toddl said:

---

Redwolf said:

---

toddl said:

---

Commit Bethany Michalak finished 2nd at NXN over the weekend. Finishing 2nd to anyone named Ritzenhein is a great result. Hopefully she can provide some solid depth next year as well, despite our hesitancy to using true freshmen.
https://live.athletictiming.net/meets/29011/xc-events/1036559/results

I'm unsure about how high to get my hopes up for Fiona Smith. Great experience and great results, but her times don't set the world on fire. Runaway national champion in D3 will be competing for our top 5.
https://www.tfrrs.org/athletes/7738747/St_Benedict/Fiona_Smith.html
And as soon as I say that I see she dropped a 15:50 on Saturday at BU. There you go, that's pretty good. Her 2022-2023 seasons were full of 16:10-20s, which is fine. 15:50 is on par with Grace Hartman.

---

Is there a sport you're not on top of toddl…?
Man mad props …I'm lucky if I remember what I had for breakfast this morning.
Kidding aside I for one really appreciate the stats and breakdowns from you thanks .
I will admit thought half of it at the moment goes right over my head , but I'm getting better.

---

XC is the one I care about.
Football is just a way to be a pain in the ass and tell people they're wrong.

---

Haha love it… really enjoying learning about XC, wrestling, was a swimmer so certainly enjoy that but ya getting outside the three sports it's really still student athletes…

Big hug, thanks for everything.

Interview with Tuohy after her decision to turn pro

Both Katelyn Tuohy and Laurie Henes gave interviews with Citius with a planned release after Tuohy's announcement. They talk about how decision went down, how the coaching and training situations will work out etc.,


Coach Henes' interview

Edit: Didn't see post above, but leaving Coach Henes' interview here

jadawson said:

---

Both Katelyn Tuohy and Laurie Henes gave interviews with Citius with a planned release after Tuohy's announcement. They talk about how decision went down, how the coaching and training situations will work out etc.,


Coach Henes' interview

Edit: Didn't see post above, but leaving Coach Henes' interview here

---

These are two EXCELLENT interviews by Citius. Absolute must listens.

Katelyn talks about how she first got sick on the day they left to travel up to Charlottesville (Thursday). She says she knew at the start of the race that she would not be able to contend for the individual win (due to her sickness and feeling bad), but was determined to race as well as she could in order to help the team win. Says she was really struggling during the race.

She appears emotional when talking about the team win and says "it was almost like a movie" and "still surreal" that the team was able to win -- you can tell how much the team wins mean to her. She talks about how Leah and Grace were "hurting really bad" in the race (they faded at the end). Katelyn talks again about how Kelsey Chmiel was the big reason that she initially noticed NC State in the recruiting process.

Katelyn mentioned that there has been illness going around many members of the team near the end of the season, and Coach Henes revealed that Leah Stephens and Hannah Gapes were held out of regionals "at the last minute" (presumably for being sick), with Stephens in particular still being affected by that illness at the Nationals race. I'm sure that played a big part in the fact that Stephens' results seemed to regress as the season went along (for example, she finished 14th at Nuttycombe early in the season, but 43rd at Nationals). Also, I didn't know this before, but Henes mentioned that prior to the 2021 Nationals race (in Tallahassee), that Kelsey Chmiel had a 102 degree fever getting on the plane to travel there.

cool interview with incoming recruit Fiona Smith. It talks about her season so far, her D3 legacy and her goals for the rest of the year. The first 10 minutes or so is specifically about the recruiting process and what went into choosing NC State.

https://www.d3glorydays.com/podcast/d3-xc-champs-files-fiona-smith

NAU making a move again. They lost their #1 and #2 from nationals this year (though their #3 finisher was usually their #1), and return everyone else. They just announced two transfers in, Alyson Churchill from Florida St and Karrie Baloga from Colorado. Churchill is a junior and was 22nd at nationals this year and Baloga is a freshman and was 82nd at nationals this year.

NC State is going to need a big time transfer to compete with them next year (on paper at least)

jadawson said:

---

NAU making a move again. They lost their #1 and #2 from nationals this year (though their #3 finisher was usually their #1), and return everyone else. They just announced two transfers in, Alyson Churchill from Florida St and Karrie Baloga from Colorado. Churchill is a junior and was 22nd at nationals this year and Baloga is a freshman and was 82nd at nationals this year.

NC State is going to need a big time transfer to compete with them next year (on paper at least)

---

Churchill's results in the 2023 XC ACCs and NCAAs were very good, but in previous years only average. She was only 31st at Nuttycombe this year. I wonder if she performs as well in 2024? Likely, but not a sure thing.

Maybe someone like Hannah Gapes or Brooke Rauber, and hopefully Grace Hartman, could take a huge leap next year, similar to what Churchill did this year (as well as Samantha Bush in her 3rd season of XC).

I think NC State should be a top 3 team with the known roster for next year, and IMO close to NAU, but I agree that Coach Henes needs to bring in some more firepower. Looks like they are losing at least 6 from this years roster, and hopefully they have room for 1 or 2 more additions, on top of Fiona Smith and the currently known/signed incoming freshmen.

Regardless of what NAU is doing i think we need to cross our fingers that a big time talent enters the portal next spring and wants to come to NC State. Historically speaking you need to have a runner in the top 10 if you want to win the title. Only once since the year 2000 has a womens team won the team title without having a runner in the top 10, and that was BYU in the weird covid year spring race and their top runner was 11th.

We have a lot of talented runners and never say never, but i dont see a top 10 finisher in 2024 on the roster right now. Who knows, maybe Leah Stephens blows the doors off all winter and spring as well and runs in the 15:20's and changes my outlook.

jadawson said:

---

Regardless of what NAU is doing i think we need to cross our fingers that a big time talent enters the portal next spring and wants to come to NC State. Historically speaking you need to have a runner in the top 10 if you want to win the title. Only once since the year 2000 has a womens team won the team title without having a runner in the top 10, and that was BYU in the weird covid year spring race and their top runner was 11th.

We have a lot of talented runners and never say never, but i dont see a top 10 finisher in 2024 on the roster right now. Who knows, maybe Leah Stephens blows the doors off all winter and spring as well and runs in the 15:20's and changes my outlook.

---

I agree that we need to shoot for a top 10 type runner to add to the roster. But if it's "only" a 10-20 Nationals runner that could be sufficient to still help us be able to win. If NAU would have beat us a few weeks ago, they would have won with their top runner, Larkin, finishing 13th. So while it is true, based on the history, that you usually need a top 10 runner to win, it's still possible to win without that -- and, for example, have all 5 runners finish All-American and average around 20 points. Stephens finished 14th at Nuttycombe this season, and was apparently sick at Regionals, which could have affected her somewhat sub-par performance at nationals. I think she projects as a 10-20th Nationals runner next year.

GuerrillaPack said:

---

jadawson said:

---

Regardless of what NAU is doing i think we need to cross our fingers that a big time talent enters the portal next spring and wants to come to NC State. Historically speaking you need to have a runner in the top 10 if you want to win the title. Only once since the year 2000 has a womens team won the team title without having a runner in the top 10, and that was BYU in the weird covid year spring race and their top runner was 11th.

We have a lot of talented runners and never say never, but i dont see a top 10 finisher in 2024 on the roster right now. Who knows, maybe Leah Stephens blows the doors off all winter and spring as well and runs in the 15:20's and changes my outlook.

---

I agree that we need to shoot for a top 10 type runner to add to the roster. But if it's "only" a 10-20 Nationals runner that could be sufficient to still help us be able to win. If NAU would have beat us a few weeks ago, they would have won with their top runner, Larkin, finishing 13th. So while it is true, based on the history, that you usually need a top 10 runner to win, it's still possible to win without that -- and, for example, have all 5 runners finish All-American and average around 20 points. Stephens finished 14th at Nuttycombe this season, and was apparently sick at Regionals, which could have affected her somewhat sub-par performance at nationals. I think she projects as a 10-20th Nationals runner next year.

---

Don't get me wrong i'm not saying its impossible with our current roster, just that historically its unlikely. Our team score last year of 123 would have only won 6 other times since the year 2000. The mean winning score over that time period is 106 and even that is kind of skewed high because a score of 195 won in 2006. So like you said, 5 averaging around ~20 points. Over the past few years the 20th scorer is usually between 22nd and 27th place, so youd need your top 5 to average that without a top 10 runner. Our top returners placed 43rd, 63rd and 73rd, and the other runners you'd likely count on have either never run D1 nationals (Smith/Loveys) or have placed 90th but can rarely stay healthy (Rauber). I always expect all freshman to redshirt until proven otherwise.

Id be thrilled to podium next year with all we lose. But its the offseason and thats the best time to dream of what could be lol.

jadawson said:

---

GuerrillaPack said:

---

jadawson said:

---

Regardless of what NAU is doing i think we need to cross our fingers that a big time talent enters the portal next spring and wants to come to NC State. Historically speaking you need to have a runner in the top 10 if you want to win the title. Only once since the year 2000 has a womens team won the team title without having a runner in the top 10, and that was BYU in the weird covid year spring race and their top runner was 11th.

We have a lot of talented runners and never say never, but i dont see a top 10 finisher in 2024 on the roster right now. Who knows, maybe Leah Stephens blows the doors off all winter and spring as well and runs in the 15:20's and changes my outlook.

---

I agree that we need to shoot for a top 10 type runner to add to the roster. But if it's "only" a 10-20 Nationals runner that could be sufficient to still help us be able to win. If NAU would have beat us a few weeks ago, they would have won with their top runner, Larkin, finishing 13th. So while it is true, based on the history, that you usually need a top 10 runner to win, it's still possible to win without that -- and, for example, have all 5 runners finish All-American and average around 20 points. Stephens finished 14th at Nuttycombe this season, and was apparently sick at Regionals, which could have affected her somewhat sub-par performance at nationals. I think she projects as a 10-20th Nationals runner next year.

---

Don't get me wrong i'm not saying its impossible with our current roster, just that historically its unlikely. Our team score last year of 123 would have only won 6 other times since the year 2000. The mean winning score over that time period is 106 and even that is kind of skewed high because a score of 195 won in 2006. So like you said, 5 averaging around ~20 points. Over the past few years the 20th scorer is usually between 22nd and 27th place, so youd need your top 5 to average that without a top 10 runner. Our top returners placed 43rd, 63rd and 73rd, and the other runners you'd likely count on have either never run D1 nationals (Smith/Loveys) or have placed 90th but can rarely stay healthy (Rauber). I always expect all freshman to redshirt until proven otherwise.

Id be thrilled to podium next year with all we lose. But its the offseason and thats the best time to dream of what could be lol.

---

I agree with your overall point here. Hopefully Stephens can be on the cusp of the top 10, and that could be enough for us to still have a team contending for the title. I think our team is pretty close to NAU, as it stands now, but maybe I'm just being overly optimistic. Churchill, for example, finished 79th and 127th at her previous two NCAA XC Championships (in 2022, and March 2021), prior to finishing 22nd this year. I hope that we can have at least one on our roster make that kind of jump up in performance in their ~3rd year in the program - such as Hartman, Gapes, or Rauber...similar to what Samantha Bush did in her 3rd year.

It may be unlikely to see Michalak perform next year similar to how Stephens did this season, but if she were able to do that, I think our roster right now could contend for the title again -- with the optimistic view of a top 5 of Stephens, F. Smith, Michalak, Hartman and Loveys finishing around 15/20/25/35/40 and scoring around 105 points....and Rauber and Gapes with solid depth and finishing around 40-50.

I'm here reading all the posts guys..just don't know enough yet to ask questions, but ya here in the background learnin' stuff!

NC State has signed another women's distance recruit for the class of '24 in Ashlei Summers from Hoggard HS in Wilmington, NC. Definitely seems like a long term project recruit and someone who gets better as the distance gets longer.

PB's are 2:27/5:16/10:58/17:40 and she was 4th at the 4A NC State XC meet this past fall.

https://instagr.am/p/C2iplkPRyMl

This interview with Leah Stephens came out today. She discusses her flip from FSU to NC State late in the recruiting process, the decision to not redshirt for cross country this past fall, the culture of the team, and the national championship:

https://open.spotify.com/episode/1la27RKNS8va9hENMHhj1V

Also, Leah says in this interview that she's had a minor stress reaction in her tibia while at NC State (the first significant injury of her running career, including high school). She doesn't state specifically when this occurred, but I assume that it must have happened some time after the NCAA cross country championships race this past November. This would explain why she hasn't raced in indoors yet this winter. But she says that it wasn't that severe of a stress reaction and she's now back to training, and "will be back for outdoor".

Just saw this in the IG feed.

We picked up the #1 distance recruit in the 2025 class, Sadie Englehardt.

https://instagr.am/p/C4Eq-9OLZH4

Quote:

---

BREAKING: Sadie Engelhardt (2025) of Ventura HS (CA) has committed to NC State University!

Sadie is regarded as the #1 distance women's prospect for class of 2025

---

GuerrillaPack said:

---

Just saw this in the IG feed.

We picked up the #1 distance recruit in the 2025 class, Sadie Englehardt.

https://instagr.am/p/C4Eq-9OLZH4

Quote:

---

BREAKING: Sadie Engelhardt (2025) of Ventura HS (CA) has committed to NC State University!

Sadie is regarded as the #1 distance women's prospect for class of 2025

---

---

Just want to caution people that are more interested in XC than track that while she can and likely will be a very good XC runner, she is definitely stronger at this point at middle distance on the track. Her 1500/mile speed is her strength. And she's been clear in past interviews that she prefers track to XC.

Either way a huge recruit to land, just don't want people assuming she's going to be another Tuohy or Chmiel in XC where she's a top 20 all-american off the bat because of her ranking in her class. It may happen and i hope it does but i wouldn't be surprised if she is redshirted in XC her first year. So it may be fall 2026 before she makes an impact in xc.

Huge recruit. The baffling gap between our women and men's program only widens

jadawson said:

---

Just want to caution people that are more interested in XC than track that while she can and likely will be a very good XC runner, she is definitely stronger at this point at middle distance on the track. Her 1500/mile speed is her strength. And she's been clear in past interviews that she prefers track to XC.

Either way a huge recruit to land, just don't want people assuming she's going to be another Tuohy or Chmiel in XC where she's a top 20 all-american off the bat because of her ranking in her class. It may happen and i hope it does but i wouldn't be surprised if she is redshirted in XC her first year. So it may be fall 2026 before she makes an impact in xc.

---

I looked up and saw she "only" finished 26th at 2023 Nike Cross Nationals in a time of 18:14. But she's also run a 16:39 5k in cross country, which is a very solid time. I know it's hard to compare times in cross country and that could have been on a "short" course. But like you said, it does appear she would have the ability to be an elite cross country runner as well, even if she likes the middle distances like the mile a little better.

NC State honors its back-to-back-to-back national champion women's cross country team on the court during the under-12 media timeout.

NC State honors its back-to-back-to-back national champion women's cross country team on the court during the under-12 media timeout.

— Inside Pack Sports (@InsidePackSport) March 5, 2024

The champs are in the house🏆🐺 pic.twitter.com/2Sj8BvHmY6

— Pack Track & Field and Cross Country (@Wolfpack_TFXC) March 5, 2024

Nairo said:

---

Huge recruit. The baffling gap between our women and men's program only widens

---

While I understand your point about the gap between the two programs, the gap is the result of lackluster recruiting classes in recent years. In 2024, the men's team took a step towards closing that gap with the 13th best recruiting class vs 8th best for the women. Hopefully, that trend can continue and the men's team can begin to occasionally bring in some deserving talent from the transfer portal.

jadawson said:

---

GuerrillaPack said:

---

Just saw this in the IG feed.

We picked up the #1 distance recruit in the 2025 class, Sadie Englehardt.

https://instagr.am/p/C4Eq-9OLZH4

Quote:

---

BREAKING: Sadie Engelhardt (2025) of Ventura HS (CA) has committed to NC State University!

Sadie is regarded as the #1 distance women's prospect for class of 2025

---

---

Just want to caution people that are more interested in XC than track that while she can and likely will be a very good XC runner, she is definitely stronger at this point at middle distance on the track. Her 1500/mile speed is her strength. And she's been clear in past interviews that she prefers track to XC.

Either way a huge recruit to land, just don't want people assuming she's going to be another Tuohy or Chmiel in XC where she's a top 20 all-american off the bat because of her ranking in her class. It may happen and i hope it does but i wouldn't be surprised if she is redshirted in XC her first year. So it may be fall 2026 before she makes an impact in xc.

---

I agree with this wholeheartedly. On paper, Engelhardt is no Tuohy or Chmiel and a dose of caution is prudent when we are talking about the futures of 17-20 year old kids.

That said, Henes is clearly cooking up something special for 2025-2028, with the last minute addition of Stephens last summer, Michalak, Martinez and Preisano this summer and Jazwinski and Engelhardt next summer.

If we don't pull some late magic out of a hat (spring portal and/or late add to the roster), we are going to see a dip during the 2024 XC season, but the future is bright, very bright. I continue to remain hopeful regarding some additional good news this Spring for the 2024 season.

COrockclimber said:

---

I agree with this wholeheartedly. On paper, Engelhardt is no Tuohy or Chmiel and a dose of caution is prudent when we are talking about the futures of 17-20 year old kids.

That said, Henes is clearly cooking up something special for 2025-2028, with the last minute addition of Stephens last summer, Michalak, Martinez and Preisano this summer and Jazwinski and Engelhardt next summer.

If we don't pull some late magic out of a hat (spring portal and/or late add to the roster), we are going to see a dip during the 2024 XC season, but the future is bright, very bright. I continue to remain hopeful regarding some additional good news this Spring for the 2024 season.

---

As I mentioned above on this page of the thread, I think that our team for fall 2024 will be a top 4 team in the nation. Maybe I'm being overly optimistic, but if everyone is healthy I could see a top 5 of Stephens, F. Smith, Michalak, Hartman and Loveys finishing around 15/20/25/35/40 and scoring around 105 points at nationals....and Rauber and Gapes with solid depth and finishing around 40-50.

Obviously, as of now it appears that NAU will be very strong and probably considered the favorite by most. But I think if we're healthy, we'll be right there with them. And I've not followed any other teams and their current or projected rosters, but I think Alabama will probably be top 4, with Lemngole and Olemomoi coming back and I think I saw they have another Kenyan coming in next year. Of course, there are always injuries which could change things in a significant way. So if we really want to contend for the title, we probably need to bring in at least one more true low stick, top 15 runner.

COrockclimber said:

---

jadawson said:

---

GuerrillaPack said:

---

Just saw this in the IG feed.

We picked up the #1 distance recruit in the 2025 class, Sadie Englehardt.

https://instagr.am/p/C4Eq-9OLZH4

Quote:

---

BREAKING: Sadie Engelhardt (2025) of Ventura HS (CA) has committed to NC State University!

Sadie is regarded as the #1 distance women's prospect for class of 2025

---

---

Just want to caution people that are more interested in XC than track that while she can and likely will be a very good XC runner, she is definitely stronger at this point at middle distance on the track. Her 1500/mile speed is her strength. And she's been clear in past interviews that she prefers track to XC.

Either way a huge recruit to land, just don't want people assuming she's going to be another Tuohy or Chmiel in XC where she's a top 20 all-american off the bat because of her ranking in her class. It may happen and i hope it does but i wouldn't be surprised if she is redshirted in XC her first year. So it may be fall 2026 before she makes an impact in xc.

---

I agree with this wholeheartedly. On paper, Engelhardt is no Tuohy or Chmiel and a dose of caution is prudent when we are talking about the futures of 17-20 year old kids.

That said, Henes is clearly cooking up something special for 2025-2028, with the last minute addition of Stephens last summer, Michalak, Martinez and Preisano this summer and Jazwinski and Engelhardt next summer.

If we don't pull some late magic out of a hat (spring portal and/or late add to the roster), we are going to see a dip during the 2024 XC season, but the future is bright, very bright. I continue to remain hopeful regarding some additional good news this Spring for the 2024 season.

---

If we hang on to a podium finish (which i think we are certainly capable of if the cards fall right) that would be an incredible achievement. The last time someone won 3 straight womens XC titles was Stanford, and in that 4th year they finished 8th. Sustaining a "good" program is one thing, sustaining a contending program is something else entirely. If Henes can hold everything together around 3rd-4th this year and then get us right back to contention in 2025 that would be incredible.

But as far as Engelhardt is concerned my biggest excitement is that:

1) we seem to be focusing a lot more on bringing in middle distance talents that also happen to be good at XC the last few cycles which can only be a good thing for our track program. Outside of Tuohy just being a freak and good at every event and the occasional Nevada Mareno success when she was healthy, we haven't really been very good at the 800 and 1500/mile in recent years. I'd love to see that change.

And 2) Grace Hartman, Leah Stephens, Angelina Napoleon, Kate Putman, Bethany Michalak, Sadie Engelhardt has the makings of an elite DMR in 2025-26. Every one i just listed has either run a 2:05 or faster 800 or a 4:36 or faster mile other than Leah Stephens, and i'm thinking thats just a matter of time for her considering how good she was in XC. Just need to find a 400 runner to pair with them and that's a title contender. Putman was serviceable there this year but she'll always give up a few seconds to the elite program's 400 runners. Jordyn Parker had run a ~56 400 in high school, but she seemed to focus on shorter sprints this indoor season.

Abby Loveys is confirmed to have entered the transfer portal. Really emphasizes the need to hit the portal ourselves.

Also Zach Hughes from the men's team has entered the portal.

Sadie Engelhardt talked about her race (she won) at the New Balance Indoor Nationals this past weekend as well as her decision to commit to NC State. Good interview. Talked about the usual stuff but also specifically about how Coach Henes handled Tuohy and helped her deal with the immense pressure on her. Engelhardt isn't Tuohy in that regard, but she has been a big name in youth running since her 8th grade year with her Mile exploits and will definitely face pressure in her transition to the NCAA so her looking at that makes a lot of sense.

Interview

Engelhardt is racing a 1500 against the pros tonight, on Flotrack. https://www.flotrack.org/articles/12300549-here-are-full-entries-for-sound-runnings-the-ten

4:09.70 for Engelhardt won her heat. That would have qualified for Nationals and might have placed last year. Tuohy's best in hs was 4:14.5 I think - but as a sophomore while Engelhardt is a junior.

Fiona Smith ran a 32:57 in the 10k at the Stanford Invitational a few days ago, which sets a new PR for her in that event, lowering her PR by about 8 seconds. This new PR is only only 11 seconds slower than Kelsey Chmiel's PR in the 10k (32:46), for reference.

Seems like Smith is continuing to make great improvements as her collegiate career goes forward. Hopeful that this continues once she joins the Wolfpack. If so, looks like she could definitely be an AA in cross country next year, maybe finishing in the 20-30 range.

Wow! That's great news!