Cthepack said:

---

pineknollshoresking said:

---

Civilized said:

---

Mormad said:

---

Sorry, what was the known mental disorder of the murderer here?

---

I don't know if it's been published specifically but the sheriff was quoted as saying the shooter was known to them and they knew he "had some issues" or something vague like that.

His family also knew he'd been recently amassing guns and they were worried about it.

As always, with mental health stuff a huge part of the challenge is convincing those in crisis that they actually need help, and also get them to accept help.

When your leg is broken, there's no denying it. With mental health disorders, getting the patient diagnosed and consistently treated is a huge hurdle.

---

So.... what do we do?

---

You should start by going to a mental health focused message board and get caught up all the issues instead of continuing to ask people on a sports focused message board what we should do about mental health.

---

Perhaps you should tell everyone here that's calls on mental health funding to do the same. Obviously, you weren't getting what I was doing. Most (liberals, that is) call for more this, more that... they never know how to implement these request. Taking peoples hard earned living and spending it on every whim is challenging to me. Don't you think we do enough of that already?

Once again the lefties are full of ideas and zero solutions. They will throw money at whimsical ideas that have no solutions.

How many solutions have we seen from them? NONE.

Just rhetoric, spin and "we need to do something..."

What is that something?

pineknollshoresking said:

---

Cthepack said:

---

pineknollshoresking said:

---

Civilized said:

---

Mormad said:

---

Sorry, what was the known mental disorder of the murderer here?

---

I don't know if it's been published specifically but the sheriff was quoted as saying the shooter was known to them and they knew he "had some issues" or something vague like that.

His family also knew he'd been recently amassing guns and they were worried about it.

As always, with mental health stuff a huge part of the challenge is convincing those in crisis that they actually need help, and also get them to accept help.

When your leg is broken, there's no denying it. With mental health disorders, getting the patient diagnosed and consistently treated is a huge hurdle.

---

So.... what do we do?

---

You should start by going to a mental health focused message board and get caught up all the issues instead of continuing to ask people on a sports focused message board what we should do about mental health.

---

Perhaps you should tell everyone here that's calls on mental health funding to do the same. Obviously, you weren't getting what I was doing. Most (liberals, that is) call for more this, more that... they never know how to implement these request. Taking peoples hard earned living and spending it on every whim is challenging to me. Don't you think we do enough of that already?

---

I totally agree we do enough of that. But quite honestly what you are doing is insulting to those of us that have had to deal with the current system. So educate yourself!

What's your solution?

LOL.... once again zero substance to anything you posted just more spin and rhetoric.

Why don't you say the quiet part out loud and just say you want government run health care. Physical and mental.

Dancing around like a cat on a hot tin roof is laughable even for you. Keep dancing..... it's quite comical.

Trying to hide the fact that you and your party are SOCIALISTS isn't a secret by the way. It's obvious.

pineknollshoresking said:

---

Cthepack said:

---

pineknollshoresking said:

---

Civilized said:

---

Mormad said:

---

Sorry, what was the known mental disorder of the murderer here?

---

I don't know if it's been published specifically but the sheriff was quoted as saying the shooter was known to them and they knew he "had some issues" or something vague like that.

His family also knew he'd been recently amassing guns and they were worried about it.

As always, with mental health stuff a huge part of the challenge is convincing those in crisis that they actually need help, and also get them to accept help.

When your leg is broken, there's no denying it. With mental health disorders, getting the patient diagnosed and consistently treated is a huge hurdle.

---

So.... what do we do?

---

You should start by going to a mental health focused message board and get caught up all the issues instead of continuing to ask people on a sports focused message board what we should do about mental health.

---

Perhaps you should tell everyone here that's calls on mental health funding to do the same. Obviously, you weren't getting what I was doing. Most (liberals, that is) call for more this, more that... they never know how to implement these request. Taking peoples hard earned living and spending it on every whim is challenging to me. Don't you think we do enough of that already?

---

As a society we pay for social ills one way or another.

I think it's a big mistake to think of the two camps as either "the government pays/fixes x" or "we get to keep our money in our pocket and maybe the private enterprise works efficiently to provide x".

Another clear outcome is "we understand problem x better so we reallocate existing resources or change existing systems so that we achieve a better solution for the same cost". I think this outcome is especially compelling when all the true economic costs of inaction or keeping the status quo are included in the analysis.

What is the true societal economic cost of a health care system that necessitates the uninsured visiting emergency rooms for every medical need?

Of treating and medicating symptoms instead of underlying causes?

Of high levels of untreated or under-treated chronic depression and anxiety, and bipolarism?

Of under-employed and over-incarcerated black males?

Of female wage gaps?

Of poverty-borne stresses?

I think it's clarifying and motivating to view these and many other issues not through left/right or even worse woke/not woke lenses but through the lens of economic cost. How negatively do they impact productivity and economic growth, and therefore how much is it prudent for us to 'spend' as a society to try to engineer their improvement?

Civilized said:

---

pineknollshoresking said:

---

Cthepack said:

---

pineknollshoresking said:

---

Civilized said:

---

Mormad said:

---

Sorry, what was the known mental disorder of the murderer here?

---

I don't know if it's been published specifically but the sheriff was quoted as saying the shooter was known to them and they knew he "had some issues" or something vague like that.

His family also knew he'd been recently amassing guns and they were worried about it.

As always, with mental health stuff a huge part of the challenge is convincing those in crisis that they actually need help, and also get them to accept help.

When your leg is broken, there's no denying it. With mental health disorders, getting the patient diagnosed and consistently treated is a huge hurdle.

---

So.... what do we do?

---

You should start by going to a mental health focused message board and get caught up all the issues instead of continuing to ask people on a sports focused message board what we should do about mental health.

---

Perhaps you should tell everyone here that's calls on mental health funding to do the same. Obviously, you weren't getting what I was doing. Most (liberals, that is) call for more this, more that... they never know how to implement these request. Taking peoples hard earned living and spending it on every whim is challenging to me. Don't you think we do enough of that already?

---

As a society we pay for social ills one way or another.

I think it's a big mistake to think of the two camps as either "the government pays/fixes x" or "we get to keep our money in our pocket and maybe the private enterprise works efficiently to provide x".

Another clear outcome is "we understand problem x better so we reallocate existing resources or change existing systems so that we achieve a better solution for the same cost". I think this outcome is especially compelling when all the true economic costs of inaction or keeping the status quo are included in the analysis.

What is the true societal economic cost of a health care system that necessitates the uninsured visiting emergency rooms for every medical need?

Of treating and medicating symptoms instead of underlying causes?

Of high levels of untreated or under-treated chronic depression and anxiety, and bipolarism?

Of under-employed and over-incarcerated black males?

Of female wage gaps?

Of poverty-borne stresses?

I think it's clarifying and motivating to view these and many other issues not through left/right or even worse woke/not woke lenses but through the lens of economic cost. How negatively do they impact productivity and economic growth, and therefore how much is it prudent for us to 'spend' as a society to try to engineer their improvement?

---

Of course you don't want that viewed as left/right post. It is entirely leftist talking points. But if you're truly trying to look at it non partisan, it doesn't affect economic growth and productivity at all. Status quo it is.

packgrad said:

---

Civilized said:

---

pineknollshoresking said:

---

Cthepack said:

---

pineknollshoresking said:

---

Civilized said:

---

Mormad said:

---

Sorry, what was the known mental disorder of the murderer here?

---

I don't know if it's been published specifically but the sheriff was quoted as saying the shooter was known to them and they knew he "had some issues" or something vague like that.

His family also knew he'd been recently amassing guns and they were worried about it.

As always, with mental health stuff a huge part of the challenge is convincing those in crisis that they actually need help, and also get them to accept help.

When your leg is broken, there's no denying it. With mental health disorders, getting the patient diagnosed and consistently treated is a huge hurdle.

---

So.... what do we do?

---

You should start by going to a mental health focused message board and get caught up all the issues instead of continuing to ask people on a sports focused message board what we should do about mental health.

---

Perhaps you should tell everyone here that's calls on mental health funding to do the same. Obviously, you weren't getting what I was doing. Most (liberals, that is) call for more this, more that... they never know how to implement these request. Taking peoples hard earned living and spending it on every whim is challenging to me. Don't you think we do enough of that already?

---

As a society we pay for social ills one way or another.

I think it's a big mistake to think of the two camps as either "the government pays/fixes x" or "we get to keep our money in our pocket and maybe the private enterprise works efficiently to provide x".

Another clear outcome is "we understand problem x better so we reallocate existing resources or change existing systems so that we achieve a better solution for the same cost". I think this outcome is especially compelling when all the true economic costs of inaction or keeping the status quo are included in the analysis.

What is the true societal economic cost of a health care system that necessitates the uninsured visiting emergency rooms for every medical need?

Of treating and medicating symptoms instead of underlying causes?

Of high levels of untreated or under-treated chronic depression and anxiety, and bipolarism?

Of under-employed and over-incarcerated black males?

Of female wage gaps?

Of poverty-borne stresses?

I think it's clarifying and motivating to view these and many other issues not through left/right or even worse woke/not woke lenses but through the lens of economic cost. How negatively do they impact productivity and economic growth, and therefore how much is it prudent for us to 'spend' as a society to try to engineer their improvement?

---

Of course you don't want that viewed as left/right post. It is entirely leftist talking points. But if you're truly trying to look at it non partisan, it doesn't affect economic growth and productivity at all. Status quo it is.

---

What doesn't effect economic growth?

Civilized said:

---

pineknollshoresking said:

---

Cthepack said:

---

pineknollshoresking said:

---

Civilized said:

---

Mormad said:

---

Sorry, what was the known mental disorder of the murderer here?

---

I don't know if it's been published specifically but the sheriff was quoted as saying the shooter was known to them and they knew he "had some issues" or something vague like that.

His family also knew he'd been recently amassing guns and they were worried about it.

As always, with mental health stuff a huge part of the challenge is convincing those in crisis that they actually need help, and also get them to accept help.

When your leg is broken, there's no denying it. With mental health disorders, getting the patient diagnosed and consistently treated is a huge hurdle.

---

So.... what do we do?

---

You should start by going to a mental health focused message board and get caught up all the issues instead of continuing to ask people on a sports focused message board what we should do about mental health.

---

Perhaps you should tell everyone here that's calls on mental health funding to do the same. Obviously, you weren't getting what I was doing. Most (liberals, that is) call for more this, more that... they never know how to implement these request. Taking peoples hard earned living and spending it on every whim is challenging to me. Don't you think we do enough of that already?

---

As a society we pay for social ills one way or another.

I think it's a big mistake to think of the two camps as either "the government pays/fixes x" or "we get to keep our money in our pocket and maybe the private enterprise works efficiently to provide x".

Another clear outcome is "we understand problem x better so we reallocate existing resources or change existing systems so that we achieve a better solution for the same cost". I think this outcome is especially compelling when all the true economic costs of inaction or keeping the status quo are included in the analysis.

What is the true societal economic cost of a health care system that necessitates the uninsured visiting emergency rooms for every medical need?

Of treating and medicating symptoms instead of underlying causes?

Of high levels of untreated or under-treated chronic depression and anxiety, and bipolarism?

Of under-employed and over-incarcerated black males?

Of female wage gaps?

Of poverty-borne stresses?

I think it's clarifying and motivating to view these and many other issues not through left/right or even worse woke/not woke lenses but through the lens of economic cost. How negatively do they impact productivity and economic growth, and therefore how much is it prudent for us to 'spend' as a society to try to engineer their improvement?

---

Wow....you caught up on your CNN/MSNBC talking points.

SOCIALISM with hints of COMMUNISM. Way to go comrade. You earned your hammer and sickle in one post.!

Dear Leader would be proud of you.

No where in your post did you mention personal responsibility or working hard. Why is that? I think we all know the answer.

Typical lefty elitist..... anyone that disagrees with party talking points is an uneducated rube.

Again, sometimes they get caught up and say the quiet part out loud.

pineknollshoresking said:

---

Cthepack said:

---

pineknollshoresking said:

---

Cthepack said:

---

pineknollshoresking said:

---

Civilized said:

---

Mormad said:

---

Sorry, what was the known mental disorder of the murderer here?

---

I don't know if it's been published specifically but the sheriff was quoted as saying the shooter was known to them and they knew he "had some issues" or something vague like that.

His family also knew he'd been recently amassing guns and they were worried about it.

As always, with mental health stuff a huge part of the challenge is convincing those in crisis that they actually need help, and also get them to accept help.

When your leg is broken, there's no denying it. With mental health disorders, getting the patient diagnosed and consistently treated is a huge hurdle.

---

So.... what do we do?

---

You should start by going to a mental health focused message board and get caught up all the issues instead of continuing to ask people on a sports focused message board what we should do about mental health.

---

Perhaps you should tell everyone here that's calls on mental health funding to do the same. Obviously, you weren't getting what I was doing. Most (liberals, that is) call for more this, more that... they never know how to implement these request. Taking peoples hard earned living and spending it on every whim is challenging to me. Don't you think we do enough of that already?

---

I totally agree we do enough of that. But quite honestly what you are doing is insulting to those of us that have had to deal with the current system. So educate yourself!

---

The assumption is that I'm not educated!!!! I gave an example of a family member that I had to deal with, including the system. I suggest you calm down and quit poor tone!!!

---

So if educated what should we do to at least get mental health treatment to the level of treatment you would do if you broke your leg?

Cthepack said:

---

pineknollshoresking said:

---

Cthepack said:

---

pineknollshoresking said:

---

Cthepack said:

---

pineknollshoresking said:

---

Civilized said:

---

Mormad said:

---

Sorry, what was the known mental disorder of the murderer here?

---

I don't know if it's been published specifically but the sheriff was quoted as saying the shooter was known to them and they knew he "had some issues" or something vague like that.

His family also knew he'd been recently amassing guns and they were worried about it.

As always, with mental health stuff a huge part of the challenge is convincing those in crisis that they actually need help, and also get them to accept help.

When your leg is broken, there's no denying it. With mental health disorders, getting the patient diagnosed and consistently treated is a huge hurdle.

---

So.... what do we do?

---

You should start by going to a mental health focused message board and get caught up all the issues instead of continuing to ask people on a sports focused message board what we should do about mental health.

---

Perhaps you should tell everyone here that's calls on mental health funding to do the same. Obviously, you weren't getting what I was doing. Most (liberals, that is) call for more this, more that... they never know how to implement these request. Taking peoples hard earned living and spending it on every whim is challenging to me. Don't you think we do enough of that already?

---

I totally agree we do enough of that. But quite honestly what you are doing is insulting to those of us that have had to deal with the current system. So educate yourself!

---

The assumption is that I'm not educated!!!! I gave an example of a family member that I had to deal with, including the system. I suggest you calm down and quit poor tone!!!

---

So if educated what should we do to at least get mental health treatment to the level of treatment you would do if you broke your leg?

---

Impossible. Half the crazy people don't know they're crazy. Everybody with a broken leg knows they have a broken leg.

packgrad said:

---

Cthepack said:

---

pineknollshoresking said:

---

Cthepack said:

---

pineknollshoresking said:

---

Cthepack said:

---

pineknollshoresking said:

---

Civilized said:

---

Mormad said:

---

Sorry, what was the known mental disorder of the murderer here?

---

I don't know if it's been published specifically but the sheriff was quoted as saying the shooter was known to them and they knew he "had some issues" or something vague like that.

His family also knew he'd been recently amassing guns and they were worried about it.

As always, with mental health stuff a huge part of the challenge is convincing those in crisis that they actually need help, and also get them to accept help.

When your leg is broken, there's no denying it. With mental health disorders, getting the patient diagnosed and consistently treated is a huge hurdle.

---

So.... what do we do?

---

You should start by going to a mental health focused message board and get caught up all the issues instead of continuing to ask people on a sports focused message board what we should do about mental health.

---

Perhaps you should tell everyone here that's calls on mental health funding to do the same. Obviously, you weren't getting what I was doing. Most (liberals, that is) call for more this, more that... they never know how to implement these request. Taking peoples hard earned living and spending it on every whim is challenging to me. Don't you think we do enough of that already?

---

I totally agree we do enough of that. But quite honestly what you are doing is insulting to those of us that have had to deal with the current system. So educate yourself!

---

The assumption is that I'm not educated!!!! I gave an example of a family member that I had to deal with, including the system. I suggest you calm down and quit poor tone!!!

---

So if educated what should we do to at least get mental health treatment to the level of treatment you would do if you broke your leg?

---

Impossible. Half the crazy people don't know they're crazy. Everybody with a broken leg knows they have a broken leg.

---

Not the problem. Mental health treatment is so inconsistent. Both in level of care and how to treat people with the same mental issue. There is not much inconsistency on how to treat the same broken leg.

Cthepack said:

---

packgrad said:

---

Cthepack said:

---

pineknollshoresking said:

---

Cthepack said:

---

pineknollshoresking said:

---

Cthepack said:

---

pineknollshoresking said:

---

Civilized said:

---

Mormad said:

---

Sorry, what was the known mental disorder of the murderer here?

---

I don't know if it's been published specifically but the sheriff was quoted as saying the shooter was known to them and they knew he "had some issues" or something vague like that.

His family also knew he'd been recently amassing guns and they were worried about it.

As always, with mental health stuff a huge part of the challenge is convincing those in crisis that they actually need help, and also get them to accept help.

When your leg is broken, there's no denying it. With mental health disorders, getting the patient diagnosed and consistently treated is a huge hurdle.

---

So.... what do we do?

---

You should start by going to a mental health focused message board and get caught up all the issues instead of continuing to ask people on a sports focused message board what we should do about mental health.

---

Perhaps you should tell everyone here that's calls on mental health funding to do the same. Obviously, you weren't getting what I was doing. Most (liberals, that is) call for more this, more that... they never know how to implement these request. Taking peoples hard earned living and spending it on every whim is challenging to me. Don't you think we do enough of that already?

---

I totally agree we do enough of that. But quite honestly what you are doing is insulting to those of us that have had to deal with the current system. So educate yourself!

---

The assumption is that I'm not educated!!!! I gave an example of a family member that I had to deal with, including the system. I suggest you calm down and quit poor tone!!!

---

So if educated what should we do to at least get mental health treatment to the level of treatment you would do if you broke your leg?

---

Impossible. Half the crazy people don't know they're crazy. Everybody with a broken leg knows they have a broken leg.

---

Not the problem. Mental health treatment is so inconsistent. Both in level of care and how to treat people with the same mental issue. There is not much inconsistency on how to treat the same broken leg.

---

Wow... your obfuscation of this wreaks of left wing indoctrination. In no way are the two remotely similar. One is subjective and the other is objective.

You know why there is so much inconsistency? Because it is SUBJECTIVE. Five doctors could diagnose the same person with the same issues and come up with five different outcomes. A broken leg like you said is a broken leg.

You should rely on your institutions of higher learning that claim to be the ivory towers of education and ask them to fix the problem rather than wanting the government to just throw more money into a failed system with overpaid quacks who for decades did nothing but take pharma money and drug the hell out of this country.

The problem starts with the so-called doctors, administrators and pharmaceutical companies. Not the taxpaying citizens. Start there.

BBW12OG said:

---

Cthepack said:

---

packgrad said:

---

Cthepack said:

---

pineknollshoresking said:

---

Cthepack said:

---

pineknollshoresking said:

---

Cthepack said:

---

pineknollshoresking said:

---

Civilized said:

---

Mormad said:

---

Sorry, what was the known mental disorder of the murderer here?

---

I don't know if it's been published specifically but the sheriff was quoted as saying the shooter was known to them and they knew he "had some issues" or something vague like that.

His family also knew he'd been recently amassing guns and they were worried about it.

As always, with mental health stuff a huge part of the challenge is convincing those in crisis that they actually need help, and also get them to accept help.

When your leg is broken, there's no denying it. With mental health disorders, getting the patient diagnosed and consistently treated is a huge hurdle.

---

So.... what do we do?

---

You should start by going to a mental health focused message board and get caught up all the issues instead of continuing to ask people on a sports focused message board what we should do about mental health.

---

Perhaps you should tell everyone here that's calls on mental health funding to do the same. Obviously, you weren't getting what I was doing. Most (liberals, that is) call for more this, more that... they never know how to implement these request. Taking peoples hard earned living and spending it on every whim is challenging to me. Don't you think we do enough of that already?

---

I totally agree we do enough of that. But quite honestly what you are doing is insulting to those of us that have had to deal with the current system. So educate yourself!

---

The assumption is that I'm not educated!!!! I gave an example of a family member that I had to deal with, including the system. I suggest you calm down and quit poor tone!!!

---

So if educated what should we do to at least get mental health treatment to the level of treatment you would do if you broke your leg?

---

Impossible. Half the crazy people don't know they're crazy. Everybody with a broken leg knows they have a broken leg.

---

Not the problem. Mental health treatment is so inconsistent. Both in level of care and how to treat people with the same mental issue. There is not much inconsistency on how to treat the same broken leg.

---

Wow... your obfuscation of this wreaks of left wing indoctrination. In no way are the two remotely similar. One is subjective and the other is objective.

You know why there is so much inconsistency? Because it is SUBJECTIVE. Five doctors could diagnose the same person with the same issues and come up with five different outcomes. A broken leg like you said is a broken leg.

You should rely on your institutions of higher learning that claim to be the ivory towers of education and ask them to fix the problem rather than wanting the government to just throw more money into a failed system with overpaid quacks who for decades did nothing but take pharma money and drug the hell out of this country.

The problem starts with the so-called doctors, administrators and pharmaceutical companies. Not the taxpaying citizens. Start there.

---

So does mental health have to be subjective? At one time how you would treat a broken leg was subjective.

Cthepack said:

---

BBW12OG said:

---

Cthepack said:

---

packgrad said:

---

Cthepack said:

---

pineknollshoresking said:

---

Cthepack said:

---

pineknollshoresking said:

---

Cthepack said:

---

pineknollshoresking said:

---

Civilized said:

---

Mormad said:

---

Sorry, what was the known mental disorder of the murderer here?

---

I don't know if it's been published specifically but the sheriff was quoted as saying the shooter was known to them and they knew he "had some issues" or something vague like that.

His family also knew he'd been recently amassing guns and they were worried about it.

As always, with mental health stuff a huge part of the challenge is convincing those in crisis that they actually need help, and also get them to accept help.

When your leg is broken, there's no denying it. With mental health disorders, getting the patient diagnosed and consistently treated is a huge hurdle.

---

So.... what do we do?

---

You should start by going to a mental health focused message board and get caught up all the issues instead of continuing to ask people on a sports focused message board what we should do about mental health.

---

Perhaps you should tell everyone here that's calls on mental health funding to do the same. Obviously, you weren't getting what I was doing. Most (liberals, that is) call for more this, more that... they never know how to implement these request. Taking peoples hard earned living and spending it on every whim is challenging to me. Don't you think we do enough of that already?

---

I totally agree we do enough of that. But quite honestly what you are doing is insulting to those of us that have had to deal with the current system. So educate yourself!

---

The assumption is that I'm not educated!!!! I gave an example of a family member that I had to deal with, including the system. I suggest you calm down and quit poor tone!!!

---

So if educated what should we do to at least get mental health treatment to the level of treatment you would do if you broke your leg?

---

Impossible. Half the crazy people don't know they're crazy. Everybody with a broken leg knows they have a broken leg.

---

Not the problem. Mental health treatment is so inconsistent. Both in level of care and how to treat people with the same mental issue. There is not much inconsistency on how to treat the same broken leg.

---

Wow... your obfuscation of this wreaks of left wing indoctrination. In no way are the two remotely similar. One is subjective and the other is objective.

You know why there is so much inconsistency? Because it is SUBJECTIVE. Five doctors could diagnose the same person with the same issues and come up with five different outcomes. A broken leg like you said is a broken leg.

You should rely on your institutions of higher learning that claim to be the ivory towers of education and ask them to fix the problem rather than wanting the government to just throw more money into a failed system with overpaid quacks who for decades did nothing but take pharma money and drug the hell out of this country.

The problem starts with the so-called doctors, administrators and pharmaceutical companies. Not the taxpaying citizens. Start there.

---

So does mental health have to be subjective? At one time how you would treat a broken leg was subjective.

---

Parts, not all of mental health are completely subjective whether the lefties want to admit it or not.

Case in point.... why is "anxiety" considered an affliction by some but not all mental health professionals? Why do some doctors prescribe powerful meds and some do not?

https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/anxiety/symptoms-causes/syc-20350961

https://www.nami.org/About-Mental-Illness/Mental-Health-Conditions/Anxiety-Disorders

https://adaa.org/understanding-anxiety

Now here are three different organizations and all three agree to an extent but not completely.

Guess what an X-Ray doctor would say about a broken leg? You can't make that type of comparison because it is apples to oranges. Like I said, one is objective and one is subjective.

I told you that parts of mental health are objective.

The parts that are subjective allow those who don't want to work an easy outlet to claim disability and feed off the government.

You can spin it all you want but I have provided you with facts to back up my statements. And I haven't even mentioned the fact that the SOCIALIST PARTY is all in on making sure as many people are "treated" and given the "help they need" in order to get by cost be damned and legitimacy of their claims be damned.

The entire mental health system from the colleges up needs to be dismantled, defunded and started over completely from scratch. Get some of your lefty buddies to buy into revamping a snake oil system and maybe real changes will take place.

Until then sitting around talking about how you have to pop 10 pills a day because "anxiety" is a lazy person's way of dealing with life. Sad that there are actually doctors that support this type of medically induced living.

They used to run those folks out of town when they had the "cure all" answers to everything that ails you in one single bottle.

BBW12OG said:

---

Cthepack said:

---

BBW12OG said:

---

Cthepack said:

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packgrad said:

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Cthepack said:

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pineknollshoresking said:

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Cthepack said:

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pineknollshoresking said:

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Cthepack said:

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pineknollshoresking said:

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Civilized said:

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Mormad said:

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Sorry, what was the known mental disorder of the murderer here?

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I don't know if it's been published specifically but the sheriff was quoted as saying the shooter was known to them and they knew he "had some issues" or something vague like that.

His family also knew he'd been recently amassing guns and they were worried about it.

As always, with mental health stuff a huge part of the challenge is convincing those in crisis that they actually need help, and also get them to accept help.

When your leg is broken, there's no denying it. With mental health disorders, getting the patient diagnosed and consistently treated is a huge hurdle.

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So.... what do we do?

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You should start by going to a mental health focused message board and get caught up all the issues instead of continuing to ask people on a sports focused message board what we should do about mental health.

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Perhaps you should tell everyone here that's calls on mental health funding to do the same. Obviously, you weren't getting what I was doing. Most (liberals, that is) call for more this, more that... they never know how to implement these request. Taking peoples hard earned living and spending it on every whim is challenging to me. Don't you think we do enough of that already?

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I totally agree we do enough of that. But quite honestly what you are doing is insulting to those of us that have had to deal with the current system. So educate yourself!

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The assumption is that I'm not educated!!!! I gave an example of a family member that I had to deal with, including the system. I suggest you calm down and quit poor tone!!!

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So if educated what should we do to at least get mental health treatment to the level of treatment you would do if you broke your leg?

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Impossible. Half the crazy people don't know they're crazy. Everybody with a broken leg knows they have a broken leg.

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Not the problem. Mental health treatment is so inconsistent. Both in level of care and how to treat people with the same mental issue. There is not much inconsistency on how to treat the same broken leg.

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Wow... your obfuscation of this wreaks of left wing indoctrination. In no way are the two remotely similar. One is subjective and the other is objective.

You know why there is so much inconsistency? Because it is SUBJECTIVE. Five doctors could diagnose the same person with the same issues and come up with five different outcomes. A broken leg like you said is a broken leg.

You should rely on your institutions of higher learning that claim to be the ivory towers of education and ask them to fix the problem rather than wanting the government to just throw more money into a failed system with overpaid quacks who for decades did nothing but take pharma money and drug the hell out of this country.

The problem starts with the so-called doctors, administrators and pharmaceutical companies. Not the taxpaying citizens. Start there.

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So does mental health have to be subjective? At one time how you would treat a broken leg was subjective.

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Parts, not all of mental health are completely subjective whether the lefties want to admit it or not.

Case in point.... why is "anxiety" considered an affliction by some but not all mental health professionals? Why do some doctors prescribe powerful meds and some do not?

https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/anxiety/symptoms-causes/syc-20350961

https://www.nami.org/About-Mental-Illness/Mental-Health-Conditions/Anxiety-Disorders

https://adaa.org/understanding-anxiety

Now here are three different organizations and all three agree to an extent but not completely.

Guess what an X-Ray doctor would say about a broken leg? You can't make that type of comparison because it is apples to oranges. Like I said, one is objective and one is subjective.

I told you that parts of mental health are objective.

The parts that are subjective allow those who don't want to work an easy outlet to claim disability and feed off the government.

You can spin it all you want but I have provided you with facts to back up my statements. And I haven't even mentioned the fact that the SOCIALIST PARTY is all in on making sure as many people are "treated" and given the "help they need" in order to get by cost be damned and legitimacy of their claims be damned.

The entire mental health system from the colleges up needs to be dismantled, defunded and started over completely from scratch. Get some of your lefty buddies to buy into revamping a snake oil system and maybe real changes will take place.

Until then sitting around talking about how you have to pop 10 pills a day because "anxiety" is a lazy person's way of dealing with life. Sad that there are actually doctors that support this type of medically induced living.

They used to run those folks out of town when they had the "cure all" answers to everything that ails you in one single bottle.

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Dude you just want to argue don't you. Point is make those subjective issues objective. It can be done! It has been done with things like broken legs. X-rays have not been around since the first broken leg.

And I am far far far from a lefty. Feel free to look at my posting history if you care to see where I stand. I have a dependent that I have had to work through the mental health systems for over 20 years. Both in the US and in other countries. The inconsistency is amazing.

How are you going to make a subjective issue objective when you can't get three of the most influential organizations to agree on simplistic issues that affect their profession?

A broke leg from one place is a broke leg at all three. You are failing to see the forest for the trees.

Until the entire system(s) are revamped you will have pill chasers and quack "Dr.s" handing out pills to whoever wants them.

But that would mean dismantling the college system that indoctrinates these people with leftist ideologies and you know damn well that's not happening anytime soon.

Again self accountability seems to the be crucifix that mortifies the left.

I'd love to see the stats on the number of people claiming disability and collecting for anxiety.

hokiewolf said:

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I'd love to see the stats on the number of people claiming disability and collecting for anxiety.

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Good question. I'm pretty sure that I don't know enough to answer that myself - and I don't want to automatically assume the worst in everybody in general... but are you thinking they will be relatively low or surprisingly higher than most of us would imagine?

Would be an interesting number to see though for sure.

hokiewolf said:

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I'd love to see the stats on the number of people claiming disability and collecting for anxiety.

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Wow.... you absolutely can't/won't do any of your own research. I guess being a SOCIALIST really has its' advantages when it comes to doing actual "work" am I right?

Before I posted the comments I did MY OWN research and didn't rely upon someone else to do the work for me. You should try that some times. It's really not that difficult.

Like I have said earlier you can find four or five different accredited sources and come up with as many different answers and statistics. The one thing they have in common is inconsistency.

The system is broken and is geared toward the pharmaceutical companies and lazy ass non-working sponges that have been told they "are sick" and "unable to work."

Bet they got a lot of those participation trophies like some on here.

https://adaa.org/understanding-anxiety/facts-statistics

https://www.disabilitysecrets.com/resources/survey-statistics-how-difficult-is-it-to-get-disability-for-mental-or-emotional-conditions.html

https://www.alllaw.com/articles/nolo/disability/determination-anxiety-disorders.html


And conveniently enough there are several "legal experts" also waiting to chat live with you when you read this garbage.

Many of the disorders listed for eligibility are as vague as OCD, mood disorders, social anxiety. The acceptance for these "disorders" for disability range from 37% to 88%.

There are over 20 accredited sites you can pull information from .

Next time you come at me with a challenge remember who sends you to shine your participation trophies.

hokiewolf said:

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You said you bring the facts Fam, I was just looking for you to bring the facts that prove there's this huge loophole in the social net that people are using to get free money from the government by claiming they have anxiety

Also, diagnosing every leg fracture and then treating them all the same is advocating for SOCIALIZED medicine. Way to go Hillary!

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Nice try junior. Not at all remotely close to what I said. Once again you are once again proven to be a troll.

A broken leg is objective. Mental health diagnoses are subjective. That's what the adults in the room were/are talking about.

Try to keep up. I know it's hard for you to do when grown ups are having a discussion.

I brought the facts, posted the links to numerous sources and all you did was comment like a juvenile and never addressed the topic.

Real classy. If nothing else you are consistently pwned and proven to be a less than worthy adversary.

TheStorm said:

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hokiewolf said:

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I'd love to see the stats on the number of people claiming disability and collecting for anxiety.

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Good question. I'm pretty sure that I don't know enough to answer that myself - and I don't want to automatically assume the worst in everybody in general... but are you thinking they will be relatively low or surprisingly higher than most of us would imagine?

Would be an interesting number to see though for sure.

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. I think the loophole that is claimed is "exploited" in such low amounts that the statistics probably don't exist.

hokiewolf said:

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BBW12OG said:

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hokiewolf said:

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You said you bring the facts Fam, I was just looking for you to bring the facts that prove there's this huge loophole in the social net that people are using to get free money from the government by claiming they have anxiety

Also, diagnosing every leg fracture and then treating them all the same is advocating for SOCIALIZED medicine. Way to go Hillary!

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Nice try junior. Not at all remotely close to what I said. Once again you are once again proven to be a troll.

A broken leg is objective. Mental health diagnoses are subjective. That's what the adults in the room were/are talking about.

Try to keep up. I know it's hard for you to do when grown ups are having a discussion.

I brought the facts, posted the links to numerous sources and all you did was comment like a juvenile and never addressed the topic.

Real classy. If nothing else you are consistently pwned and proven to be a less than worthy adversary.

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. Sure whatever you say Hillary. Notice you didn't respond to the Neurosurgeon. Probably because you don't think you can bully him.

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What did I need to respond to? He basically said the same thing I did only using his experiences to try and support his argument. I support a few of his statements to a "T."

"Mental health disorders are just infinitely harder to manage because of the various barriers to care and the number of people with mixed disorders and a relative paucity of quacks willing and able to manage such difficult patients."

Same thing I have said in different words several times.

As far as it being simplistic I never said that the diagnoses of these people who have LEGITIMATE disorders is easy. I advocated for dismantling the entire system from the ground up from day one.

And yes I linked numerous sites that have supported my opinions that many able bodied Americans are on disability due to 100% laziness, medical professionals who benefit from pharmaceutical companies prescribing medications that they receive kickbacks, percentages of sales etc... to prescribe.

It's a never ending racket with no tangible solution in sight. Especially when you have one party clamoring that big government is that answer and that all health care should be run by the government.

There's his response. And I don't bully anyone. You are just a troll that needs to contribute to conversations as opposed to whining on a daily basis.

Mormad said:

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https://www.vzmessages.com/vl/50a7f8febdd5c6917d26f5f13254d98bcb7f97b8

Maybe a little humor? Diego goes to the quack.

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That's awesome..... and exactly how many interactions are exactly like that? I'd say quite a few.

I also agree with you and said as much that some mental health diagnoses are both objective and subjective.

And like you said, some Dr.s are quacks and could care less other than making that pharma money.

I have played golf with a group that includes a Dr., he's a plastic surgeon but still Dr., and he talks all the time about playing golf at #2, Torrey Pines, Beth Page those I remember off the top of my head. You know who sent him there? The pharma reps that visit his office on a regular basis.

They ain't sending him there because he subscribes OTC drugs.

BBW12OG said:

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Mormad said:

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https://www.vzmessages.com/vl/50a7f8febdd5c6917d26f5f13254d98bcb7f97b8

Maybe a little humor? Diego goes to the quack.

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That's awesome..... and exactly how many interactions are exactly like that? I'd say quite a few.

I also agree with you and said as much that some mental health diagnoses are both objective and subjective.

And like you said, some Dr.s are quacks and could care less other than making that pharma money.

I have played golf with a group that includes a Dr., he's a plastic surgeon but still Dr., and he talks all the time about playing golf at #2, Torrey Pines, Beth Page those I remember off the top of my head. You know who sent him there? The pharma reps that visit his office on a regular basis.

They ain't sending him there because he subscribes OTC drugs.

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Glad you found that funny! There are plenty of interactions like that, and plenty more with less truthfulness.

The pharma stuff is a different animal, and i can say more about that later. Like everything, there are legit and illegit aspects of that side of medicine. With the new rules, it seems it's much more legit now. It's all reported and recorded now, so that to me has cleaned it up to a degree.

Oh that's why I made sure that the fact was known the guy was Dr. Boobs.... as we call him. 90% of his job is implants, replacing implants, lifting saggy boobs or believe it or not, boob reductions.

But to address your point I agree that the "lower income" people seem to be the patients more often than not when it comes to mental illnesses.

I'm agreeing with both of you that it is an issue. I also pointed out the fact that while many need it many don't and take advantage of the system we currently have in place.

Not one time have I said that mental illness doesn't exist. It does. And with that type of illness it is a hell of a lot easier to "fake" than a broken leg. There may be many ways to diagnose, fix, repair a broken leg but at the end of the day to Common Man on the street it's a broken leg.

Now do the same with anxiety. You can't. Do the same with mood issues. You can't. Do the same with anger, depression, bipolar, manics etc.... You can't.

There is where the issue lies. The classifications are all over the place as I am sure the legit patients are as well.

The ones who take advantage of these gray areas account for a ton of strain on the government resources as many of these clinics I'm sure are government funded. I know for a fact several parents I come in contact with chew Xanax like chewing gum. I've heard them say as much. I also heard them reply to another parent that all you have to do is tell your Dr. that you have three kids and they are driving you crazy.

Is that how the mental health profession should work? Is it a "drugs on demand" type deal?

Not to mention when you get to the lower classes where work isn't exactly a part of everyday life when you see soccer moms getting pilled up why shouldn't you be able to?

And with that diagnosis many get put on disability and become part of the never ending welfare/government funded loop.

Both of you have provided valuable insight from the inside. Thanks for contributing in a helpful and intelligent manner.