS and ABC News, telling CBS 'in my humble opinion absolutely' the president's health was part of Biden's decision to announce that he wouldn't run for reelection - endorsing Vice President Kamala Harris in the process.

'Selfishly, I will have him back to enjoy whatever time we has left,' Frank Biden told CBS.
"

---

That doesn't sound good for President Biden. I hope I'm wrong.

---

Same here. I don't like watching people become a shell of their former selves, it's depressing. And

Frankly, shame on those around him for letting it get to this point.

---

He wasn't fit in 2020 but the perks for the First Lady and the business opportunities for Hunter and the family were to enticing to pass up.

---

His successes this term fly in the face of the "unfit the last four years" argument.

You obviously disagree with him politically but his adminstration has been unusually productive at implementing their agenda.

---

Civ, serious question. Please list/describe some of the successes that the Biden administration has been able to accomplish? Thank you in advance.

---

Asked and answered in various threads over the last few days.

Now you do Trump. Compare his campaign promises to legislative successes.

---

Lol! I'm sorry that I didn't catch the questions and answers in previous threads. I was just hoping for a few bullet points if nothing else. And I wasn't asking necessarily for campaign promises versus successes but what you liked about his administration. As for Trump, in bullet point answers: (1) economy and unemployment better, (2) national security (esp border) better defined and clear and (3) America was more respected worldwide when it came to our adversaries. Some of our allies were offended when Trump demanded that they pay the same that America was in partnerships such as NATO -which I think Trump's stance is fair. Unfortunately, I don't think Biden/Harris administration can hold a candle to the three issues I listed.

---

Would it really make a difference to point out why your assertions about the economy/unemployment, our national security, and our respect worldwide are at best highly debatable and at worst total nonsense? Somehow I doubt it.

---

Thanks for your input. Sorry to ruffle feathers and ask serious questions hoping for a civil discussion. Obviously that was a mistake.

---

I was being civil, but have seen this movie over and over in the Water Cooler.

Ok, fine, let's start with (3) "America was more respected worldwide when it came to our adversaries." What are you basing that assertion on, aside from what Trump and conservative media have repeated a thousand times? Which adversaries are you talking about?

---

America's traditional enemies - Russia, N Korea, China - didn't like Trump, but they respected him which created fear and the unknown as to what America would do if they became an aggressor. That is certainly not the case now. Trump has been fair when it came to our allies, but he insisted that they pay their fair share and uphold their end of support when it came to agreements such as NATO.

---

Why would Putin and Kim be scared of someone that verbally fellated them every chance he got? Trump didn't scare anyone, he just seemed half-cocked and unpredictable which isn't really a virtue.

And maybe more importantly can you speak to our relationship with our allies under Trump? How were our relationships in the G7/UN/NATO with him at the helm?

---

I'm genuinely curious...

Why has Putin invaded countries during Democrat rule?

I liked the 4 years where the US wasn't funding someone else war. But I guess Dem Warmongers are going to Warmonger.

---

Putin was very stressed about NATO.
Trump had promised to dismantle NATO, and made progress on that front.
Trump lost, so Putin invaded Ukraine, because he was very stressed about NATO.

Is this math equation really that hard for you?

P.S. Dismantling NATO is an EXTREMELY bad idea if you care about U.S. national security, as opposed to Russian national security. Voting for the guy who apparently only cares about the latter is a bad idea, too.

---

So he was so stressed about NATO he decided to piss NATO off even more by invading a country? Yeah sounds like he's very worried about NATO.

---

Putin clearly miscalculated how much Trump had hobbled NATO, and clearly underestimated Biden's ability to rally NATO behind Ukraine and make the alliance stronger then ever. Putin thought Ukraine would be a weekend stroll, and instead got absolutely punched in the teeth.

---

Yep. Gross miscalculation on Putin's part. The human and financial toll has been monstrous for Russia due to NATO's quick and consistent support in defense of Putin's aggression.

SmaptyWolf said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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Civilized said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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The people should know what is going on. We don't.

A random tweet and then a recorded phone call isn't driving home confidence right now. Who is in charge?

---

Presidents don't owe you blow-by-blow updates on their health and I doubt the administration cares about your confidence as Biden recovers from COVID. How is that information actionable for you? They were clear last week he was returning home to isolate, rest, recover, and work.

His doc said yesterday his symptoms were abating and he was carrying out his duties.

They owe you an update if the President's health becomes precarious or worrisome but beyond that it's just tabloid fodder.

---

The President isn't a monarch. He answers to the people and no one else. Frankly, what's transpired is pure disrespect of the American people and democracy itself. Tucking his tale and disappearing while non-democratically electing a nominee to take his place.

This is not democracy.

---

You guys are too much. Don't you blather endlessly about how we're a Republic, not a Democracy... but this Biden thing has you in tears about how undemocratic it is?

Here's a fun fact! Before the 1970's the voters never got the final say on who the candidates would be. The current primary voting system is a modern custom, but ultimately political parties can basically do what they want to pick their candidates.

Let's get real. The only people pushing for an open Dem primary with 3 months left in the race are Republicans and certain news outlets, both of whom would greatly benefit from another month of Dem chaos.

---

Trump up big, so it would seem that Harris is a detriment to the democrats. Plenty of democrats are not happy with having Harris shoved down their throats. That's why she is struggling out of the gates. She wasn't popular 4 years ago and has only become less popular since.

---

And you're upset about this because you want to help the Democrats? Lol, got it!

You definitely don't sound scared sh**less at all.

---

Harris is a disaster. We all know that. The polls are showing that.

What concerns me is this country is a listless ship right now with no real leader in charge.

Civilized said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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Wolfpack8602 said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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Civilized said:

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CoachCase said:

---

SmaptyWolf said:

---

CoachCase said:

---

SmaptyWolf said:

---

CoachCase said:

---

Civilized said:

---

CoachCase said:

---

Civilized said:

---

Gulfstream4 said:

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Wufpack17 said:

---

Gulfstream4 said:

---

Wufpack17 said:

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Civilized said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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1st, It was a Tweet. 2nd, it's a photo copy. 3rd, it's not on official letterhead. 4th, he's never signed his signature with line under his signature.

It's not coming from the President. It's coming from others. If it were really his decision, there would have been somehing far more official than a freaking tweet.

---

So what are you suggesting?

He's being held hostage in his beach house basement?

He's all tubes and respirators now? Laid up in some hospital bed, half man, half machine?

What exactly is your paranoid Biden delusion du jour?

---

I am suggesting he is unwell and didn't make this decision on his own. This isn't a delusion, it's coming from the horses mouth.

"Frank Biden made comments to both CBS and ABC News, telling CBS 'in my humble opinion absolutely' the president's health was part of Biden's decision to announce that he wouldn't run for reelection - endorsing Vice President Kamala Harris in the process.

'Selfishly, I will have him back to enjoy whatever time we has left,' Frank Biden told CBS.
"

---

That doesn't sound good for President Biden. I hope I'm wrong.

---

Same here. I don't like watching people become a shell of their former selves, it's depressing. And

Frankly, shame on those around him for letting it get to this point.

---

He wasn't fit in 2020 but the perks for the First Lady and the business opportunities for Hunter and the family were to enticing to pass up.

---

His successes this term fly in the face of the "unfit the last four years" argument.

You obviously disagree with him politically but his adminstration has been unusually productive at implementing their agenda.

---

Civ, serious question. Please list/describe some of the successes that the Biden administration has been able to accomplish? Thank you in advance.

---

Asked and answered in various threads over the last few days.

Now you do Trump. Compare his campaign promises to legislative successes.

---

Lol! I'm sorry that I didn't catch the questions and answers in previous threads. I was just hoping for a few bullet points if nothing else. And I wasn't asking necessarily for campaign promises versus successes but what you liked about his administration. As for Trump, in bullet point answers: (1) economy and unemployment better, (2) national security (esp border) better defined and clear and (3) America was more respected worldwide when it came to our adversaries. Some of our allies were offended when Trump demanded that they pay the same that America was in partnerships such as NATO -which I think Trump's stance is fair. Unfortunately, I don't think Biden/Harris administration can hold a candle to the three issues I listed.

---

Would it really make a difference to point out why your assertions about the economy/unemployment, our national security, and our respect worldwide are at best highly debatable and at worst total nonsense? Somehow I doubt it.

---

Thanks for your input. Sorry to ruffle feathers and ask serious questions hoping for a civil discussion. Obviously that was a mistake.

---

I was being civil, but have seen this movie over and over in the Water Cooler.

Ok, fine, let's start with (3) "America was more respected worldwide when it came to our adversaries." What are you basing that assertion on, aside from what Trump and conservative media have repeated a thousand times? Which adversaries are you talking about?

---

America's traditional enemies - Russia, N Korea, China - didn't like Trump, but they respected him which created fear and the unknown as to what America would do if they became an aggressor. That is certainly not the case now. Trump has been fair when it came to our allies, but he insisted that they pay their fair share and uphold their end of support when it came to agreements such as NATO.

---

Why would Putin and Kim be scared of someone that verbally fellated them every chance he got? Trump didn't scare anyone, he just seemed half-cocked and unpredictable which isn't really a virtue.

And maybe more importantly can you speak to our relationship with our allies under Trump? How were our relationships in the G7/UN/NATO with him at the helm?

---

I'm genuinely curious...

Why has Putin invaded countries during Democrat rule?

I liked the 4 years where the US wasn't funding someone else war. But I guess Dem Warmongers are going to Warmonger.

---

Putin was very stressed about NATO.
Trump had promised to dismantle NATO, and made progress on that front.
Trump lost, so Putin invaded Ukraine, because he was very stressed about NATO.

Is this math equation really that hard for you?

P.S. Dismantling NATO is an EXTREMELY bad idea if you care about U.S. national security, as opposed to Russian national security. Voting for the guy who apparently only cares about the latter is a bad idea, too.

---

So he was so stressed about NATO he decided to piss NATO off even more by invading a country? Yeah sounds like he's very worried about NATO.

---

Putin clearly miscalculated how much Trump had hobbled NATO, and clearly underestimated Biden's ability to rally NATO behind Ukraine and make the alliance stronger then ever. Putin thought Ukraine would be a weekend stroll, and instead got absolutely punched in the teeth.

---

Yep. Gross miscalculation on Putin's part. The human and financial toll has been monstrous for Russia due to NATO's quick and consistent support in defense of Putin's aggression.

---

SmaptyWolf said:

---

Wufpack17 said:

---

Civilized said:

---

SmaptyWolf said:

---

Wufpack17 said:

---

Civilized said:

---

Wufpack17 said:

---

The people should know what is going on. We don't.

A random tweet and then a recorded phone call isn't driving home confidence right now. Who is in charge?

---

Presidents don't owe you blow-by-blow updates on their health and I doubt the administration cares about your confidence as Biden recovers from COVID. How is that information actionable for you? They were clear last week he was returning home to isolate, rest, recover, and work.

His doc said yesterday his symptoms were abating and he was carrying out his duties.

They owe you an update if the President's health becomes precarious or worrisome but beyond that it's just tabloid fodder.

---

The President isn't a monarch. He answers to the people and no one else. Frankly, what's transpired is pure disrespect of the American people and democracy itself. Tucking his tale and disappearing while non-democratically electing a nominee to take his place.

This is not democracy.

---

You guys are too much. Don't you blather endlessly about how we're a Republic, not a Democracy... but this Biden thing has you in tears about how undemocratic it is?

Here's a fun fact! Before the 1970's the voters never got the final say on who the candidates would be. The current primary voting system is a modern custom, but ultimately political parties can basically do what they want to pick their candidates.

Let's get real. The only people pushing for an open Dem primary with 3 months left in the race are Republicans and certain news outlets, both of whom would greatly benefit from another month of Dem chaos.

---

Exactly.

The party primary system is most certainly not "a democracy." Does the Constitution even have political parties in it?

And to whatever extent you want to try to impose democratic or representative norms on the primary system, Biden stepping down and Kamala stepping up is clearly what the people want. We're only in this situation because...

a. the Dems didn't have a competitive open primary. There were no real challengers to Biden, and...
b. very clearly the large majority of Democrats wanted Biden to step down, and are also in favor of Kamala being the candidate, and...
c. Biden's decline wasn't widely known until the debate.

There is no argument to be made that Biden stepping down or Kamala stepping up are not the will of the majority of Democrats at this point.

And frankly it's not up to one party to tell the other party how to select their candidate, as long as the selection abides by pertinent election law. This isn't some conspiracy. Democrats didn't ask for Biden's health to get to the point where he clearly can't go 4 more years but for that to not become widely recognizable until after the primary.

And it's not like the party had already nominated Biden. But even if they had y'all remember what happened when the *****-grabber-in-Chief had his *****-grab tape come out? The Republicans with courage/dignity/a conscience said he should step down. And that was AFTER he was the official nominee, only a few weeks before the election.

I didn't see Democrats lining up to pontificate about how anti-democratic such a move would be. They just agreed with the Republicans that were saying he should step down.

Like you said, Republicans beating this drum are either just being contrarians or they're sowing chaos. They're not going to get it, though - nobody believes any legal challenges would hold up, and the party is united behind a candidate that thus far looks very well-funded and well-supported by the Democrat base and leadership, and also by many young swing voters that were on the sidelines with Biden at the helm.

---

No, but plenty of states choose their nominee through primary voting. That didn't happen in this instance.


A. The dems didn't have a legitimate primary and boxed out any opposition from going up against Biden
B. There is no evidence to suggest dems prefer Harris over an alternative (which they've not been offered)
C. Bidens decline has been known for at least a year. You may not have wanted to accept the truth, but that's what it is.

The only contrarian is the person who screams "We have to defend democracy!" and then subsequently is fine with what is happening within their own party.

Dems want their cake and eat it to. "Democracy be damned! We have to be Trump!"

---

Care to take a guess how often an incumbent president has had a "legitimate" primary before his second term? Hint: Unless your guy sucks (see Trump) it never happens.

And given that basically every elected Dem in the country (who one assumes talks to their constituents) has lined up behind Harris, that sure seems like some evidence.

---

I know one thing. I got to vote in my primary, and it wasn't for Trump!

It's too bad half the country doesn't have a choice.

Well done Leftwing Loony.

I cant quote it cause I think its too much for the board to handle.

I agree that the financial and human toll is gigantic for Russia, but you do realize they are currently winning that war, right? Ukraine is running out of troops and Putin its just throwing more into the meat grinder since his resources vastly outnumber Ukraine's resources

100 Million

FlossyDFlynt said:

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I cant quote it cause I think its too much for the board to handle.

I agree that the financial and human toll is gigantic for Russia, but you do realize they are currently winning that war, right? Ukraine is running out of troops and Putin its just throwing more into the meat grinder since his resources vastly outnumber Ukraine's resources

---

That explains why their mothballed reserve of 60 year old T-62s are now Russia's main battle tank. Because they're winning so much. Oh you meant "winning", the MAGA word for losing.

Jack Posobiec is reporting that they told Biden they would release the Hur tapes if he didn't step down.

"They held the Hur Tapes over Biden as leverage


"Drop out or we release the tapes"

He dropped out and they released the transcripts anyway"

"RUTHLESS"

And here they are.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/joe-biden/full-text-robert-hur-biden-classified-documents-interview-pdf-rcna142956

This might be a better version. Version above was not working great for me.

https://www.newsweek.com/joe-biden-robert-hur-transcript-full-classified-documents-1878369

Wolfpack8602 said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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Wolfpack8602 said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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Wolfpack8602 said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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Civilized said:

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CoachCase said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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CoachCase said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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CoachCase said:

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Civilized said:

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CoachCase said:

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Civilized said:

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Gulfstream4 said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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Gulfstream4 said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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Civilized said:

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Wufpack17 said:

---

1st, It was a Tweet. 2nd, it's a photo copy. 3rd, it's not on official letterhead. 4th, he's never signed his signature with line under his signature.

It's not coming from the President. It's coming from others. If it were really his decision, there would have been somehing far more official than a freaking tweet.

---

So what are you suggesting?

He's being held hostage in his beach house basement?

He's all tubes and respirators now? Laid up in some hospital bed, half man, half machine?

What exactly is your paranoid Biden delusion du jour?

---

I am suggesting he is unwell and didn't make this decision on his own. This isn't a delusion, it's coming from the horses mouth.

"Frank Biden made comments to both CBS and ABC News, telling CBS 'in my humble opinion absolutely' the president's health was part of Biden's decision to announce that he wouldn't run for reelection - endorsing Vice President Kamala Harris in the process.

'Selfishly, I will have him back to enjoy whatever time we has left,' Frank Biden told CBS.
"

---

That doesn't sound good for President Biden. I hope I'm wrong.

---

Same here. I don't like watching people become a shell of their former selves, it's depressing. And

Frankly, shame on those around him for letting it get to this point.

---

He wasn't fit in 2020 but the perks for the First Lady and the business opportunities for Hunter and the family were to enticing to pass up.

---

His successes this term fly in the face of the "unfit the last four years" argument.

You obviously disagree with him politically but his adminstration has been unusually productive at implementing their agenda.

---

Civ, serious question. Please list/describe some of the successes that the Biden administration has been able to accomplish? Thank you in advance.

---

Asked and answered in various threads over the last few days.

Now you do Trump. Compare his campaign promises to legislative successes.

---

Lol! I'm sorry that I didn't catch the questions and answers in previous threads. I was just hoping for a few bullet points if nothing else. And I wasn't asking necessarily for campaign promises versus successes but what you liked about his administration. As for Trump, in bullet point answers: (1) economy and unemployment better, (2) national security (esp border) better defined and clear and (3) America was more respected worldwide when it came to our adversaries. Some of our allies were offended when Trump demanded that they pay the same that America was in partnerships such as NATO -which I think Trump's stance is fair. Unfortunately, I don't think Biden/Harris administration can hold a candle to the three issues I listed.

---

Would it really make a difference to point out why your assertions about the economy/unemployment, our national security, and our respect worldwide are at best highly debatable and at worst total nonsense? Somehow I doubt it.

---

Thanks for your input. Sorry to ruffle feathers and ask serious questions hoping for a civil discussion. Obviously that was a mistake.

---

I was being civil, but have seen this movie over and over in the Water Cooler.

Ok, fine, let's start with (3) "America was more respected worldwide when it came to our adversaries." What are you basing that assertion on, aside from what Trump and conservative media have repeated a thousand times? Which adversaries are you talking about?

---

America's traditional enemies - Russia, N Korea, China - didn't like Trump, but they respected him which created fear and the unknown as to what America would do if they became an aggressor. That is certainly not the case now. Trump has been fair when it came to our allies, but he insisted that they pay their fair share and uphold their end of support when it came to agreements such as NATO.

---

Why would Putin and Kim be scared of someone that verbally fellated them every chance he got? Trump didn't scare anyone, he just seemed half-cocked and unpredictable which isn't really a virtue.

And maybe more importantly can you speak to our relationship with our allies under Trump? How were our relationships in the G7/UN/NATO with him at the helm?

---

I'm genuinely curious...

Why has Putin invaded countries during Democrat rule?

I liked the 4 years where the US wasn't funding someone else war. But I guess Dem Warmongers are going to Warmonger.

---

Putin was very stressed about NATO.
Trump had promised to dismantle NATO, and made progress on that front.
Trump lost, so Putin invaded Ukraine, because he was very stressed about NATO.

Is this math equation really that hard for you?

P.S. Dismantling NATO is an EXTREMELY bad idea if you care about U.S. national security, as opposed to Russian national security. Voting for the guy who apparently only cares about the latter is a bad idea, too.

---

So he was so stressed about NATO he decided to piss NATO off even more by invading a country? Yeah sounds like he's very worried about NATO.

---

Putin clearly miscalculated how much Trump had hobbled NATO, and clearly underestimated Biden's ability to rally NATO behind Ukraine and make the alliance stronger then ever. Putin thought Ukraine would ne a weekend stroll, and instead got absolutely punched in the teeth.

---

Hobbled more by having other countries pay more? Baltic countries said he made it stronger. Those damn right winged Baltic countries!

https://www.newsweek.com/donald-trump-nato-baltic-allies-stronger-1639290

---

Lol, you clearly didn't read your own article. They said Trump privately threatened to pull the US out of NATO several times, had openly said he wouldn't honor the mutual defense agreement, and was generally a belligerent a**hole to our allies.

But NATO spending targets agreed during the Obama era were slowly reached, so technically NATO had more money by the end of Trump's term, which of course he tried to take credit for.

---

It also said how they used those funds to build up the border on Ukraine. But Trump cares more about Russias national security then ours.

You're cherry picking and leaving out how the Baltic countries praised Trumps admin. for increasing the security in their area.

---

Is that why at the NATO summit last month all of those countries were absolutely freaked out at the possibility that Trump might get back in office? The US handing Ukraine over to Russia (which Republicans are strangely pushing hard for) is an existential crises for eastern Europe in particular. Why else do you think Finland and Sweden just jumped to join NATO after being neutral all through the cold war?

Wolfpack8602 said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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Wolfpack8602 said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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Wolfpack8602 said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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Wolfpack8602 said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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Civilized said:

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CoachCase said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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CoachCase said:

---

SmaptyWolf said:

---

CoachCase said:

---

Civilized said:

---

CoachCase said:

---

Civilized said:

---

Gulfstream4 said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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Gulfstream4 said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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Civilized said:

---

Wufpack17 said:

---

1st, It was a Tweet. 2nd, it's a photo copy. 3rd, it's not on official letterhead. 4th, he's never signed his signature with line under his signature.

It's not coming from the President. It's coming from others. If it were really his decision, there would have been somehing far more official than a freaking tweet.

---

So what are you suggesting?

He's being held hostage in his beach house basement?

He's all tubes and respirators now? Laid up in some hospital bed, half man, half machine?

What exactly is your paranoid Biden delusion du jour?

---

I am suggesting he is unwell and didn't make this decision on his own. This isn't a delusion, it's coming from the horses mouth.

"Frank Biden made comments to both CBS and ABC News, telling CBS 'in my humble opinion absolutely' the president's health was part of Biden's decision to announce that he wouldn't run for reelection - endorsing Vice President Kamala Harris in the process.

'Selfishly, I will have him back to enjoy whatever time we has left,' Frank Biden told CBS.
"

---

That doesn't sound good for President Biden. I hope I'm wrong.

---

Same here. I don't like watching people become a shell of their former selves, it's depressing. And

Frankly, shame on those around him for letting it get to this point.

---

He wasn't fit in 2020 but the perks for the First Lady and the business opportunities for Hunter and the family were to enticing to pass up.

---

His successes this term fly in the face of the "unfit the last four years" argument.

You obviously disagree with him politically but his adminstration has been unusually productive at implementing their agenda.

---

Civ, serious question. Please list/describe some of the successes that the Biden administration has been able to accomplish? Thank you in advance.

---

Asked and answered in various threads over the last few days.

Now you do Trump. Compare his campaign promises to legislative successes.

---

Lol! I'm sorry that I didn't catch the questions and answers in previous threads. I was just hoping for a few bullet points if nothing else. And I wasn't asking necessarily for campaign promises versus successes but what you liked about his administration. As for Trump, in bullet point answers: (1) economy and unemployment better, (2) national security (esp border) better defined and clear and (3) America was more respected worldwide when it came to our adversaries. Some of our allies were offended when Trump demanded that they pay the same that America was in partnerships such as NATO -which I think Trump's stance is fair. Unfortunately, I don't think Biden/Harris administration can hold a candle to the three issues I listed.

---

Would it really make a difference to point out why your assertions about the economy/unemployment, our national security, and our respect worldwide are at best highly debatable and at worst total nonsense? Somehow I doubt it.

---

Thanks for your input. Sorry to ruffle feathers and ask serious questions hoping for a civil discussion. Obviously that was a mistake.

---

I was being civil, but have seen this movie over and over in the Water Cooler.

Ok, fine, let's start with (3) "America was more respected worldwide when it came to our adversaries." What are you basing that assertion on, aside from what Trump and conservative media have repeated a thousand times? Which adversaries are you talking about?

---

America's traditional enemies - Russia, N Korea, China - didn't like Trump, but they respected him which created fear and the unknown as to what America would do if they became an aggressor. That is certainly not the case now. Trump has been fair when it came to our allies, but he insisted that they pay their fair share and uphold their end of support when it came to agreements such as NATO.

---

Why would Putin and Kim be scared of someone that verbally fellated them every chance he got? Trump didn't scare anyone, he just seemed half-cocked and unpredictable which isn't really a virtue.

And maybe more importantly can you speak to our relationship with our allies under Trump? How were our relationships in the G7/UN/NATO with him at the helm?

---

I'm genuinely curious...

Why has Putin invaded countries during Democrat rule?

I liked the 4 years where the US wasn't funding someone else war. But I guess Dem Warmongers are going to Warmonger.

---

Putin was very stressed about NATO.
Trump had promised to dismantle NATO, and made progress on that front.
Trump lost, so Putin invaded Ukraine, because he was very stressed about NATO.

Is this math equation really that hard for you?

P.S. Dismantling NATO is an EXTREMELY bad idea if you care about U.S. national security, as opposed to Russian national security. Voting for the guy who apparently only cares about the latter is a bad idea, too.

---

So he was so stressed about NATO he decided to piss NATO off even more by invading a country? Yeah sounds like he's very worried about NATO.

---

Putin clearly miscalculated how much Trump had hobbled NATO, and clearly underestimated Biden's ability to rally NATO behind Ukraine and make the alliance stronger then ever. Putin thought Ukraine would ne a weekend stroll, and instead got absolutely punched in the teeth.

---

Hobbled more by having other countries pay more? Baltic countries said he made it stronger. Those damn right winged Baltic countries!

https://www.newsweek.com/donald-trump-nato-baltic-allies-stronger-1639290

---

Lol, you clearly didn't read your own article. They said Trump privately threatened to pull the US out of NATO several times, had openly said he wouldn't honor the mutual defense agreement, and was generally a belligerent a**hole to our allies.

But NATO spending targets agreed during the Obama era were slowly reached, so technically NATO had more money by the end of Trump's term, which of course he tried to take credit for.

---

It also said how they used those funds to build up the border on Ukraine. But Trump cares more about Russias national security then ours.

You're cherry picking and leaving out how the Baltic countries praised Trumps admin. for increasing the security in their area.

---

Is that why at the NATO summit last month all of those countries were absolutely freaked out at the possibility that Trump might get back in office? The US handing Ukraine over to Russia (which Republicans are strangely pushing hard for) is an existential crises for eastern Europe in particular. Why else do you think Finland and Sweden just jumped to join NATO after being neutral all through the cold war?

---

You're claiming republicans want to hand Ukraine over to Russia yet almost every single one of them votes in favor of aid.

You're such a ****ing dope. Everything out of your mouth is some weird twisted opinion that is so easy to disprove. You're the same as the guys you hate on this board except you're just on the opposite side.

You're blinded by party affiliation. You have blinders on and refuse to listen to anything that isn't in line with your views. You claim the right has crazy trumpers who only believe Trump and you're right. The thing is the left has the same amount of it on their side and you're one of them. Pot meet kettle.

---

Why was Tucker Carlson in Russia being Putin's lapdog for a few weird days?

He's the most popular and influential right-wing voice in America.

Why did he think this would be well-received by his target audience?

Wolfpack8602 said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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Wolfpack8602 said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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Wolfpack8602 said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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Wolfpack8602 said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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Civilized said:

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CoachCase said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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CoachCase said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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CoachCase said:

---

Civilized said:

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CoachCase said:

---

Civilized said:

---

Gulfstream4 said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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Gulfstream4 said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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Civilized said:

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Wufpack17 said:

---

1st, It was a Tweet. 2nd, it's a photo copy. 3rd, it's not on official letterhead. 4th, he's never signed his signature with line under his signature.

It's not coming from the President. It's coming from others. If it were really his decision, there would have been somehing far more official than a freaking tweet.

---

So what are you suggesting?

He's being held hostage in his beach house basement?

He's all tubes and respirators now? Laid up in some hospital bed, half man, half machine?

What exactly is your paranoid Biden delusion du jour?

---

I am suggesting he is unwell and didn't make this decision on his own. This isn't a delusion, it's coming from the horses mouth.

"Frank Biden made comments to both CBS and ABC News, telling CBS 'in my humble opinion absolutely' the president's health was part of Biden's decision to announce that he wouldn't run for reelection - endorsing Vice President Kamala Harris in the process.

'Selfishly, I will have him back to enjoy whatever time we has left,' Frank Biden told CBS.
"

---

That doesn't sound good for President Biden. I hope I'm wrong.

---

Same here. I don't like watching people become a shell of their former selves, it's depressing. And

Frankly, shame on those around him for letting it get to this point.

---

He wasn't fit in 2020 but the perks for the First Lady and the business opportunities for Hunter and the family were to enticing to pass up.

---

His successes this term fly in the face of the "unfit the last four years" argument.

You obviously disagree with him politically but his adminstration has been unusually productive at implementing their agenda.

---

Civ, serious question. Please list/describe some of the successes that the Biden administration has been able to accomplish? Thank you in advance.

---

Asked and answered in various threads over the last few days.

Now you do Trump. Compare his campaign promises to legislative successes.

---

Lol! I'm sorry that I didn't catch the questions and answers in previous threads. I was just hoping for a few bullet points if nothing else. And I wasn't asking necessarily for campaign promises versus successes but what you liked about his administration. As for Trump, in bullet point answers: (1) economy and unemployment better, (2) national security (esp border) better defined and clear and (3) America was more respected worldwide when it came to our adversaries. Some of our allies were offended when Trump demanded that they pay the same that America was in partnerships such as NATO -which I think Trump's stance is fair. Unfortunately, I don't think Biden/Harris administration can hold a candle to the three issues I listed.

---

Would it really make a difference to point out why your assertions about the economy/unemployment, our national security, and our respect worldwide are at best highly debatable and at worst total nonsense? Somehow I doubt it.

---

Thanks for your input. Sorry to ruffle feathers and ask serious questions hoping for a civil discussion. Obviously that was a mistake.

---

I was being civil, but have seen this movie over and over in the Water Cooler.

Ok, fine, let's start with (3) "America was more respected worldwide when it came to our adversaries." What are you basing that assertion on, aside from what Trump and conservative media have repeated a thousand times? Which adversaries are you talking about?

---

America's traditional enemies - Russia, N Korea, China - didn't like Trump, but they respected him which created fear and the unknown as to what America would do if they became an aggressor. That is certainly not the case now. Trump has been fair when it came to our allies, but he insisted that they pay their fair share and uphold their end of support when it came to agreements such as NATO.

---

Why would Putin and Kim be scared of someone that verbally fellated them every chance he got? Trump didn't scare anyone, he just seemed half-cocked and unpredictable which isn't really a virtue.

And maybe more importantly can you speak to our relationship with our allies under Trump? How were our relationships in the G7/UN/NATO with him at the helm?

---

I'm genuinely curious...

Why has Putin invaded countries during Democrat rule?

I liked the 4 years where the US wasn't funding someone else war. But I guess Dem Warmongers are going to Warmonger.

---

Putin was very stressed about NATO.
Trump had promised to dismantle NATO, and made progress on that front.
Trump lost, so Putin invaded Ukraine, because he was very stressed about NATO.

Is this math equation really that hard for you?

P.S. Dismantling NATO is an EXTREMELY bad idea if you care about U.S. national security, as opposed to Russian national security. Voting for the guy who apparently only cares about the latter is a bad idea, too.

---

So he was so stressed about NATO he decided to piss NATO off even more by invading a country? Yeah sounds like he's very worried about NATO.

---

Putin clearly miscalculated how much Trump had hobbled NATO, and clearly underestimated Biden's ability to rally NATO behind Ukraine and make the alliance stronger then ever. Putin thought Ukraine would ne a weekend stroll, and instead got absolutely punched in the teeth.

---

Hobbled more by having other countries pay more? Baltic countries said he made it stronger. Those damn right winged Baltic countries!

https://www.newsweek.com/donald-trump-nato-baltic-allies-stronger-1639290

---

Lol, you clearly didn't read your own article. They said Trump privately threatened to pull the US out of NATO several times, had openly said he wouldn't honor the mutual defense agreement, and was generally a belligerent a**hole to our allies.

But NATO spending targets agreed during the Obama era were slowly reached, so technically NATO had more money by the end of Trump's term, which of course he tried to take credit for.

---

It also said how they used those funds to build up the border on Ukraine. But Trump cares more about Russias national security then ours.

You're cherry picking and leaving out how the Baltic countries praised Trumps admin. for increasing the security in their area.

---

Is that why at the NATO summit last month all of those countries were absolutely freaked out at the possibility that Trump might get back in office? The US handing Ukraine over to Russia (which Republicans are strangely pushing hard for) is an existential crises for eastern Europe in particular. Why else do you think Finland and Sweden just jumped to join NATO after being neutral all through the cold war?

---

You're claiming republicans want to hand Ukraine over to Russia yet almost every single one of them votes in favor of aid.

You're such a ****ing dope. Everything out of your mouth is some weird twisted opinion that is so easy to disprove. You're the same as the guys you hate on this board except you're just on the opposite side.

You're blinded by party affiliation. You have blinders on and refuse to listen to anything that isn't in line with your views. You claim the right has crazy trumpers who only believe Trump and you're right. The thing is the left has the same amount of it on their side and you're one of them. Pot meet kettle.

---

We literarily just had a year long battle in congress, resulting in a new Republican speaker, all because they wanted to block aid to Ukraine. Less than half of Republicans ended up voting for it. It only passed because Dems agreed to give the new Republican speaker cover from also getting kicked out. Not a "twisted opinion", a fact.

Lol, you sure you know which party we're talking about?

SmaptyWolf said:

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Wolfpack8602 said:

---

SmaptyWolf said:

---

Wolfpack8602 said:

---

SmaptyWolf said:

---

Wolfpack8602 said:

---

SmaptyWolf said:

---

Wufpack17 said:

---

Civilized said:

---

CoachCase said:

---

SmaptyWolf said:

---

CoachCase said:

---

SmaptyWolf said:

---

CoachCase said:

---

Civilized said:

---

CoachCase said:

---

Civilized said:

---

Gulfstream4 said:

---

Wufpack17 said:

---

Gulfstream4 said:

---

Wufpack17 said:

---

Civilized said:

---

Wufpack17 said:

---

1st, It was a Tweet. 2nd, it's a photo copy. 3rd, it's not on official letterhead. 4th, he's never signed his signature with line under his signature.

It's not coming from the President. It's coming from others. If it were really his decision, there would have been somehing far more official than a freaking tweet.

---

So what are you suggesting?

He's being held hostage in his beach house basement?

He's all tubes and respirators now? Laid up in some hospital bed, half man, half machine?

What exactly is your paranoid Biden delusion du jour?

---

I am suggesting he is unwell and didn't make this decision on his own. This isn't a delusion, it's coming from the horses mouth.

"Frank Biden made comments to both CBS and ABC News, telling CBS 'in my humble opinion absolutely' the president's health was part of Biden's decision to announce that he wouldn't run for reelection - endorsing Vice President Kamala Harris in the process.

'Selfishly, I will have him back to enjoy whatever time we has left,' Frank Biden told CBS.
"

---

That doesn't sound good for President Biden. I hope I'm wrong.

---

Same here. I don't like watching people become a shell of their former selves, it's depressing. And

Frankly, shame on those around him for letting it get to this point.

---

He wasn't fit in 2020 but the perks for the First Lady and the business opportunities for Hunter and the family were to enticing to pass up.

---

His successes this term fly in the face of the "unfit the last four years" argument.

You obviously disagree with him politically but his adminstration has been unusually productive at implementing their agenda.

---

Civ, serious question. Please list/describe some of the successes that the Biden administration has been able to accomplish? Thank you in advance.

---

Asked and answered in various threads over the last few days.

Now you do Trump. Compare his campaign promises to legislative successes.

---

Lol! I'm sorry that I didn't catch the questions and answers in previous threads. I was just hoping for a few bullet points if nothing else. And I wasn't asking necessarily for campaign promises versus successes but what you liked about his administration. As for Trump, in bullet point answers: (1) economy and unemployment better, (2) national security (esp border) better defined and clear and (3) America was more respected worldwide when it came to our adversaries. Some of our allies were offended when Trump demanded that they pay the same that America was in partnerships such as NATO -which I think Trump's stance is fair. Unfortunately, I don't think Biden/Harris administration can hold a candle to the three issues I listed.

---

Would it really make a difference to point out why your assertions about the economy/unemployment, our national security, and our respect worldwide are at best highly debatable and at worst total nonsense? Somehow I doubt it.

---

Thanks for your input. Sorry to ruffle feathers and ask serious questions hoping for a civil discussion. Obviously that was a mistake.

---

I was being civil, but have seen this movie over and over in the Water Cooler.

Ok, fine, let's start with (3) "America was more respected worldwide when it came to our adversaries." What are you basing that assertion on, aside from what Trump and conservative media have repeated a thousand times? Which adversaries are you talking about?

---

America's traditional enemies - Russia, N Korea, China - didn't like Trump, but they respected him which created fear and the unknown as to what America would do if they became an aggressor. That is certainly not the case now. Trump has been fair when it came to our allies, but he insisted that they pay their fair share and uphold their end of support when it came to agreements such as NATO.

---

Why would Putin and Kim be scared of someone that verbally fellated them every chance he got? Trump didn't scare anyone, he just seemed half-cocked and unpredictable which isn't really a virtue.

And maybe more importantly can you speak to our relationship with our allies under Trump? How were our relationships in the G7/UN/NATO with him at the helm?

---

I'm genuinely curious...

Why has Putin invaded countries during Democrat rule?

I liked the 4 years where the US wasn't funding someone else war. But I guess Dem Warmongers are going to Warmonger.

---

Putin was very stressed about NATO.
Trump had promised to dismantle NATO, and made progress on that front.
Trump lost, so Putin invaded Ukraine, because he was very stressed about NATO.

Is this math equation really that hard for you?

P.S. Dismantling NATO is an EXTREMELY bad idea if you care about U.S. national security, as opposed to Russian national security. Voting for the guy who apparently only cares about the latter is a bad idea, too.

---

So he was so stressed about NATO he decided to piss NATO off even more by invading a country? Yeah sounds like he's very worried about NATO.

---

Putin clearly miscalculated how much Trump had hobbled NATO, and clearly underestimated Biden's ability to rally NATO behind Ukraine and make the alliance stronger then ever. Putin thought Ukraine would ne a weekend stroll, and instead got absolutely punched in the teeth.

---

Hobbled more by having other countries pay more? Baltic countries said he made it stronger. Those damn right winged Baltic countries!

https://www.newsweek.com/donald-trump-nato-baltic-allies-stronger-1639290

---

Lol, you clearly didn't read your own article. They said Trump privately threatened to pull the US out of NATO several times, had openly said he wouldn't honor the mutual defense agreement, and was generally a belligerent a**hole to our allies.

But NATO spending targets agreed during the Obama era were slowly reached, so technically NATO had more money by the end of Trump's term, which of course he tried to take credit for.

---

It also said how they used those funds to build up the border on Ukraine. But Trump cares more about Russias national security then ours.

You're cherry picking and leaving out how the Baltic countries praised Trumps admin. for increasing the security in their area.

---

Is that why at the NATO summit last month all of those countries were absolutely freaked out at the possibility that Trump might get back in office? The US handing Ukraine over to Russia (which Republicans are strangely pushing hard for) is an existential crises for eastern Europe in particular. Why else do you think Finland and Sweden just jumped to join NATO after being neutral all through the cold war?

---

Do some research on Sweden and Finland. Sweden is having major issues with immigration. Finland is beefing up its border security. These are very recent developments.

What better way to finance policies to improve your nations security than by joining NATO.

What is it we don't YET understand?

Will the MSM ask why he didn’t take Marine One from Joint Base Andrews to the White House today as is custom, unless poor weather? https://t.co/DsWqZkqRY0

— Dan Scavino Jr.🇺🇸🦅 (@DanScavino) July 23, 2024

Werewolf said:

---

What is it we don't YET understand?

Will the MSM ask why he didn’t take Marine One from Joint Base Andrews to the White House today as is custom, unless poor weather? https://t.co/DsWqZkqRY0

— Dan Scavino Jr.🇺🇸🦅 (@DanScavino) July 23, 2024

---

I don't know Were... why don't you tell us?!?

#Devolution

I'm guessing the 25th is on the way.

Werewolf said:

---

I'm guessing the 25th is on the way.

---

Why'd they let him fly in AF1?

TheStorm said:

---

Werewolf said:

---

I'm guessing the 25th is on the way.

---

Why'd they let him fly in AF1?

---

DId he fly AF1?

Here's another angle.

Here is the Democrat election scam broken down:

They create the illusion of support for a candidate by pumping them up in the media apparatus that they fully control.

They use billionaires to launder money to the candidate through straw donors on ActBlue. $3,300 max per person?… pic.twitter.com/QHo7W7bZ0b

— DC_Draino (@DC_Draino) July 23, 2024

Hey Stormie, just a lot of unusual **** going on don't you think? Or is this just like events of an election year in the 90's?

Interesting… Why would they need to swear in Capitol Police for only the period of 7/23/24 through 7/25/24?

Is it strictly due to Netanyahu’s speech or are they expecting something?

Also weird that Speaker Mike Johnson threatens to arrest anyone who dare speak during… pic.twitter.com/0s8JVHK412

— Maero𝕏 (@Maerox) July 24, 2024

TheStorm said:

---

Werewolf said:

---

What is it we don't YET understand?

Will the MSM ask why he didn’t take Marine One from Joint Base Andrews to the White House today as is custom, unless poor weather? https://t.co/DsWqZkqRY0

— Dan Scavino Jr.🇺🇸🦅 (@DanScavino) July 23, 2024

---

I don't know Were... why don't you tell us?!?

#Devolution

---

Stormie, I love John Rich's new song, have you heard it?

Love the words of this song.......particularly the captions of the song video. ;-)

Is the world ready to see Justice and Accountability for all?

One Bad Movie 🎬 #OneBadMovie 😘

h/t @JimFergusonUK @johnrich @GolfingFrogs @StellarChic11 @Pascalnajadi @ColonelTowner @RealLTCRicBosi @StephenBaldwin7 pic.twitter.com/7kXzqPszQQ

— The Rubber Banned Man (@BannedMan1776) July 23, 2024

In a miraculous turn of events:

Feds discover transcripts of Biden chats with biographer

https://www.politico.com/news/2024/07/23/biden-hur-biographer-transcripts-00170548

Damn Stormie, HULU, a Disney CO, acts quick! ;-)

Actual show on Hulu right now, “Biden stands Down” SEASON 1 😳https://t.co/uqlR97aHfJ pic.twitter.com/8jfnchhBcc

— Amy Reichert (@amyforsandiego) July 23, 2024

Werewolf said:

---

Damn Stormie, HULU, a Disney CO, acts quick! ;-)

Actual show on Hulu right now, “Biden stands Down” SEASON 1 😳https://t.co/uqlR97aHfJ pic.twitter.com/8jfnchhBcc

— Amy Reichert (@amyforsandiego) July 23, 2024

---

Sorry, I'm waiting for the animated Disney version with a couple of drag queens in it disguised as "Bluey"...

TheStorm said:

---

Werewolf said:

---

Damn Stormie, HULU, a Disney CO, acts quick! ;-)

Actual show on Hulu right now, “Biden stands Down” SEASON 1 😳https://t.co/uqlR97aHfJ pic.twitter.com/8jfnchhBcc

— Amy Reichert (@amyforsandiego) July 23, 2024

---

Sorry, I'm waiting for the animated Disney version with a couple of drag queens in it disguised as "Bluey"...

---

Hey, I don't know about you, but I'm thinking its pretty impressive to already have an entire one season of episodes put together. But this could be stick figure Disney movie and maybe, just maybe?

You agree that having an entire season of episodes available is impressive, don't you? ;-)

Wolfpack8602 said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

---

Wolfpack8602 said:

---

SmaptyWolf said:

---

Wolfpack8602 said:

---

SmaptyWolf said:

---

Wolfpack8602 said:

---

SmaptyWolf said:

---

Wolfpack8602 said:

---

SmaptyWolf said:

---

Wufpack17 said:

---

Civilized said:

---

CoachCase said:

---

SmaptyWolf said:

---

CoachCase said:

---

SmaptyWolf said:

---

CoachCase said:

---

Civilized said:

---

CoachCase said:

---

Civilized said:

---

Gulfstream4 said:

---

Wufpack17 said:

---

Gulfstream4 said:

---

Wufpack17 said:

---

Civilized said:

---

Wufpack17 said:

---

1st, It was a Tweet. 2nd, it's a photo copy. 3rd, it's not on official letterhead. 4th, he's never signed his signature with line under his signature.

It's not coming from the President. It's coming from others. If it were really his decision, there would have been somehing far more official than a freaking tweet.

---

So what are you suggesting?

He's being held hostage in his beach house basement?

He's all tubes and respirators now? Laid up in some hospital bed, half man, half machine?

What exactly is your paranoid Biden delusion du jour?

---

I am suggesting he is unwell and didn't make this decision on his own. This isn't a delusion, it's coming from the horses mouth.

"Frank Biden made comments to both CBS and ABC News, telling CBS 'in my humble opinion absolutely' the president's health was part of Biden's decision to announce that he wouldn't run for reelection - endorsing Vice President Kamala Harris in the process.

'Selfishly, I will have him back to enjoy whatever time we has left,' Frank Biden told CBS.
"

---

That doesn't sound good for President Biden. I hope I'm wrong.

---

Same here. I don't like watching people become a shell of their former selves, it's depressing. And

Frankly, shame on those around him for letting it get to this point.

---

He wasn't fit in 2020 but the perks for the First Lady and the business opportunities for Hunter and the family were to enticing to pass up.

---

His successes this term fly in the face of the "unfit the last four years" argument.

You obviously disagree with him politically but his adminstration has been unusually productive at implementing their agenda.

---

Civ, serious question. Please list/describe some of the successes that the Biden administration has been able to accomplish? Thank you in advance.

---

Asked and answered in various threads over the last few days.

Now you do Trump. Compare his campaign promises to legislative successes.

---

Lol! I'm sorry that I didn't catch the questions and answers in previous threads. I was just hoping for a few bullet points if nothing else. And I wasn't asking necessarily for campaign promises versus successes but what you liked about his administration. As for Trump, in bullet point answers: (1) economy and unemployment better, (2) national security (esp border) better defined and clear and (3) America was more respected worldwide when it came to our adversaries. Some of our allies were offended when Trump demanded that they pay the same that America was in partnerships such as NATO -which I think Trump's stance is fair. Unfortunately, I don't think Biden/Harris administration can hold a candle to the three issues I listed.

---

Would it really make a difference to point out why your assertions about the economy/unemployment, our national security, and our respect worldwide are at best highly debatable and at worst total nonsense? Somehow I doubt it.

---

Thanks for your input. Sorry to ruffle feathers and ask serious questions hoping for a civil discussion. Obviously that was a mistake.

---

I was being civil, but have seen this movie over and over in the Water Cooler.

Ok, fine, let's start with (3) "America was more respected worldwide when it came to our adversaries." What are you basing that assertion on, aside from what Trump and conservative media have repeated a thousand times? Which adversaries are you talking about?

---

America's traditional enemies - Russia, N Korea, China - didn't like Trump, but they respected him which created fear and the unknown as to what America would do if they became an aggressor. That is certainly not the case now. Trump has been fair when it came to our allies, but he insisted that they pay their fair share and uphold their end of support when it came to agreements such as NATO.

---

Why would Putin and Kim be scared of someone that verbally fellated them every chance he got? Trump didn't scare anyone, he just seemed half-cocked and unpredictable which isn't really a virtue.

And maybe more importantly can you speak to our relationship with our allies under Trump? How were our relationships in the G7/UN/NATO with him at the helm?

---

I'm genuinely curious...

Why has Putin invaded countries during Democrat rule?

I liked the 4 years where the US wasn't funding someone else war. But I guess Dem Warmongers are going to Warmonger.

---

Putin was very stressed about NATO.
Trump had promised to dismantle NATO, and made progress on that front.
Trump lost, so Putin invaded Ukraine, because he was very stressed about NATO.

Is this math equation really that hard for you?

P.S. Dismantling NATO is an EXTREMELY bad idea if you care about U.S. national security, as opposed to Russian national security. Voting for the guy who apparently only cares about the latter is a bad idea, too.

---

So he was so stressed about NATO he decided to piss NATO off even more by invading a country? Yeah sounds like he's very worried about NATO.

---

Putin clearly miscalculated how much Trump had hobbled NATO, and clearly underestimated Biden's ability to rally NATO behind Ukraine and make the alliance stronger then ever. Putin thought Ukraine would ne a weekend stroll, and instead got absolutely punched in the teeth.

---

Hobbled more by having other countries pay more? Baltic countries said he made it stronger. Those damn right winged Baltic countries!

https://www.newsweek.com/donald-trump-nato-baltic-allies-stronger-1639290

---

Lol, you clearly didn't read your own article. They said Trump privately threatened to pull the US out of NATO several times, had openly said he wouldn't honor the mutual defense agreement, and was generally a belligerent a**hole to our allies.

But NATO spending targets agreed during the Obama era were slowly reached, so technically NATO had more money by the end of Trump's term, which of course he tried to take credit for.

---

It also said how they used those funds to build up the border on Ukraine. But Trump cares more about Russias national security then ours.

You're cherry picking and leaving out how the Baltic countries praised Trumps admin. for increasing the security in their area.

---

Is that why at the NATO summit last month all of those countries were absolutely freaked out at the possibility that Trump might get back in office? The US handing Ukraine over to Russia (which Republicans are strangely pushing hard for) is an existential crises for eastern Europe in particular. Why else do you think Finland and Sweden just jumped to join NATO after being neutral all through the cold war?

---

You're claiming republicans want to hand Ukraine over to Russia yet almost every single one of them votes in favor of aid.

You're such a ****ing dope. Everything out of your mouth is some weird twisted opinion that is so easy to disprove. You're the same as the guys you hate on this board except you're just on the opposite side.

You're blinded by party affiliation. You have blinders on and refuse to listen to anything that isn't in line with your views. You claim the right has crazy trumpers who only believe Trump and you're right. The thing is the left has the same amount of it on their side and you're one of them. Pot meet kettle.

---

We literarily just had a year long battle in congress, resulting in a new Republican speaker, all because they wanted to block aid to Ukraine. Less than half of Republicans ended up voting for it. It only passed because Dems agreed to give the new Republican speaker cover from also getting kicked out. Not a "twisted opinion", a fact.

Lol, you sure you know which party we're talking about?

---

You think they got rid of Kevin McCarthy because of aid to Ukraine? Hahahahaha

---

No, they wanted to get rid of him because they're lunatics who can't comprehend that any Speaker ultimately has to govern a little bit, which means occasional compromise. It's why they hated Boehner, and then Ryan, and then McCarthy. The Ukraine aid thing was the final straw that ended McCarthy's career. I'm sure they'll axe the new guy soon, too.

But yes, ending aid to Ukraine very much means handing Ukraine over to Russia. Instead of making a fool of yourself maybe you should actually ask the right wing folks in the Water Cooler here if they want to help Ukraine or abandon them. The unanimous answer apparently will surprise you.

SmaptyWolf said:

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Wolfpack8602 said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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Wolfpack8602 said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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Wolfpack8602 said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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Wolfpack8602 said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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Wolfpack8602 said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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Civilized said:

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CoachCase said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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CoachCase said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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CoachCase said:

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Civilized said:

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CoachCase said:

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Civilized said:

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Gulfstream4 said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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Gulfstream4 said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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Civilized said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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1st, It was a Tweet. 2nd, it's a photo copy. 3rd, it's not on official letterhead. 4th, he's never signed his signature with line under his signature.

It's not coming from the President. It's coming from others. If it were really his decision, there would have been somehing far more official than a freaking tweet.

---

So what are you suggesting?

He's being held hostage in his beach house basement?

He's all tubes and respirators now? Laid up in some hospital bed, half man, half machine?

What exactly is your paranoid Biden delusion du jour?

---

I am suggesting he is unwell and didn't make this decision on his own. This isn't a delusion, it's coming from the horses mouth.

"Frank Biden made comments to both CBS and ABC News, telling CBS 'in my humble opinion absolutely' the president's health was part of Biden's decision to announce that he wouldn't run for reelection - endorsing Vice President Kamala Harris in the process.

'Selfishly, I will have him back to enjoy whatever time we has left,' Frank Biden told CBS.
"

---

That doesn't sound good for President Biden. I hope I'm wrong.

---

Same here. I don't like watching people become a shell of their former selves, it's depressing. And

Frankly, shame on those around him for letting it get to this point.

---

He wasn't fit in 2020 but the perks for the First Lady and the business opportunities for Hunter and the family were to enticing to pass up.

---

His successes this term fly in the face of the "unfit the last four years" argument.

You obviously disagree with him politically but his adminstration has been unusually productive at implementing their agenda.

---

Civ, serious question. Please list/describe some of the successes that the Biden administration has been able to accomplish? Thank you in advance.

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Asked and answered in various threads over the last few days.

Now you do Trump. Compare his campaign promises to legislative successes.

---

Lol! I'm sorry that I didn't catch the questions and answers in previous threads. I was just hoping for a few bullet points if nothing else. And I wasn't asking necessarily for campaign promises versus successes but what you liked about his administration. As for Trump, in bullet point answers: (1) economy and unemployment better, (2) national security (esp border) better defined and clear and (3) America was more respected worldwide when it came to our adversaries. Some of our allies were offended when Trump demanded that they pay the same that America was in partnerships such as NATO -which I think Trump's stance is fair. Unfortunately, I don't think Biden/Harris administration can hold a candle to the three issues I listed.

---

Would it really make a difference to point out why your assertions about the economy/unemployment, our national security, and our respect worldwide are at best highly debatable and at worst total nonsense? Somehow I doubt it.

---

Thanks for your input. Sorry to ruffle feathers and ask serious questions hoping for a civil discussion. Obviously that was a mistake.

---

I was being civil, but have seen this movie over and over in the Water Cooler.

Ok, fine, let's start with (3) "America was more respected worldwide when it came to our adversaries." What are you basing that assertion on, aside from what Trump and conservative media have repeated a thousand times? Which adversaries are you talking about?

---

America's traditional enemies - Russia, N Korea, China - didn't like Trump, but they respected him which created fear and the unknown as to what America would do if they became an aggressor. That is certainly not the case now. Trump has been fair when it came to our allies, but he insisted that they pay their fair share and uphold their end of support when it came to agreements such as NATO.

---

Why would Putin and Kim be scared of someone that verbally fellated them every chance he got? Trump didn't scare anyone, he just seemed half-cocked and unpredictable which isn't really a virtue.

And maybe more importantly can you speak to our relationship with our allies under Trump? How were our relationships in the G7/UN/NATO with him at the helm?

---

I'm genuinely curious...

Why has Putin invaded countries during Democrat rule?

I liked the 4 years where the US wasn't funding someone else war. But I guess Dem Warmongers are going to Warmonger.

---

Putin was very stressed about NATO.
Trump had promised to dismantle NATO, and made progress on that front.
Trump lost, so Putin invaded Ukraine, because he was very stressed about NATO.

Is this math equation really that hard for you?

P.S. Dismantling NATO is an EXTREMELY bad idea if you care about U.S. national security, as opposed to Russian national security. Voting for the guy who apparently only cares about the latter is a bad idea, too.

---

So he was so stressed about NATO he decided to piss NATO off even more by invading a country? Yeah sounds like he's very worried about NATO.

---

Putin clearly miscalculated how much Trump had hobbled NATO, and clearly underestimated Biden's ability to rally NATO behind Ukraine and make the alliance stronger then ever. Putin thought Ukraine would ne a weekend stroll, and instead got absolutely punched in the teeth.

---

Hobbled more by having other countries pay more? Baltic countries said he made it stronger. Those damn right winged Baltic countries!

https://www.newsweek.com/donald-trump-nato-baltic-allies-stronger-1639290

---

Lol, you clearly didn't read your own article. They said Trump privately threatened to pull the US out of NATO several times, had openly said he wouldn't honor the mutual defense agreement, and was generally a belligerent a**hole to our allies.

But NATO spending targets agreed during the Obama era were slowly reached, so technically NATO had more money by the end of Trump's term, which of course he tried to take credit for.

---

It also said how they used those funds to build up the border on Ukraine. But Trump cares more about Russias national security then ours.

You're cherry picking and leaving out how the Baltic countries praised Trumps admin. for increasing the security in their area.

---

Is that why at the NATO summit last month all of those countries were absolutely freaked out at the possibility that Trump might get back in office? The US handing Ukraine over to Russia (which Republicans are strangely pushing hard for) is an existential crises for eastern Europe in particular. Why else do you think Finland and Sweden just jumped to join NATO after being neutral all through the cold war?

---

You're claiming republicans want to hand Ukraine over to Russia yet almost every single one of them votes in favor of aid.

You're such a ****ing dope. Everything out of your mouth is some weird twisted opinion that is so easy to disprove. You're the same as the guys you hate on this board except you're just on the opposite side.

You're blinded by party affiliation. You have blinders on and refuse to listen to anything that isn't in line with your views. You claim the right has crazy trumpers who only believe Trump and you're right. The thing is the left has the same amount of it on their side and you're one of them. Pot meet kettle.

---

We literarily just had a year long battle in congress, resulting in a new Republican speaker, all because they wanted to block aid to Ukraine. Less than half of Republicans ended up voting for it. It only passed because Dems agreed to give the new Republican speaker cover from also getting kicked out. Not a "twisted opinion", a fact.

Lol, you sure you know which party we're talking about?

---

You think they got rid of Kevin McCarthy because of aid to Ukraine? Hahahahaha

---

No, they wanted to get rid of him because they're lunatics who can't comprehend that any Speaker ultimately has to govern a little bit, which means occasional compromise. It's why they hated Boehner, and then Ryan, and then McCarthy. The Ukraine aid thing was the final straw that ended McCarthy's career. I'm sure they'll axe the new guy soon, too.

But yes, ending aid to Ukraine very much means handing Ukraine over to Russia. Instead of making a fool of yourself maybe you should actually ask the right wing folks in the Water Cooler here if they want to help Ukraine or abandon them. The unanimous answer apparently will surprise you.

---

About time you showed up. Civ needs you to tag in over on the Harris thread. He's been working overtime.

SmaptyWolf said:

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Wolfpack8602 said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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Wolfpack8602 said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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Wolfpack8602 said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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Wolfpack8602 said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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Wolfpack8602 said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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Civilized said:

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CoachCase said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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CoachCase said:

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SmaptyWolf said:

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CoachCase said:

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Civilized said:

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CoachCase said:

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Civilized said:

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Gulfstream4 said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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Gulfstream4 said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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Civilized said:

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Wufpack17 said:

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1st, It was a Tweet. 2nd, it's a photo copy. 3rd, it's not on official letterhead. 4th, he's never signed his signature with line under his signature.

It's not coming from the President. It's coming from others. If it were really his decision, there would have been somehing far more official than a freaking tweet.

---

So what are you suggesting?

He's being held hostage in his beach house basement?

He's all tubes and respirators now? Laid up in some hospital bed, half man, half machine?

What exactly is your paranoid Biden delusion du jour?

---

I am suggesting he is unwell and didn't make this decision on his own. This isn't a delusion, it's coming from the horses mouth.

"Frank Biden made comments to both CBS and ABC News, telling CBS 'in my humble opinion absolutely' the president's health was part of Biden's decision to announce that he wouldn't run for reelection - endorsing Vice President Kamala Harris in the process.

'Selfishly, I will have him back to enjoy whatever time we has left,' Frank Biden told CBS.
"

---

That doesn't sound good for President Biden. I hope I'm wrong.

---

Same here. I don't like watching people become a shell of their former selves, it's depressing. And

Frankly, shame on those around him for letting it get to this point.

---

He wasn't fit in 2020 but the perks for the First Lady and the business opportunities for Hunter and the family were to enticing to pass up.

---

His successes this term fly in the face of the "unfit the last four years" argument.

You obviously disagree with him politically but his adminstration has been unusually productive at implementing their agenda.

---

Civ, serious question. Please list/describe some of the successes that the Biden administration has been able to accomplish? Thank you in advance.

---

Asked and answered in various threads over the last few days.

Now you do Trump. Compare his campaign promises to legislative successes.

---

Lol! I'm sorry that I didn't catch the questions and answers in previous threads. I was just hoping for a few bullet points if nothing else. And I wasn't asking necessarily for campaign promises versus successes but what you liked about his administration. As for Trump, in bullet point answers: (1) economy and unemployment better, (2) national security (esp border) better defined and clear and (3) America was more respected worldwide when it came to our adversaries. Some of our allies were offended when Trump demanded that they pay the same that America was in partnerships such as NATO -which I think Trump's stance is fair. Unfortunately, I don't think Biden/Harris administration can hold a candle to the three issues I listed.

---

Would it really make a difference to point out why your assertions about the economy/unemployment, our national security, and our respect worldwide are at best highly debatable and at worst total nonsense? Somehow I doubt it.

---

Thanks for your input. Sorry to ruffle feathers and ask serious questions hoping for a civil discussion. Obviously that was a mistake.

---

I was being civil, but have seen this movie over and over in the Water Cooler.

Ok, fine, let's start with (3) "America was more respected worldwide when it came to our adversaries." What are you basing that assertion on, aside from what Trump and conservative media have repeated a thousand times? Which adversaries are you talking about?

---

America's traditional enemies - Russia, N Korea, China - didn't like Trump, but they respected him which created fear and the unknown as to what America would do if they became an aggressor. That is certainly not the case now. Trump has been fair when it came to our allies, but he insisted that they pay their fair share and uphold their end of support when it came to agreements such as NATO.

---

Why would Putin and Kim be scared of someone that verbally fellated them every chance he got? Trump didn't scare anyone, he just seemed half-cocked and unpredictable which isn't really a virtue.

And maybe more importantly can you speak to our relationship with our allies under Trump? How were our relationships in the G7/UN/NATO with him at the helm?

---

I'm genuinely curious...

Why has Putin invaded countries during Democrat rule?

I liked the 4 years where the US wasn't funding someone else war. But I guess Dem Warmongers are going to Warmonger.

---

Putin was very stressed about NATO.
Trump had promised to dismantle NATO, and made progress on that front.
Trump lost, so Putin invaded Ukraine, because he was very stressed about NATO.

Is this math equation really that hard for you?

P.S. Dismantling NATO is an EXTREMELY bad idea if you care about U.S. national security, as opposed to Russian national security. Voting for the guy who apparently only cares about the latter is a bad idea, too.

---

So he was so stressed about NATO he decided to piss NATO off even more by invading a country? Yeah sounds like he's very worried about NATO.

---

Putin clearly miscalculated how much Trump had hobbled NATO, and clearly underestimated Biden's ability to rally NATO behind Ukraine and make the alliance stronger then ever. Putin thought Ukraine would ne a weekend stroll, and instead got absolutely punched in the teeth.

---

Hobbled more by having other countries pay more? Baltic countries said he made it stronger. Those damn right winged Baltic countries!

https://www.newsweek.com/donald-trump-nato-baltic-allies-stronger-1639290

---

Lol, you clearly didn't read your own article. They said Trump privately threatened to pull the US out of NATO several times, had openly said he wouldn't honor the mutual defense agreement, and was generally a belligerent a**hole to our allies.

But NATO spending targets agreed during the Obama era were slowly reached, so technically NATO had more money by the end of Trump's term, which of course he tried to take credit for.

---

It also said how they used those funds to build up the border on Ukraine. But Trump cares more about Russias national security then ours.

You're cherry picking and leaving out how the Baltic countries praised Trumps admin. for increasing the security in their area.

---

Is that why at the NATO summit last month all of those countries were absolutely freaked out at the possibility that Trump might get back in office? The US handing Ukraine over to Russia (which Republicans are strangely pushing hard for) is an existential crises for eastern Europe in particular. Why else do you think Finland and Sweden just jumped to join NATO after being neutral all through the cold war?

---

You're claiming republicans want to hand Ukraine over to Russia yet almost every single one of them votes in favor of aid.

You're such a ****ing dope. Everything out of your mouth is some weird twisted opinion that is so easy to disprove. You're the same as the guys you hate on this board except you're just on the opposite side.

You're blinded by party affiliation. You have blinders on and refuse to listen to anything that isn't in line with your views. You claim the right has crazy trumpers who only believe Trump and you're right. The thing is the left has the same amount of it on their side and you're one of them. Pot meet kettle.

---

We literarily just had a year long battle in congress, resulting in a new Republican speaker, all because they wanted to block aid to Ukraine. Less than half of Republicans ended up voting for it. It only passed because Dems agreed to give the new Republican speaker cover from also getting kicked out. Not a "twisted opinion", a fact.

Lol, you sure you know which party we're talking about?

---

You think they got rid of Kevin McCarthy because of aid to Ukraine? Hahahahaha

---

No, they wanted to get rid of him because they're lunatics who can't comprehend that any Speaker ultimately has to govern a little bit, which means occasional compromise. It's why they hated Boehner, and then Ryan, and then McCarthy. The Ukraine aid thing was the final straw that ended McCarthy's career. I'm sure they'll axe the new guy soon, too.

But yes, ending aid to Ukraine very much means handing Ukraine over to Russia. Instead of making a fool of yourself maybe you should actually ask the right wing folks in the Water Cooler here if they want to help Ukraine or abandon them. The unanimous answer apparently will surprise you.

---

You answered no it wasn't the reason then answer yes it was. You're unhinged and I'm loving it.

"No they wanted to get rid of him because they're lunatics"

"The Ukraine aid was the final straw that ended his career"

Who's making a fool of themselves?