I think this is a good explanation of why the SCOTUS should have taken up the Texas complaint...

https://www.citizenfreepress.com/breaking/interesting-texas-comments-from-dinesh-dsouza/

PackBacker07 said:

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Texas does not have standing because it's not the correct party to prove "harm." It's what I've been asking for a few pages now: how can Texas sue another state for how they choose to run their own elections? In a simple dismissal, SCOTUS has said they cannot.

To answer the latter part of your question, no one will hear Texas' "evidence" unless a lower court decides to waste more time and tax dollars on this.

---

See my last post for a sound explanation...

Pacfanweb said:

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Civilized said:

---

caryking said:

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SupplyChainPack said:

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"Trump had no evidence - not true. Evidence is a plenty, now..."


The evidence is overwhelming. Only a complete fool would actually believe that Biden won the election legitimately.

The courts are just doing what most liberals do. Demanding to see the evidence while putting on a heavy blindfold, stuffing their ears with cotton, and chanting loudly to ensure there is no way for evidence to make it through.

---

You said the courts are doing what most liberals do...

The courts are not made up completely by liberals... The evidence is clear showing fraud; however, drop the fraud thinking and focus on the legality of the moves made by non-legislators.

Why do you think the courts are doing this.?

---

It's obvious why they're doing it.

Because the cases have grossly insufficient legal merit.

Doesn't matter if the courts in question lean right or left. They're all coming to the exact same conclusion.

---

Exactly. Caryking, you clearly haven't looked at any of the "evidence" provided TO the courts, if you think there IS any.

These cases are getting thrown out because they're pitiful. The Trump team has yet to bring ANYTHING of significance in front of a judge. If they had, it would have gotten somewhere.

I urge you to go look at exactly what was brought in front of the various judges and come back and tell us what you thought of that "evidence" that was tossed out.

---

Name one case (as I don't know of one and need help finding it) that has had a hearing so evidence can be shown with people testifying...

caryking said:

---

You guys are funny! Keep it coming... I enjoy the commentary by the liberals here. Packfan, I'm not sure what you are: I think you said you are a conservative; however, who knows...

Here is the question: how can we have a media completely biased against NC State athletics, along with Refs, the NCAA, other head coaches, etc... but, we can't have the same thing against a political party or President?

Yea, that right there show the hypocrisy of the left. Is it the same left against NC State as the President? Consider that..

---

Consider that the alternative media sources you've turned to also have an agenda as well and are even more biased than the MSM you at disgusted by. They are profiting by telling you what you want to hear, regardless of fact or fiction.

To use your example, you've traded media that's biased against NC State for media that tells you we would have won the past 5 football and basketball ACC championships if it wasn't due to a conspiracy involving Swoff, refs, and even our own players and coaches.

Excellent comparison.

Pacfanweb said:

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Wolfpackrich1 said:

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Caryking can not see what is clearly true. There was no widespread fraud. He listens to what now has been proven to be fake news. Then he says your well thought out points that you give are just pointless. He is arrogant and something much worse. Not capable on reasonable thought.

---

Sounds like a flat earther. It's absolutely no different, really.

Or any other conspiracy theory. No matter how big the mountain of proof is to the contrary, and how little actual evidence there is to support them, they CHOOSE to believe the lies.

---

Not a flat earthier. I believe that God created all and by that, everything I own is his.

No matter how big the mountain of proof is to the truth, and how much actual evidence there is to support them, you CHOOSE to believe the lies perpetrated by the MSM and your liberal cohorts.

caryking said:

---

Pacfanweb said:

---

Civilized said:

---

caryking said:

---

SupplyChainPack said:

---

"Trump had no evidence - not true. Evidence is a plenty, now..."


The evidence is overwhelming. Only a complete fool would actually believe that Biden won the election legitimately.

The courts are just doing what most liberals do. Demanding to see the evidence while putting on a heavy blindfold, stuffing their ears with cotton, and chanting loudly to ensure there is no way for evidence to make it through.

---

You said the courts are doing what most liberals do...

The courts are not made up completely by liberals... The evidence is clear showing fraud; however, drop the fraud thinking and focus on the legality of the moves made by non-legislators.

Why do you think the courts are doing this.?

---

It's obvious why they're doing it.

Because the cases have grossly insufficient legal merit.

Doesn't matter if the courts in question lean right or left. They're all coming to the exact same conclusion.

---

Exactly. Caryking, you clearly haven't looked at any of the "evidence" provided TO the courts, if you think there IS any.

These cases are getting thrown out because they're pitiful. The Trump team has yet to bring ANYTHING of significance in front of a judge. If they had, it would have gotten somewhere.

I urge you to go look at exactly what was brought in front of the various judges and come back and tell us what you thought of that "evidence" that was tossed out.

---

Name one case (as I don't know of one and need help finding it) that has had a hearing so evidence can be shown with people testifying...

---

You don't need an actual trial to present your evidence. The judges saw the evidence and dismiss the cases immediately. Because there was no evidence.
You have to show that there's a legitimate reason for a court case in the first place before you're going to get one. They failed to do that. They weren't holding anything back that would have gotten them the case heard. Come on now

IseWolf22 said:

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caryking said:

---

You guys are funny! Keep it coming... I enjoy the commentary by the liberals here. Packfan, I'm not sure what you are: I think you said you are a conservative; however, who knows...

Here is the question: how can we have a media completely biased against NC State athletics, along with Refs, the NCAA, other head coaches, etc... but, we can't have the same thing against a political party or President?

Yea, that right there show the hypocrisy of the left. Is it the same left against NC State as the President? Consider that..

---

Consider that the alternative media sources you've turned to also have an agenda as well and are even more biased than the MSM you at disgusted by. They are profiting by telling you what you want to hear, regardless of fact or fiction.

To use your example, you've traded media that's biased against NC State for media that tells you we would have won the past 5 football and basketball ACC championships if it wasn't due to a conspiracy involving Swoff, refs, and even our own players and coaches.

---

Completely agree with the first paragraph...

Second paragraph, well, way over my head...

caryking said:

---

Pacfanweb said:

---

Wolfpackrich1 said:

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Caryking can not see what is clearly true. There was no widespread fraud. He listens to what now has been proven to be fake news. Then he says your well thought out points that you give are just pointless. He is arrogant and something much worse. Not capable on reasonable thought.

---

Sounds like a flat earther. It's absolutely no different, really.

Or any other conspiracy theory. No matter how big the mountain of proof is to the contrary, and how little actual evidence there is to support them, they CHOOSE to believe the lies.

---

Not a flat earthier. I believe that God created all and by that, everything I own is his.

No matter how big the mountain of proof is to the truth, and how much actual evidence there is to support them, you CHOOSE to believe the lies perpetrated by the MSM and your liberal cohorts.

---

Okay so here's the crux of it: You are the one choosing to only believe the sources that are telling you what you want to hear. You are the one choosing to believe that all the rest of the media is lying and in on some sort of conspiracy.
I don't believe everything the media tells me. But I also know that everything that they say or write isn't false, either. In fact, most of it is true. You have to learn how to sort through the BS.
It's not particularly hard. And as far as all the sources you refer to, did pretty easy to see and debunked anything they say. Their track record with the truth is way worse than the actual MSM is, which isn't perfect at all.

But again you are the one who has chosen to discount every single thing the traditional media has said, and go with alternative sources that have a lot less credibility.

I wouldn't discount everything that anyone said, but it might be discounted more or less depending on their track record.

Pacfanweb said:

---

caryking said:

---

Pacfanweb said:

---

Civilized said:

---

caryking said:

---

SupplyChainPack said:

---

"Trump had no evidence - not true. Evidence is a plenty, now..."


The evidence is overwhelming. Only a complete fool would actually believe that Biden won the election legitimately.

The courts are just doing what most liberals do. Demanding to see the evidence while putting on a heavy blindfold, stuffing their ears with cotton, and chanting loudly to ensure there is no way for evidence to make it through.

---

You said the courts are doing what most liberals do...

The courts are not made up completely by liberals... The evidence is clear showing fraud; however, drop the fraud thinking and focus on the legality of the moves made by non-legislators.

Why do you think the courts are doing this.?

---

It's obvious why they're doing it.

Because the cases have grossly insufficient legal merit.

Doesn't matter if the courts in question lean right or left. They're all coming to the exact same conclusion.

---

Exactly. Caryking, you clearly haven't looked at any of the "evidence" provided TO the courts, if you think there IS any.

These cases are getting thrown out because they're pitiful. The Trump team has yet to bring ANYTHING of significance in front of a judge. If they had, it would have gotten somewhere.

I urge you to go look at exactly what was brought in front of the various judges and come back and tell us what you thought of that "evidence" that was tossed out.

---

Name one case (as I don't know of one and need help finding it) that has had a hearing so evidence can be shown with people testifying...

---

You don't need an actual trial to present your evidence. The judges saw the evidence and dismiss the cases immediately. Because there was no evidence.
You have to show that there's a legitimate reason for a court case in the first place before you're going to get one. They failed to do that. They weren't holding anything back that would have gotten them the case heard. Come on now

---

So, you are saying that a judge watches and/or reads news reports to determine the outcome of a case? Wow!!!

Pacfanweb said:

---

caryking said:

---

Pacfanweb said:

---

Wolfpackrich1 said:

---

Caryking can not see what is clearly true. There was no widespread fraud. He listens to what now has been proven to be fake news. Then he says your well thought out points that you give are just pointless. He is arrogant and something much worse. Not capable on reasonable thought.

---

Sounds like a flat earther. It's absolutely no different, really.

Or any other conspiracy theory. No matter how big the mountain of proof is to the contrary, and how little actual evidence there is to support them, they CHOOSE to believe the lies.

---

Not a flat earthier. I believe that God created all and by that, everything I own is his.

No matter how big the mountain of proof is to the truth, and how much actual evidence there is to support them, you CHOOSE to believe the lies perpetrated by the MSM and your liberal cohorts.

---

Okay so here's the crux of it: You are the one choosing to only believe the sources that are telling you what you want to hear. You are the one choosing to believe that all the rest of the media is lying and in on some sort of conspiracy.
I don't believe everything the media tells me. But I also know that everything that they say or write isn't false, either. In fact, most of it is true. You have to learn how to sort through the BS.
It's not particularly hard. And as far as all the sources you refer to, did pretty easy to see and debunked anything they say. Their track record with the truth is way worse than the actual MSM is, which isn't perfect at all.

But again you are the one who has chosen to discount every single thing the traditional media has said, and go with alternative sources that have a lot less credibility.

I wouldn't discount everything that anyone said, but it might be discounted more or less depending on their track record.

---

Okay so here's the crux of it: You are the one choosing to only believe the sources that are telling you what you want to hear. You are the one choosing to believe that all the rest of the media is lying and in on some sort of conspiracy.

First, that's not true; however, one could say the same about you, right?

I don't believe everything the media tells me. But I also know that everything that they say or write isn't false, either. In fact, most of it is true. You have to learn how to sort through the BS.

Are you insinuating I don't have the ability to sort though the BS?

But again you are the one who has chosen to discount every single thing the traditional media has said,

And you know that, how? I didn't say it. I have only spoken about places I do go. I never said I didn't look at other places...

and go with alternative sources that have a lot less credibility.

How do you know they have less credibility? Less credibility than...?

I wouldn't discount everything that anyone said, but it might be discounted more or less depending on their track record.

Who is the arbiter of ones track record?


I especially like this one: Okay so here's the crux of it: You say that as if you are the authority of all things..

Speaking of an unbiased media: I guess Politico is one of the News Agency's that I should be reading more frequently...

Cthepack said:

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They have.

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i have a lot of CNN street cred by association and I think you could be confusing fitness for duty and impeachment talk with legitimacy. The only one that's questioned the results of the 2016 election was Trump!

Media is crap

caryking said:

---

You guys are funny! Keep it coming... I enjoy the commentary by the liberals here. Packfan, I'm not sure what you are: I think you said you are a conservative; however, who knows...

Here is the question: how can we have a media completely biased against NC State athletics, along with Refs, the NCAA, other head coaches, etc... but, we can't have the same thing against a political party or President?

Yea, that right there show the hypocrisy of the left. Is it the same left against NC State as the President? Consider that..

---

Is there anyone that would argue otherwise? No one disagrees that the media is left. That doesn't mean they completely fabricate all their reporting.

What's being disputed is that the left media is covering up or otherwise complicit in massive electoral fraud.

I know what I saw and heard. CNN employees on CNN saying trump was an illegitimate president.

Cthepack said:

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I know what I saw and heard. CNN employees on CNN saying trump was an illegitimate president.

---

https://www.projectveritas.com/

So much evidence lol

Civilized said:

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caryking said:

---

You guys are funny! Keep it coming... I enjoy the commentary by the liberals here. Packfan, I'm not sure what you are: I think you said you are a conservative; however, who knows...

Here is the question: how can we have a media completely biased against NC State athletics, along with Refs, the NCAA, other head coaches, etc... but, we can't have the same thing against a political party or President?

Yea, that right there show the hypocrisy of the left. Is it the same left against NC State as the President? Consider that..

---

Is there anyone that would argue otherwise? No one disagrees that the media is left. That doesn't mean they completely fabricate all their reporting.

What's being disputed is that the left media is covering up or otherwise complicit in massive electoral fraud.

---

The media has shown they have no incentive in investigating the truth. The Hunter Biden story is as egregious as it gets.

MSM - nothing to see here. Russia disinformation
Alternative media - all kinds of corruption being exposed

Who was correct?

Why, then, would I accept the MSM as being anything near factual?
Do I watch them? Yes, however, with skepticism

The evidence on that laptop is wild, the guy who came out who was the recipient of the emails corroborating it all(he was a democrat), and the obvious trail of money just gets swept under the rug. Scary times were in. The ruling class can get away with anything but the avg person can get a fine or arrested for running their business, not wearing a mask, and having too many people in their home...ect

imagine if the KKK had their members get off so easily? what is going on in this world.

Democrats gonna democrat. They have to keep the people beholden to them so they can exert power over them. Look at some of the posts here from the lefties. You think any of them have ever questioned what they hear on CNN or MSNBC? Hell no. They take it as gospel and anyone that disagrees with them are uneducated rubes that only watch FOX News. Here's a tidbit for some of you commie wannabes... I don't watch ANY of the cable news outlets. I peruse newspapers online and check the headlines out, do my own reading and formulate my OWN opinion. I don't need some former DNC operative or press secretary to tell me how evil the GOP is and great and wonderful all things democrat are. Jeez...some of you are daft beyond belief.

BBW12OG said:

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Democrats gonna democrat. They have to keep the people beholden to them so they can exert power over them. Look at some of the posts here from the lefties. You think any of them have ever questioned what they hear on CNN or MSNBC? Hell no. They take it as gospel and anyone that disagrees with them are uneducated rubes that only watch FOX News. Here's a tidbit for some of you commie wannabes... I don't watch ANY of the cable news outlets. I peruse newspapers online and check the headlines out, do my own reading and formulate my OWN opinion. I don't need some former DNC operative or press secretary to tell me how evil the GOP is and great and wonderful all things democrat are. Jeez...some of you are daft beyond belief.

---

Been a financial advisor/stock trader for 20 years. My job is to investigate the news for what it is and to make money off such. Fake news is a part of the game. Get idiots to buy high and sell low. No different in politics. The media is/has/was always sold to the highest bidder. Now that social media took their candy, Jeff Bezos can buy WaPost. It happens everywhere. Big 5 conglomerates own 90% of mainstream media. Anyone who thinks the mass media is meant to inform the masses is an idiot. It's meant to control narratives and help the stakeholders of those companies. Again sad times we're in. People can't see it. Left/Right doesn't matter, both sides benefit from the BS.

wonder how fast the mass media turns on Biden, to push for Kamala?

Good news, CU and Missery college FB teams losing. Maybe the Pack can jump into some rankings

He chooses to believe right wing media that have found to not care about the truth in what they report

what's right wing media these days? Anyone who doesn't agree with mainstream narrative?

Dmax95 said:

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wonder how fast the mass media turns on Biden, to push for Kamala?

---

You don't think she's the one that has been leaking the information from the get go on this? Please...if any GOP operative knew that **** would have hit the fan months ago. Willie's Side Piece didn't get to be VP by just staring at ceilings and wearing knee pads to work. She's shrewd and she has the Obama cabal behind her. And dumb ass Sleepy Joe is putting all the bad actors right back in their former roles to help roll his ass out the door. He's a fool and we all knew it. This is gonna be a short term loss for the GOP at the White House but a hell of a long term victory after four years of this **** show. House flips in '22, Senate will add seats to the majority and the White House will be ours again in 2024. Hell will have no fury if we get all three and all three are unified like they are now. Crush every liberal-progressive dream for the next two generations.

The thing you're forgetting, while I agree is that if this election is lost and nothing changes. I don't think there's anymore wins for non swamp candidates. The Left/Right that is married to the Cabal will find that they win easily and the 2000-2016 continuation to socialism/more control will apply. If Dominion and shady characters not prosecuted, why wouldn't they just do more in the future?

Dmax95 said:

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The thing you're forgetting, while I agree is that if this election is lost and nothing changes. I don't think there's anymore wins for non swamp candidates. The Left/Right that is married to the Cabal will find that they win easily and the 2000-2016 continuation to socialism/more control will apply. If Dominion and shady characters not prosecuted, why wouldn't they just do more in the future?

---

They will! That's the thing missing from all the voter/election fraud discussion/debate. This is bigger than any candidate... it's about the entire election process. Hopefully we can agree on certain things:

Dominion has to be out
Mail-in ballots have to be out
State election laws have to be honored
What else?

With that said, I believe in Trump as he is the only Politcal figure (if you can call him that) that is looking at our main threat. China!

caryking said:

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Dmax95 said:

---

The thing you're forgetting, while I agree is that if this election is lost and nothing changes. I don't think there's anymore wins for non swamp candidates. The Left/Right that is married to the Cabal will find that they win easily and the 2000-2016 continuation to socialism/more control will apply. If Dominion and shady characters not prosecuted, why wouldn't they just do more in the future?

---

They will! That's the thing missing from all the voter/election fraud discussion/debate. This is bigger than any candidate... it's about the entire election process. Hopefully we can agree on certain things:

Dominion has to be out
Mail-in ballots have to be out
State election laws have to be honored
What else?

With that said, I believe in Trump as he is the only Politcal figure (if you can call him that) that is looking at our main threat. China!

---

Well said hombre.

What else? I would say, Id required, signature verification. We treat voting like it's a game. Why not treat votes like we treat everything else important. You're going to need verification of your identity, address, and legally allowed to vote. Chain of custody with all voting procedures so the vote is tracked and scanned. How about really enforcing voting laws/fraud. If you get busted manipulating the system you get the 10 yr/100k fine like the law says in some circumstances. Right now it's a joke. If you attempt to defraud a business, gov't, or bank you get penalized heavily, but not voting??? cmon

If I hear one person whine about how these rules are somehow racist or meant to suppress voting then just block me lol. What's more important. Allowing millions the ability to manipulate a vote/vote illegally or the right to a true election? If someone cares enough to vote, they'll agree rules are needed to ensure legit votes.

caryking said:

---

Why, then, would I accept the MSM as being anything near factual?
Do I watch them? Yes, however, with skepticism

---

That's totally fair, and honestly, a good way to go about it.

The problem is, the part about disbelieving everything in the MSM, and thinking there's some coordinated, "communist" effort.

And then lending WAY too much credence to other "non traditional" sources.

Not you specifically, but the election doubters in general.

So sure, doubt the MSM. They certainly have an agenda. But when everything they're reporting about the election keeps getting backed up by the courts and all the state gov'ts that are refuting these rumors......a reasonable and open-minded person HAS to conclude that the MSM is pretty accurate on this particular topic and the twitters, facebooks, parlers and rumbles of the world are wrong.

It's just a numbers thing. "Everyone" can NOT be "in on it" or "deep state". Not all the MSM, all the state governments be they D or R, all the courts right up to the Supremes. They all cannot possibly be a part of some huge deception.
And the level of deception required to pull something like this off would be unparalleled in human history. Simply impossible.

So that's a given, then we get to the fact that, when given their day in court, Trump's legal teams brought exactly nothing to show. No evidence. Nothing. Just rumors and innuendos, or outright falsehoods.

Put all that together and the only logical conclusion you can come to is that Trump lost, and is being the sorest loser in history about it.

And as with all celebs, there are fans willing to throw themselves in front of a bus for him to defend him. That's kind of unprecedented for a President, since he's the first real celeb in that position that was super famous prior.

Dmax95 said:

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Media is crap

---

Yes he did. Does not mean he's a hero!

'79 - Khomeini won it
'39 and '42 - Joseph Stalin
'07 - Putin
'82 - computer
'80 & '83 - Reagan
'76 - Carter
'63 - MLK Jr.
'61 - Kennedy
'59 - Eisenhower
'00 & '04 - Bush II
'92 & '98 - Clinton
'45 & '48 Truman
'52 - Elizabeth II
'71 & '72 - Nixon ...and so forth...

I was watching history this morning and saw in WWI during hard combat, 1 English solider (forget his name) had found himself by himself with his rifle drawn on 1 German solider and he let him go. That German solider had to cut the sides of his mustache off because his gas mask would not seal because of it. Later stache won Time person of the year.

Hitler appeared on the cover of TIME on multiple occasions most famously perhaps on Jan. 2, 1939, when he was named Man of the Year. That choice abided by the dictum of TIME founder Henry Luce, who decreed that the Man of the Year now Person of the Year was not an honor but instead should be a distinction applied to the newsmaker who most influenced world events for better or worse. In case that second criterion was lost on readers, the issue that named Hitler dispensed with the portrait treatment that cover subjects typically got. Instead he was depicted as a tiny figure with his back to the viewer, playing a massive organ with his murdered victims spinning on a St. Catherine's wheel. Underneath the stark, black-and-white illustration was the caption, "From the unholy organist, a hymn of hate."

Why did Hitler ever think that mustache looked good?

Pacfanweb said:

---

caryking said:

---

Why, then, would I accept the MSM as being anything near factual?
Do I watch them? Yes, however, with skepticism

---

That's totally fair, and honestly, a good way to go about it.

The problem is, the part about disbelieving everything in the MSM, and thinking there's some coordinated, "communist" effort.

And then lending WAY too much credence to other "non traditional" sources.

Not you specifically, but the election doubters in general.

So sure, doubt the MSM. They certainly have an agenda. But when everything they're reporting about the election keeps getting backed up by the courts and all the state gov'ts that are refuting these rumors......a reasonable and open-minded person HAS to conclude that the MSM is pretty accurate on this particular topic and the twitters, facebooks, parlers and rumbles of the world are wrong.

It's just a numbers thing. "Everyone" can NOT be "in on it" or "deep state". Not all the MSM, all the state governments be they D or R, all the courts right up to the Supremes. They all cannot possibly be a part of some huge deception.
And the level of deception required to pull something like this off would be unparalleled in human history. Simply impossible.

So that's a given, then we get to the fact that, when given their day in court, Trump's legal teams brought exactly nothing to show. No evidence. Nothing. Just rumors and innuendos, or outright falsehoods.

Put all that together and the only logical conclusion you can come to is that Trump lost, and is being the sorest loser in history about it.

And as with all celebs, there are fans willing to throw themselves in front of a bus for him to defend him. That's kind of unprecedented for a President, since he's the first real celeb in that position that was super famous prior.

---

You know, I have a lot skepticism about... well, really, too much stuff. I tend to find some of the alternative media does more due-diligence than MSM.

Really, how do we know what's truth? Everyone is communicating with a narrative. That's why I have stated previously that we all have different "world views".

FoxNews, CNN, Major Networks all provide news with a narrative. We get partial truths from most. Then, people on boards, regurgitate the partial truth. Perhaps, one could say that about me... I personally believe I do enough due diligence to form a reasonable opinion and/or conclusion.

I see what's happening in the courts. I also see what the lawyers, state legislators, US House members, 500K people in the streets of Washington DC are saying. Perhaps, they are all drinking the cool-aid, I don't know.

What I do know is: this believe of election fraud isn't confined to this board. In fact, more and more polls are showing roughly have of the country thinks the election had major problems. What's interesting is that not all Rebublicans believe this. So, does that mean some Democrats are seeing problems in the election. I don't know... yes, I know polls are not completely accurate...

So, what do I make of all this? Well, repeatedly, I have said to let it play out. I've also said this is a tough task at hand for the Trump team. And, I believe, without a doubt, we have had significant election issues. We have to fix these issues; otherwise, these arguments will never end.

All we will have left is: I'm right and you're wrong conversations!