Election Interference/Fraud

269,726 Views | 3695 Replies | Last: 3 yr ago by BBW12OG
caryking
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So, the State of Texas has no standing (US Supreme Court say)...

Two questions:

  • who does have standing?
  • Who is actually hearing the evidence in court?
On the illegal or criminal immigrants…

“they built the country, the reason our economy is growing”

Joe Biden
Pacfanweb
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SupplyChainPack said:



"Trump had no evidence - not true. Evidence is a plenty, now..."


The evidence is overwhelming. Only a complete fool would actually believe that Biden won the election legitimately.

The courts are just doing what most liberals do. Demanding to see the evidence while putting on a heavy blindfold, stuffing their ears with cotton, and chanting loudly to ensure there is no way for evidence to make it through.


Again: Why did none of this "evidence" get presented in court by Sidney Powell, Rudy and other Trump attorneys?

Why?

And again: You really think there's all this "evidence" out there and the Trump legal team doesn't know about it, or DID know about it and just didn't present it?

THINK, folks. If all that so-called "evidence" was legit, it would have made its way to the courtroom and been put in front of a judge.

So why do you think YOU and all the other conspiracy folks think YOU have access to all this info and the Trump team did not?
caryking
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cowboypack02 said:

caryking said:

BBW12OG said:

caryking said:

I find this story interesting in so many ways...

https://nsjonline.com/article/2020/12/rusher-tilting-the-scales-in-the-nc-supreme-court-chief-justice-race/


But she's a DEMOCRAT.... they are allowed to do things like this. It's only bad when a Republican does them. Don't you know they can do no wrong? Did you not see the CNN anchor wearing the $380.00 "Facts First" sweater yesterday? Come on man.... you know there's a different set of rules for them than us uneducated peons!!!
I wish we would pay more attention to races like this. If Paul Newby ends up winning, as Chief Justice, he sets the agenda for all State courts. Now, we will only have three conservative NC Supreme Court Justices; however, he would shape the lower courts in a more balanced way.

Paul is a good person and I think most people here would enjoy spending time with him. Very constitutionally based...
Its sad that we have to look at the judicial branch this way...necessary, but still sad
Beasley to concede this morning!!!
On the illegal or criminal immigrants…

“they built the country, the reason our economy is growing”

Joe Biden
Civilized
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caryking said:

SupplyChainPack said:



"Trump had no evidence - not true. Evidence is a plenty, now..."


The evidence is overwhelming. Only a complete fool would actually believe that Biden won the election legitimately.

The courts are just doing what most liberals do. Demanding to see the evidence while putting on a heavy blindfold, stuffing their ears with cotton, and chanting loudly to ensure there is no way for evidence to make it through.




You said the courts are doing what most liberals do...

The courts are not made up completely by liberals... The evidence is clear showing fraud; however, drop the fraud thinking and focus on the legality of the moves made by non-legislators.

Why do you think the courts are doing this.?

It's obvious why they're doing it.

Because the cases have grossly insufficient legal merit.

Doesn't matter if the courts in question lean right or left. They're all coming to the exact same conclusion.
PackBacker07
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Texas does not have standing because it's not the correct party to prove "harm." It's what I've been asking for a few pages now: how can Texas sue another state for how they choose to run their own elections? In a simple dismissal, SCOTUS has said they cannot.

To answer the latter part of your question, no one will hear Texas' "evidence" unless a lower court decides to waste more time and tax dollars on this.
Y'all means ALL.
Pacfanweb
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Civilized said:

caryking said:

SupplyChainPack said:



"Trump had no evidence - not true. Evidence is a plenty, now..."


The evidence is overwhelming. Only a complete fool would actually believe that Biden won the election legitimately.

The courts are just doing what most liberals do. Demanding to see the evidence while putting on a heavy blindfold, stuffing their ears with cotton, and chanting loudly to ensure there is no way for evidence to make it through.




You said the courts are doing what most liberals do...

The courts are not made up completely by liberals... The evidence is clear showing fraud; however, drop the fraud thinking and focus on the legality of the moves made by non-legislators.

Why do you think the courts are doing this.?

It's obvious why they're doing it.

Because the cases have grossly insufficient legal merit.

Doesn't matter if the courts in question lean right or left. They're all coming to the exact same conclusion.
Exactly. Caryking, you clearly haven't looked at any of the "evidence" provided TO the courts, if you think there IS any.

These cases are getting thrown out because they're pitiful. The Trump team has yet to bring ANYTHING of significance in front of a judge. If they had, it would have gotten somewhere.

I urge you to go look at exactly what was brought in front of the various judges and come back and tell us what you thought of that "evidence" that was tossed out.
caryking
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Pacfanweb said:

SupplyChainPack said:



"Trump had no evidence - not true. Evidence is a plenty, now..."


The evidence is overwhelming. Only a complete fool would actually believe that Biden won the election legitimately.

The courts are just doing what most liberals do. Demanding to see the evidence while putting on a heavy blindfold, stuffing their ears with cotton, and chanting loudly to ensure there is no way for evidence to make it through.



Again: Why did none of this "evidence" get presented in court by Sidney Powell, Rudy and other Trump attorneys? They have shown they evidence all over the place. Why do you refuse to look at it? Now, why does the court s not have hearing to show the evidence. That's beyond me, other than to say it's political...

Why?

And again: You really think there's all this "evidence" out there and the Trump legal team doesn't know about it, or DID know about it and just didn't present it? I heard about the evidence exclusively from the Trump legal team and other lawyers in this.

THINK, folks. If all that so-called "evidence" was legit, it would have made its way to the courtroom and been put in front of a judge. The evidence is legit, you just chose not to look at it and for some reason, the courts are not calling true hearings to allow for the evidence to be shown. If you can't show the evidence to the court, how do they 'now if it's legit or not?

So why do you think YOU and all the other conspiracy folks think YOU have access to all this info and the Trump team did not? That question shouldn't be dignified with an answer; however, I'm going to... your question is stupid and you are showing your stupidity with the question.
On the illegal or criminal immigrants…

“they built the country, the reason our economy is growing”

Joe Biden
Wolfpackrich1
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If you have believed all this fraud that right wing media outlets have reported.
Then seen that the courts have thrown out all these cases including the supreme court twice.
You should ask yourself. Hey was those reports true?
Hmmmmm. Maybe the lied to me.

So who was the fake news? Main stream media or the right wing conservative networks?

The answer is obvious.

Election fraud case is closed. No wide spread fraud found
caryking
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Pacfanweb said:

Civilized said:

caryking said:

SupplyChainPack said:



"Trump had no evidence - not true. Evidence is a plenty, now..."


The evidence is overwhelming. Only a complete fool would actually believe that Biden won the election legitimately.

The courts are just doing what most liberals do. Demanding to see the evidence while putting on a heavy blindfold, stuffing their ears with cotton, and chanting loudly to ensure there is no way for evidence to make it through.




You said the courts are doing what most liberals do...

The courts are not made up completely by liberals... The evidence is clear showing fraud; however, drop the fraud thinking and focus on the legality of the moves made by non-legislators.

Why do you think the courts are doing this.?

It's obvious why they're doing it.

Because the cases have grossly insufficient legal merit.

Doesn't matter if the courts in question lean right or left. They're all coming to the exact same conclusion.
Exactly. Caryking, you clearly haven't looked at any of the "evidence" provided TO the courts, if you think there IS any.

These cases are getting thrown out because they're pitiful. The Trump team has yet to bring ANYTHING of significance in front of a judge. If they had, it would have gotten somewhere.

I urge you to go look at exactly what was brought in front of the various judges and come back and tell us what you thought of that "evidence" that was tossed out.
I, because I have time on my hands, have watched several of the state congressional hearings. In those hearings evidence has been shown.. it's very compelling. Sounds like you don't have the time to watch any of this.

Your other points are pointless... actually, I urge you to do your research by watching some of the hearings. From that, if you don't think the evidence is solid, then we just disagree. Right now, it appears you are working on the surfaces of the details and throwing up trial balloons to see what sticks...
On the illegal or criminal immigrants…

“they built the country, the reason our economy is growing”

Joe Biden
PackBacker07
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Multiple Trump appointed judges, including quite a few from the Federalist Society, have laughed these lawsuits out of court. I wouldn't call those "liberal courts."
Y'all means ALL.
Cthepack
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They are both fake. They Care more about number of viewers than reporting any truth. Both play to their audience.
caryking
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PackBacker07 said:

Multiple Trump appointed judges, including quite a few from the Federalist Society, have laughed these lawsuits out of court. I wouldn't call those "liberal courts."
Read my other post to see what I think about the courts... too lazy, huh?
On the illegal or criminal immigrants…

“they built the country, the reason our economy is growing”

Joe Biden
Wolfpackrich1
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Caryking can not see what is clearly true. There was no widespread fraud. He listens to what now has been proven to be fake news. Then he says your well thought out points that you give are just pointless. He is arrogant and something much worse. Not capable on reasonable thought.
Pacfanweb
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Here's some of Sidney Powell's "evidence", as described by a judge:

Powell claims that election machines in Michigan (and around the country) were rigged to give Biden a lead. But "the closest Plaintiffs get to alleging that election machines and software changed votes for President Trump to Vice President Biden in Wayne County," Parker says, "is an amalgamation of theories, conjecture, and speculation that such alterations were possible."

Not evidence.

Powell maintains that Democrats resorted to paper ballot fraud after their original, machine-based scheme failed to work as anticipated. Yet "the closest Plaintiffs get to alleging that physical ballots were altered" to favor Biden, Parker says, "is the following statement in an election challenger's sworn affidavit: 'I believe some of these workers were changing votes that had been cast for Donald Trump and other Republican candidates.' But of course, '[a] belief is not evidence' and falls far short of what is required to obtain any relief, much less the extraordinary relief Plaintiffs request."

Again, not evidence.

A random affidavit that merely says "I believe some workers changed votes" is NOTHING. It's laughable. Pathetic.
Embarrassing that it even made it to court.

Go to a lawyer and tell them "I want to sue my neighbor because I believe he is stealing cable"

And you'll be asked "Proof"?

And if you're Sidney Powell, you say "I have an affidavit from the mailman that says he believes this is true"

And you get laughed out of the office.

That is the sum of all the Trump cases.

They never brought any actual evidence. No pictures, no voting machines, no video, no "we specifically allege that we saw fraud and can prove it", no nothing, other than people saying "We don't think it was fair", basically.
Pacfanweb
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Wolfpackrich1 said:

Caryking can not see what is clearly true. There was no widespread fraud. He listens to what now has been proven to be fake news. Then he says your well thought out points that you give are just pointless. He is arrogant and something much worse. Not capable on reasonable thought.
Sounds like a flat earther. It's absolutely no different, really.

Or any other conspiracy theory. No matter how big the mountain of proof is to the contrary, and how little actual evidence there is to support them, they CHOOSE to believe the lies.
Wolfpackrich1
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Ok. I understand your point. But one has on the issue of election fraud to be fake news and that is the conservative right wing outlets.
Wolfpackrich1
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Sidney Powell is bat **** crazy. Says things like release the Kraken. Wow. And all she had were lies.
I thought I was watching someone on drugs.
Pacfanweb
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caryking said:

Pacfanweb said:

Civilized said:

caryking said:

SupplyChainPack said:



"Trump had no evidence - not true. Evidence is a plenty, now..."


The evidence is overwhelming. Only a complete fool would actually believe that Biden won the election legitimately.

The courts are just doing what most liberals do. Demanding to see the evidence while putting on a heavy blindfold, stuffing their ears with cotton, and chanting loudly to ensure there is no way for evidence to make it through.




You said the courts are doing what most liberals do...

The courts are not made up completely by liberals... The evidence is clear showing fraud; however, drop the fraud thinking and focus on the legality of the moves made by non-legislators.

Why do you think the courts are doing this.?

It's obvious why they're doing it.

Because the cases have grossly insufficient legal merit.

Doesn't matter if the courts in question lean right or left. They're all coming to the exact same conclusion.
Exactly. Caryking, you clearly haven't looked at any of the "evidence" provided TO the courts, if you think there IS any.

These cases are getting thrown out because they're pitiful. The Trump team has yet to bring ANYTHING of significance in front of a judge. If they had, it would have gotten somewhere.

I urge you to go look at exactly what was brought in front of the various judges and come back and tell us what you thought of that "evidence" that was tossed out.
I, because I have time on my hands, have watched several of the state congressional hearings. In those hearings evidence has been shown.. it's very compelling. Sounds like you don't have the time to watch any of this.

Your other points are pointless... actually, I urge you to do your research by watching some of the hearings. From that, if you don't think the evidence is solid, then we just disagree. Right now, it appears you are working on the surfaces of the details and throwing up trial balloons to see what sticks...


Again....how much of that made it in front of a judge? Zero? And then, why?

Why did it make it to some legislature and not to court? The reason is obvious, but you tell us.

I mean...this "proof" has been presented everywhere else BUT the courts.

Cthepack
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As the left wing media said about the 2016 election.
Pacfanweb
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Wolfpackrich1 said:

Sidney Powell is bat **** crazy. Says things like release the Kraken. Wow. And all she had were lies.
I thought I was watching someone on drugs.
Yep. Her "former military intelligence expert" turned out to be a former Army wheeled vehicle mechanic. Never worked in intelligence a day in his life.
Pacfanweb
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Cthepack said:

As the left wing media said about the 2016 election.
Nah, they really didn't. Nowhere NEAR to this extent. They grumbled and griped, but you aren't credible if you say there was this much whining and protesting.
Cthepack
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There was a three year investigation that happened. The media for 4 years called trump an illegitimate president. So ya they did and do.
Pacfanweb
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Cthepack said:

There was a three year investigation that happened. The media for 4 years called trump an illegitimate president. So ya they did and do.
Yes, and that was legit. Multiple people were indicted and sentences handed out.

And it had nothing to do with challenging the election, which is specifically what I'm talking about...Trump was President, no debate on that from the Dems.

But yeah, I'd also agree that they used that to cripple his Presidency....no doubt.

However, if it hadn't been a legitimate issue, it wouldn't have gone anywhere....like all of Trump's challenges to this election haven't gone anywhere, because they aren't legitimate.
Wolfpackrich1
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The House and Senate and Justice department had investigations. That is not the fault of the media.
Cthepack
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Trumps tweets are also not the media. But the media continued to call trumps presidency illegitimate.
Wolfpackrich1
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I am sorry but I never heard the media say Trump's presidency was illegitimate. Democrats say it yes. Mainstream media no. Maybe they reported someone said it. But a statement from the stating Trump was illegitimate president no.


Trump said his tweets were his views.
IseWolf22
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Good article on the use of "alternative media sources" today.


"Now imagine having that taxation argument with someone who claims (without a scintilla of evidence) that the Department of Finance is rigging the numbers and that none of its data can be trusted. Or with a person who believes that poor people pay the bulk of state taxes. What if upon seeing evidence to the contrary, that person accuses me of ignoring the TRUTH!!! and directs me to a brilliant but unknown economist Grandpa found on YouTube?

You can see the problem. Regarding the Trump voter-fraud conspiracy, many of us rely on the 38-plus judicial rulings that have thus far rebuked the president's arguments. We trust the nation's elections system, whichdespite its obvious flawshas been one of the world's democratic triumphs. If the president had evidence of systemic fraud, we figure most of that would emerge in the courts.

The ensuing debate would center on specific legal cases and judicial findings. What happens, though, when large numbers of people believe that the entire court system, election process, and federal government are essentially in on the scam? As a libertarian, I'm fully aware of flaws in every political and governmental system, but still believe that sufficient checks and balances existand that our system is fundamentally legitimate"

Some Trump supporters find it easier to believe that every major American institution is potentially corrupt than to think that a president with a history of telling whoppers is being dishonest again.


https://reason.com/2020/12/11/can-americans-inhabit-parallel-political-universes-without-compromising-freedom/
PackBacker07
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More directed at SCP. But continue to bless the board with the merits of STEVE BANNON!
Y'all means ALL.
dogplasma
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I don't know who you're talking about when you say "the media", but my wife watches a **** ton of CNN and I've never once seen anyone say or imply his presidency was illegitimate (though they've said a lot of other things). And if CNN didn't say that, I don't know who would have.
Cthepack
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They have.
Wolfpackrich1
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You just keep saying they have. I am a mainstream media watcher and have never heard them say that. Democrat politicians and their followers. Yes they said every chance they got. But not mainstream media.

I have tried to reason with you on this. I even told you I understand that the mainstream media leans left. I will not accuse them of something they have not done though.
Civilized
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IseWolf22 said:


Some Trump supporters find it easier to believe that every major American institution is potentially corrupt than to think that a president with a history of telling whoppers is being dishonest again.


I don't know if Trump and other opportunistic "alternative media outlets" did this damage over the last four years or if he/they just rode the lightning that was already out there (or most likely, some of both) but this is what concerns me the most moving forward.

Tens of millions of Americans now distrust and discount the MSM, the courts, federal agencies like CISA, and our elections processes.

Instead, they concoct or buy into massive alternative reality conspiracy theories and anyone or any institution that disputes the often obvious holes in said conspiracies is just proof that person or institution is also in on the conspiracy, and so the imaginary web of co-conspirators grows even larger.

It's this big self-reinforcing circular logic loop and it's terribly unhealthy for our country that so many Americans are on that Gravitron going full speed and can't or don't want to see their way out.
Cthepack
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I live overseas and get most of my US news from CNN. I have heard the employees of CNN say that Trumps Presidency is not legit.
Wolfpackrich1
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I also watch CNN. I have not heard that. But I am not going to tell you what you have heard. Good day. Go pack!
caryking
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You guys are funny! Keep it coming... I enjoy the commentary by the liberals here. Packfan, I'm not sure what you are: I think you said you are a conservative; however, who knows...

Here is the question: how can we have a media completely biased against NC State athletics, along with Refs, the NCAA, other head coaches, etc... but, we can't have the same thing against a political party or President?

Yea, that right there show the hypocrisy of the left. Is it the same left against NC State as the President? Consider that..
On the illegal or criminal immigrants…

“they built the country, the reason our economy is growing”

Joe Biden
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