NC State Club Hockey "Icepack" 2019-2020

7,157 Views | 54 Replies | Last: 3 yr ago by Wolfer79
GuerrillaPack
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PackDaddy said:

Some might think this is a dumb question but I am ignorant on this subject. Why can't we have a real ice hockey team? Is it funding? Would we then have to add a woman's sport also?
Wolfer79 provided good info as to the feasibility. A few months ago, the Technician published an article making the case for men's ice hockey becoming a varsity sport.

As mentioned by Wolfer, there are only 60 universities that have a D1 men's hockey team. Even though NC State's team is a club team, it is D2, and plays in a real league, the Atlantic Coast Collegiate Hockey League (ACCHL) - which includes UNC, Virginia, Virginia Tech, West Virginia, Duke, and Wake Forest. There are virtually zero D1 hockey teams in the southeastern United States. So D2 hockey is the highest level of collegiate hockey in this area.

And the guys at NC State play at a high level. I'm no hockey expert, but I suspect several of their guys could play at D1 -- and especially if there were as many D1 programs as there are in football, basketball, or baseball.

And even though it's D2, NC State's hockey team is growing and on the verge of the "big time" in terms of fan support and following. For instance, they've been playing games against UNC in the PNC arena 2 or 3 times per season for the last 3 or 4 years, and those games always draw at least 4,000-5,000 people.
"Ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you." - John 15:19
PackDaddy
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Thank you Wolfer. In your opinion, will we ever be able to have an official team here at State?
PackDaddy
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Thanks Guerrilla! I'll check that article out
Wolfer79
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PackDaddy said:

Thank you Wolfer. In your opinion, will we ever be able to have an official team here at State?


No
Club team only, which is an official team. The process to be approved as an NC State organization is tough and is renewed every academic year.
Wolfer79
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I forgot where I saw it this week, but it would be nice to have game vs unc-ch either the day before or the day after the outdoor game at Carter-Finley on February 20, 2021.
GuerrillaPack
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On a related note, a group of female students this year formed a women's NC State ice hockey club. I think there may have been a women's club ice hockey team many years ago, but it was disbanded at some point. Prior to this year, there were no female ice hockey teams in the ACCHL.

It took about a year of organizing and getting it together, but the NC State women's hockey team played their first game this past Saturday in Winston-Salem, at the same venue where the men's tournament was taking place. Many of the girls on the team had never played a hockey game before. They played George Washington, currently the only other women's team in the ACCHL, that apparently also started their team this year.

The ACCHL commissioner announced at the tournament that there would be a few other women's teams joining the ACCHL next season, including West Virginia and Liberty.






Their Twitter: https://twitter.com/NCStateWHockey

Their GoFundMe: https://www.gofundme.com/f/nc-state-women039s-hockey?rcid=r01-156950265244-1a1d762c6ce247fd&pc=ot_co
"Ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you." - John 15:19
Icepack1
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There is some good discussion here, but I wanted to clarify a couple of points, as well as offer my own thoughts on some of these topics.

First of all, it's important to note the difference between NCAA (varsity) and American Collegiate Hockey Association [ACHA] (non-varsity [or club]). I'm sure everyone here understands that the Icepack are not a varsity team, but I think less well understood is the fact that both the NCAA and ACHA have 3 divisions (for the men's game). So when we talk about the Pack being a division 2 team, that's within the ACHA. So there's still a very significant gap between where we are and moving to the NCAA division 1 level in just about every area (skill level, facilities, fan interest, funding, etc.). Within the ACHA, the separation of the divisions is largely based on how much funding a program can commit (mostly for travel costs). Thus, geography is a huge factor. East of the Mississippi, there's is only 1 ACHA D2 team south of NC, and that's Florida Gulf Coast (4 national titles since 2012). Liberty is the only other real powerhouse D2 program south of DC. They also have ACHA D1 and D3 teams and are exceptionally well funded. All ACC schools in SC, GA, and FL, as well as any SEC schools that have a hockey program, all play at the ACHA D3 level, because travel is the limiting factor. The best teams in ACHA D1 still tend to be better than anyone in the lower divisions, but there are plenty of bad teams in D1 that the Pack would have no trouble beating. Most of those teams are in the northeast where the travel is easier, with some exceptions.

While the Icepack have gotten to a point where they can compete for national titles at the ACHA D2 level, they do not have any players that could make an NCAA D1 roster, with the possible exception of Chris Solomon. A lot of our players have played in Juniors, and end up being too small or too slow to make it to a higher level, or they get hurt. So they usually end up with a choice to get a possible scholarship to an NCAA D3 program up north, or stay home and get a really good degree and play for a club team. Either way, they're almost certainly not going pro. Our success over the last couple seasons is a result of the fact that the talented kids in the Raleigh area are now choosing the latter over the former. If we can get back to Nationals this year and continue to do so going forward, we should continue to see an influx of talented local players who are very good, but not quite good enough for the next level. It will also continue to make us a more attractive scheduling option, and teams will be more willing to travel here. This is a huge positive, since none of the other teams in NC are anywhere close to our level. Wake Forest is the closest, but they have zero players from NC on their roster, and that's not likely to change because they're a private school. It's much harder to rely on consistent talent when it's not going to be in your backyard (applies to any sport obviously).

Usually after we play UNC at PNC or win the ACCHL title, we start to the same question pop up: "why can't we get an NCAA team?" Well, the overall answer is simple: money. That's well understood. The best comparison for a blueprint to get from club to varsity is Arizona State, which has already been mentioned in this thread. Yes, they got 32M in private donations, something we're extremely unlikely to find around here, but a lot had to happen before that. They've been playing ACHA hockey since the 1980s, and eventually got to the D1 level in 1993. From then until going varsity in 2015, they went to ACHA Nationals 12 times and finally won their first national title in 2014. To compare, look at the season the Icepack had at the D2 level last year - 28-2, absolutely destroyed most opponents, won league title, 2nd ever trip to regionals, 1st ever trip to nationals. Arizona State had that kind of season at the ACHA D1 level every year for 2+ decades and made nationals about half the time. It took that kind of success (and winning the whole thing probably got them over the edge) to finally draw out the kind of funding it took to get to the varsity level. The Pack can draw 5k+ to PNC for a game against UNC twice a year, but they draw 500 on a good night at the Iceplex for the rest of the home games. To be fair, fan interest is leagues beyond where it was 10 years ago, and that's a credit to those who have jumped on board.

There's a ton of upside to this program right now. My understanding is that they'll be moving to the Canes' new practice facility in Morrisville next season and will have their own locker room space. The Icepack rebrand and new logo finally allows the team to sell merchandise to fans, which will only continue to drive up fan interest. They were able to raise over $30k for last year's trip to nationals, but it's going to be tough to do that every year. Hence, the team is looking into business/corporate sponsorships for next season. This program is doing all the right things and the fans are buying in. It just isn't anywhere near enough to make a jump to varsity viable any time soon. If it were something the team or university wanted to pursue (and I don't believe it is), I'd say we're at least 15 years out, and that's being generous. It's just not a dicussion we can realistically have without more sustained success. If the Pack go to nationals 6-7 times in the next decade and win a title, then we can talk.

So my answer to the NCAA question is always another question: "Why?" The reality is that the Icepack have built a winning culture that the players and fans can enjoy without all the red tape of being overseen by the athletics department. It doesn't need to be attached to the NCAA to be great. I personally think it's better off as it is. You can go watch some good hockey for $5, and if you can't make it, most of the games are available to watch online. So my suggestion is to just enjoy this program as it is and root for its continued success.
Icepack1
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Sorry for the long first post above.

Wolfer, this may be the article you were referring to: https://www.underreview.org/hurricanes-receive-2021-stadium-series-game.php

My understanding is that next year's ACCHL Tournament will be the same weekend as the stadium series game, so Pack vs. UNC at CF the day before or after would not be an option.

That said, I know there's been plenty of chatter about the possibility for this game and the Canes have always been very supportive of the Icepack. My guess would be if they could make the game happen, it would be sometime during the week leading up to the Canes game, depending on when they get the ice surface set up. It would almost certainly be an exhibition and not count towards either team's official record for ACHA purposes. But it would be tons of fun and would draw a lot of fan interest for sure. So I definitely hope it can happen one way or another.
Wolfer79
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Icepack1
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Regionals get underway today in Lawrenceville, NJ. The Icepack are the #4 seed and will play on Saturday at 2pm against the 2nd lowest remaining seed after today's games (see schedule below). If Wake wins their game, the Pack will get the Deacons for the 4th time this season. Otherwise, we get the winner of Rider/Delaware. Either way, the Pack are 13-1 against those 3 teams in the last 3 seasons, so there's plenty of recent familiarity (and success).

Top 2 seeds in each region get an autobid to Nationals. The 2 winners on Sunday will join them in Frisco, TX.

All games can be watched through the College of New Jersey stream, Lions Hockey Live.

Schedule:

(All Times EST)

National Autobids
#1-Liberty University
#2-Florida Gulf Coast University

Friday, February 28
4:30pm: #10 Rider University vs. #11 University of Delaware
7:30pm: #9 Wake Forest University vs. #12 The College of New Jersey

Saturday, February 29
11am: #3 University of Cincinnati vs. lowest remaining seed
2pm: #4 North Carolina State University vs. 2nd lowest remaining seed
5pm: #5 Rowan University vs. #8 Ohio State University
8pm: #6 Penn State University vs. #7 Miami University

Sunday, March 1
12pm: 2nd highest seed vs. 2nd lowest remaining seed
3pm: Highest remaining seed vs. lowest remaining seed
Icepack1
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Very focused week of practice. Everyone is healthy for the first time in a while. Jadallah is back from concussion (2/8 at Charlotte, missed ACCHL Tournament). Pederson's shoulder has healed up. Johnson and Todd were both sick during ACCHL Tournament. Team wants to prove they can compete at Nationals after a rough outing last year.
GuerrillaPack
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Icepack1 said:

Very focused week of practice. Everyone is healthy for the first time in a while. Jadallah is back from concussion (2/8 at Charlotte, missed ACCHL Tournament). Pederson's shoulder has healed up. Johnson and Todd were both sick during ACCHL Tournament. Team wants to prove they can compete at Nationals after a rough outing last year.


Thanks for the updates. I've been following the team fairly closely this year...but it seemed Pederson came out of nowhere, and played very well. I don't recall him playing early in the season. Was he a mid-season addition to the team?
"Ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you." - John 15:19
GuerrillaPack
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Good interviews of players on their thoughts on the team and season going into regionals:

Icepack1
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Colby Pederson and Griffin Hunt were both 2nd semester additions.

Pederson prospect profile
Hunt prospect profile

Pederson was a big addition on offense. We were able to plug him in at center and get immediate results. Hunt gives us the true number 1 goaltender that we've really been missing up until this point. He'll continue to split time with Cannon the rest of this season, but he'll be the guy in net for us the next few years.

We also got Miles Ferrone back on D after he spent the fall semester in Virginia doing a co-op. He was able to stay in shape playing in adult leagues there, and he's been a huge boost to the defense, which really struggled in the fall.

It really was a "rich get richer" situation for us. This team is absolutely loaded, and keep in mind that most of our best players are underclassmen.

If I had to guess, our lineup going forward should look something like this

Miller-Robinson-Johnson
Szarek-Solomon-Todd
Anistratov-Pederson-Jadallah
Auriene-Kinney-Davidson

Mazikowski-Ferrone
O'Rourke-Halko
Hugo-Frosch

Those first 3 lines are absolutely lethal. 4th line is more fluid with personnel but still has tons of speed as is. Might rotate Fong in at some point; he played well in Winston-Salem. Defense is also fluid; we've had a ton of combinations work for us there. Think everyone but Frosch stays in the lineup; could rotate Seppey or Katz in, but still think Frosch is the best option for 6th D. Really just need to make sure we avoid having our 4th line and 3rd pairing on the ice together and we should be fine.
GuerrillaPack
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Thanks for the reply. Excellent information. I've just started following hockey in the last 2-3 years (mainly just IcePack games), and I'm still lacking in knowledge of some of the basics of strategy, recognition of talent, many of the rules, etc. Very glad to hear about the strength of the program going forward and the addition of more young talented players.
"Ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you." - John 15:19
Icepack1
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Info for today's game against Wake Forest.


1985 NCSU Grad
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To clarify something said above - D3 athletics DO NOT offer Athletic scholarships. They will assist - just like NC State helps students - in getting you academic and need scholarships, loans and other various based scholarships. So what you have to decide is do you want to play in NCAA sanctioned sports or on a club team because the only difference is the things you get from the athletic department like shoes, bags, clothing, etc.
Wolfer79
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Wolfer79
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Icepack1 said:

There is some good discussion here, but I wanted to clarify a couple of points, as well as offer my own thoughts on some of these topics.

First of all, it's important to note the difference between NCAA (varsity) and American Collegiate Hockey Association [ACHA] (non-varsity [or club]). I'm sure everyone here understands that the Icepack are not a varsity team, but I think less well understood is the fact that both the NCAA and ACHA have 3 divisions (for the men's game). So when we talk about the Pack being a division 2 team, that's within the ACHA. So there's still a very significant gap between where we are and moving to the NCAA division 1 level in just about every area (skill level, facilities, fan interest, funding, etc.). Within the ACHA, the separation of the divisions is largely based on how much funding a program can commit (mostly for travel costs). Thus, geography is a huge factor. East of the Mississippi, there's is only 1 ACHA D2 team south of NC, and that's Florida Gulf Coast (4 national titles since 2012). Liberty is the only other real powerhouse D2 program south of DC. They also have ACHA D1 and D3 teams and are exceptionally well funded. All ACC schools in SC, GA, and FL, as well as any SEC schools that have a hockey program, all play at the ACHA D3 level, because travel is the limiting factor. The best teams in ACHA D1 still tend to be better than anyone in the lower divisions, but there are plenty of bad teams in D1 that the Pack would have no trouble beating. Most of those teams are in the northeast where the travel is easier, with some exceptions.

While the Icepack have gotten to a point where they can compete for national titles at the ACHA D2 level, they do not have any players that could make an NCAA D1 roster, with the possible exception of Chris Solomon. A lot of our players have played in Juniors, and end up being too small or too slow to make it to a higher level, or they get hurt. So they usually end up with a choice to get a possible scholarship to an NCAA D3 program up north, or stay home and get a really good degree and play for a club team. Either way, they're almost certainly not going pro. Our success over the last couple seasons is a result of the fact that the talented kids in the Raleigh area are now choosing the latter over the former. If we can get back to Nationals this year and continue to do so going forward, we should continue to see an influx of talented local players who are very good, but not quite good enough for the next level. It will also continue to make us a more attractive scheduling option, and teams will be more willing to travel here. This is a huge positive, since none of the other teams in NC are anywhere close to our level. Wake Forest is the closest, but they have zero players from NC on their roster, and that's not likely to change because they're a private school. It's much harder to rely on consistent talent when it's not going to be in your backyard (applies to any sport obviously).

Usually after we play UNC at PNC or win the ACCHL title, we start to the same question pop up: "why can't we get an NCAA team?" Well, the overall answer is simple: money. That's well understood. The best comparison for a blueprint to get from club to varsity is Arizona State, which has already been mentioned in this thread. Yes, they got 32M in private donations, something we're extremely unlikely to find around here, but a lot had to happen before that. They've been playing ACHA hockey since the 1980s, and eventually got to the D1 level in 1993. From then until going varsity in 2015, they went to ACHA Nationals 12 times and finally won their first national title in 2014. To compare, look at the season the Icepack had at the D2 level last year - 28-2, absolutely destroyed most opponents, won league title, 2nd ever trip to regionals, 1st ever trip to nationals. Arizona State had that kind of season at the ACHA D1 level every year for 2+ decades and made nationals about half the time. It took that kind of success (and winning the whole thing probably got them over the edge) to finally draw out the kind of funding it took to get to the varsity level. The Pack can draw 5k+ to PNC for a game against UNC twice a year, but they draw 500 on a good night at the Iceplex for the rest of the home games. To be fair, fan interest is leagues beyond where it was 10 years ago, and that's a credit to those who have jumped on board.

There's a ton of upside to this program right now. My understanding is that they'll be moving to the Canes' new practice facility in Morrisville next season and will have their own locker room space. The Icepack rebrand and new logo finally allows the team to sell merchandise to fans, which will only continue to drive up fan interest. They were able to raise over $30k for last year's trip to nationals, but it's going to be tough to do that every year. Hence, the team is looking into business/corporate sponsorships for next season. This program is doing all the right things and the fans are buying in. It just isn't anywhere near enough to make a jump to varsity viable any time soon. If it were something the team or university wanted to pursue (and I don't believe it is), I'd say we're at least 15 years out, and that's being generous. It's just not a dicussion we can realistically have without more sustained success. If the Pack go to nationals 6-7 times in the next decade and win a title, then we can talk.

So my answer to the NCAA question is always another question: "Why?" The reality is that the Icepack have built a winning culture that the players and fans can enjoy without all the red tape of being overseen by the athletics department. It doesn't need to be attached to the NCAA to be great. I personally think it's better off as it is. You can go watch some good hockey for $5, and if you can't make it, most of the games are available to watch online. So my suggestion is to just enjoy this program as it is and root for its continued success.


Wolfer79
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Wolfer79 said:

Icepack1 said:

There is some good discussion here, but I wanted to clarify a couple of points, as well as offer my own thoughts on some of these topics.

First of all, it's important to note the difference between NCAA (varsity) and American Collegiate Hockey Association [ACHA] (non-varsity [or club]). I'm sure everyone here understands that the Icepack are not a varsity team, but I think less well understood is the fact that both the NCAA and ACHA have 3 divisions (for the men's game). So when we talk about the Pack being a division 2 team, that's within the ACHA. So there's still a very significant gap between where we are and moving to the NCAA division 1 level in just about every area (skill level, facilities, fan interest, funding, etc.). Within the ACHA, the separation of the divisions is largely based on how much funding a program can commit (mostly for travel costs). Thus, geography is a huge factor. East of the Mississippi, there's is only 1 ACHA D2 team south of NC, and that's Florida Gulf Coast (4 national titles since 2012). Liberty is the only other real powerhouse D2 program south of DC. They also have ACHA D1 and D3 teams and are exceptionally well funded. All ACC schools in SC, GA, and FL, as well as any SEC schools that have a hockey program, all play at the ACHA D3 level, because travel is the limiting factor. The best teams in ACHA D1 still tend to be better than anyone in the lower divisions, but there are plenty of bad teams in D1 that the Pack would have no trouble beating. Most of those teams are in the northeast where the travel is easier, with some exceptions.

While the Icepack have gotten to a point where they can compete for national titles at the ACHA D2 level, they do not have any players that could make an NCAA D1 roster, with the possible exception of Chris Solomon. A lot of our players have played in Juniors, and end up being too small or too slow to make it to a higher level, or they get hurt. So they usually end up with a choice to get a possible scholarship to an NCAA D3 program up north, or stay home and get a really good degree and play for a club team. Either way, they're almost certainly not going pro. Our success over the last couple seasons is a result of the fact that the talented kids in the Raleigh area are now choosing the latter over the former. If we can get back to Nationals this year and continue to do so going forward, we should continue to see an influx of talented local players who are very good, but not quite good enough for the next level. It will also continue to make us a more attractive scheduling option, and teams will be more willing to travel here. This is a huge positive, since none of the other teams in NC are anywhere close to our level. Wake Forest is the closest, but they have zero players from NC on their roster, and that's not likely to change because they're a private school. It's much harder to rely on consistent talent when it's not going to be in your backyard (applies to any sport obviously).

Usually after we play UNC at PNC or win the ACCHL title, we start to the same question pop up: "why can't we get an NCAA team?" Well, the overall answer is simple: money. That's well understood. The best comparison for a blueprint to get from club to varsity is Arizona State, which has already been mentioned in this thread. Yes, they got 32M in private donations, something we're extremely unlikely to find around here, but a lot had to happen before that. They've been playing ACHA hockey since the 1980s, and eventually got to the D1 level in 1993. From then until going varsity in 2015, they went to ACHA Nationals 12 times and finally won their first national title in 2014. To compare, look at the season the Icepack had at the D2 level last year - 28-2, absolutely destroyed most opponents, won league title, 2nd ever trip to regionals, 1st ever trip to nationals. Arizona State had that kind of season at the ACHA D1 level every year for 2+ decades and made nationals about half the time. It took that kind of success (and winning the whole thing probably got them over the edge) to finally draw out the kind of funding it took to get to the varsity level. The Pack can draw 5k+ to PNC for a game against UNC twice a year, but they draw 500 on a good night at the Iceplex for the rest of the home games. To be fair, fan interest is leagues beyond where it was 10 years ago, and that's a credit to those who have jumped on board.

There's a ton of upside to this program right now. My understanding is that they'll be moving to the Canes' new practice facility in Morrisville next season and will have their own locker room space. The Icepack rebrand and new logo finally allows the team to sell merchandise to fans, which will only continue to drive up fan interest. They were able to raise over $30k for last year's trip to nationals, but it's going to be tough to do that every year. Hence, the team is looking into business/corporate sponsorships for next season. This program is doing all the right things and the fans are buying in. It just isn't anywhere near enough to make a jump to varsity viable any time soon. If it were something the team or university wanted to pursue (and I don't believe it is), I'd say we're at least 15 years out, and that's being generous. It's just not a dicussion we can realistically have without more sustained success. If the Pack go to nationals 6-7 times in the next decade and win a title, then we can talk.

So my answer to the NCAA question is always another question: "Why?" The reality is that the Icepack have built a winning culture that the players and fans can enjoy without all the red tape of being overseen by the athletics department. It doesn't need to be attached to the NCAA to be great. I personally think it's better off as it is. You can go watch some good hockey for $5, and if you can't make it, most of the games are available to watch online. So my suggestion is to just enjoy this program as it is and root for its continued success.





Alright everyone, THIS IS IT!! A deal has been worked out with @UAH_President that if the community can raise $1M by Friday 5/29, the UAH Hockey program will be REINSTATED!!

All amounts welcome, anything you can spare!! #UnitedWeCharge #SaveUAHHockey https://t.co/VozPNPGoqO
Wolfer79
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